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Plus according to Jonathan Haidt in Happiness Hypothesis, commuting, noise and lack of control are among the most significant things that make people unhappy. A

Plus according to Jonathan Haidt in Happiness Hypothesis, commuting, noise and lack of control are among the most significant things that make people unhappy. All of them are manageable at home. And also these are rarely taken into the discussion.

throwaway8456 2y ago
If you are going to quote Jonathan Haidt, I suggest you take a look at his latest book, the Anxious Generation published in 2024. My reading is that reducing face time is definitely NOT a positive factor for happiness.
- FredPret 2y ago
  Then let’s have clubs and hobbies and so on again
  - MenhirMike 2y ago
    Third Places really took a hit in the pandemic :( But yes, as someone who re-discovered them last year, I absolutely agree.
- mensetmanusman 2y ago
  Replace work FaceTime with a third place FaceTime.
- MeImCounting 2y ago
  Your primary source of face time should not be coming from your work.
  - basisword 2y ago
    Work is half of your waking day 5 days out of 7 - it’s probably your primary source of face time whether you like it or not. You might have more valuable face time elsewhere (family, friends, hobbies) but those 40-50 hours should probably be taken more seriously than they are.
    - askonomm 2y ago
      I'd love to take work a lot _less_ seriously, tbh. I don't live to work, after all.
- dogman144 2y ago
  If you’re going to imply the office saves that, worth noting there’s a lot of non-forced organic face time from wfh available from your neighborhoods and communities, and that “Anxious Generation” screen time probably refers to teens and adults piping their lives into a phone, and not the important tradeoffs of staring at a screen in an office park or starting at a screen in your home. Constantly the office is treated as the only existing socialization source and it really makes me wonder what people’s lives at home are out of work.
- briffid 2y ago
  That's a good point. Eliminating commute let me play with my children after school. Even started to have a pizza together for lunch. Started to have lunch almost every day with my wife, instead of my colleagues or looking at our phones in the canteen.
- Aurornis 2y ago
  > My reading is that reducing face time is definitely NOT a positive factor for happiness. This is an extremely common problem for juniors in the mentoring program where I volunteer: They graduate college, take remote jobs, and then slide into depression while working from home. It takes a while to work with them to get to the bottom of their issues, but often they'll realize that they're much happier in the weeks following company on-site meetings, then they slowly decline again. Remote work doesn't work for everyone. Many people struggle in remote environments, especially juniors. The way remote work gets pushed as being perfect for everyone can be very confusing for people who discover that they don't like it. It's even harder because the internet tends to be very hostile to these people rather than supportive. The correct answer, obviously, is that some people do better at different types of jobs. Yet every time this comes up, people come out and try to criticize the person, blame it on their lack of hobbies, blame it on something else, and refuse to allow that some people need face-to-face coworkers to thrive. It's a real phenomenon that gets downplayed on the internet.
  - askonomm 2y ago
    These people should maybe go to co-working places then. Can still work without the butts-in-seats managers over looking every move you make while also getting the social aspect.
    - saulpw 2y ago
      I don't want to work next to random people. I want to work with my co-workers. I don't want to have to come in every day for no good reason. I want to be able to come in to a shared space with my coworkers and have a productive day with them. Trying to bring a group of people into a coworking space doesn't work if there are more than 2 people.
      - askonomm 2y ago
        Yeah but you can't force people who don't want to come to the office to come there just because you prefer it that way. And in any case, I'm sure there would be more than just 1 person who'd prefer a social aspect / whose home life prevents them from being productive at home, in which case you could most likely band together into the same co-working, no? Most co-workings I know also rent out entire rooms for companies, not just individual desks. Unless we're talking remote and international, in which case that obviously wouldn't work, but I assume you wouldn't apply to those jobs anyway. That way you can get your office and some coworkers, and others can do what is best for them, and the company doesn't have to lease a huge office space. Win-win-win?
saulpw 2y ago
There's a lot more noise from leafblowers and construction that penetrates my noise cancelling headphones at home, than I have ever experienced in an office. There is more in-office noise, yes, but that seems to be better managed by aforementioned headphones.
- hun3 2y ago
  (FYI: A noise-cancelling headphone works best for hums and other "repeating" noise; construction noise is much less predictable for the headphone to get ahead)

throwaway8456 2y ago

If you are going to quote Jonathan Haidt, I suggest you take a look at his latest book, the Anxious Generation published in 2024. My reading is that reducing face time is definitely NOT a positive factor for happiness.

FredPret 2y ago
Then let’s have clubs and hobbies and so on again
- MenhirMike 2y ago
  Third Places really took a hit in the pandemic :( But yes, as someone who re-discovered them last year, I absolutely agree.
mensetmanusman 2y ago
Replace work FaceTime with a third place FaceTime.
MeImCounting 2y ago
Your primary source of face time should not be coming from your work.
- basisword 2y ago
  Work is half of your waking day 5 days out of 7 - it’s probably your primary source of face time whether you like it or not. You might have more valuable face time elsewhere (family, friends, hobbies) but those 40-50 hours should probably be taken more seriously than they are.
  - askonomm 2y ago
    I'd love to take work a lot _less_ seriously, tbh. I don't live to work, after all.
dogman144 2y ago
If you’re going to imply the office saves that, worth noting there’s a lot of non-forced organic face time from wfh available from your neighborhoods and communities, and that “Anxious Generation” screen time probably refers to teens and adults piping their lives into a phone, and not the important tradeoffs of staring at a screen in an office park or starting at a screen in your home. Constantly the office is treated as the only existing socialization source and it really makes me wonder what people’s lives at home are out of work.
briffid 2y ago
That's a good point. Eliminating commute let me play with my children after school. Even started to have a pizza together for lunch. Started to have lunch almost every day with my wife, instead of my colleagues or looking at our phones in the canteen.
Aurornis 2y ago
> My reading is that reducing face time is definitely NOT a positive factor for happiness. This is an extremely common problem for juniors in the mentoring program where I volunteer: They graduate college, take remote jobs, and then slide into depression while working from home. It takes a while to work with them to get to the bottom of their issues, but often they'll realize that they're much happier in the weeks following company on-site meetings, then they slowly decline again. Remote work doesn't work for everyone. Many people struggle in remote environments, especially juniors. The way remote work gets pushed as being perfect for everyone can be very confusing for people who discover that they don't like it. It's even harder because the internet tends to be very hostile to these people rather than supportive. The correct answer, obviously, is that some people do better at different types of jobs. Yet every time this comes up, people come out and try to criticize the person, blame it on their lack of hobbies, blame it on something else, and refuse to allow that some people need face-to-face coworkers to thrive. It's a real phenomenon that gets downplayed on the internet.
- askonomm 2y ago
  These people should maybe go to co-working places then. Can still work without the butts-in-seats managers over looking every move you make while also getting the social aspect.
  - saulpw 2y ago
    I don't want to work next to random people. I want to work with my co-workers. I don't want to have to come in every day for no good reason. I want to be able to come in to a shared space with my coworkers and have a productive day with them. Trying to bring a group of people into a coworking space doesn't work if there are more than 2 people.
    - askonomm 2y ago
      Yeah but you can't force people who don't want to come to the office to come there just because you prefer it that way. And in any case, I'm sure there would be more than just 1 person who'd prefer a social aspect / whose home life prevents them from being productive at home, in which case you could most likely band together into the same co-working, no? Most co-workings I know also rent out entire rooms for companies, not just individual desks. Unless we're talking remote and international, in which case that obviously wouldn't work, but I assume you wouldn't apply to those jobs anyway. That way you can get your office and some coworkers, and others can do what is best for them, and the company doesn't have to lease a huge office space. Win-win-win?

saulpw 2y ago

There's a lot more noise from leafblowers and construction that penetrates my noise cancelling headphones at home, than I have ever experienced in an office. There is more in-office noise, yes, but that seems to be better managed by aforementioned headphones.

hun3 2y ago
(FYI: A noise-cancelling headphone works best for hums and other "repeating" noise; construction noise is much less predictable for the headphone to get ahead)