4 ms·

I'm pretty sure the point of recycling to make people feel like they are doing something about plastic pollution, and this feeling distracts people from the fac

I'm pretty sure the point of recycling to make people feel like they are doing something about plastic pollution, and this feeling distracts people from the fact that nothing you do with plastic actually makes a difference. Perception is 9/10s of the law.

mariusor 2y ago
> nothing you do with plastic actually makes a difference ... yet. Do you think that in a wonderful future where we get some technical advancement to be able to deal with plastics effectively, will it be easier to deal with it when it's uniformly spread through the world's landfills, or when it's sorted and dumped in bulk?
- samatman 2y ago
  This is why I continue to dutifully rinse out plastics and throw them into the landfill via the separate 'recycling' process. I'd rather it go to the special plastic landfill, where, like cryogenically-frozen Effective Altruists, future generations can give it a new life with yet-undiscovered technology.
  - mariusor 2y ago
    I'm not sure if you're being sarcastic, but yes, that's exactly what I'm doing too.
    - c-linkage 2y ago
      I, too, will keep using the separate stream, more out of habit than anything else. But the plastic doesn't currently go into a special landfill, it goes into the same ones as all of the other trash. <https://www.nytimes.com/2024/06/17/climate/ask-nyt-climate-recycling.html https://www.nytimes.com/2024/06/17/climate/ask-nyt-climate-r...> [I]f the [recycling] plant can find a buyer at a price that makes sense, the bundles will be shipped off to a recycling plant. Sometimes a local one, and sometimes one as far away as Africa or Southeast Asia. If they can’t, everything goes into a landfill or gets incinerated. And even though my original comment is at zero, the industry specifically pushed recycling because by making people feel like they were helping, they would ignore the real problem. <https://www.npr.org/2020/09/11/897692090/how-big-oil-misled-the-public-into-believing-plastic-would-be-recycled https://www.npr.org/2020/09/11/897692090/how-big-oil-misled-...> Yet the industry spent millions telling people to recycle, because, as one former top industry insider told NPR, selling recycling sold plastic, even if it wasn't true. "If the public thinks that recycling is working, then they are not going to be as concerned about the environment," Larry Thomas, former president of the Society of the Plastics Industry, known today as the Plastics Industry Association and one of the industry's most powerful trade groups in Washington, D.C., told NPR." Burying the plastic is probably the better option. <https://www.ft.com/content/901c78e6-b4d0-467c-ab87-6fc44c8a004c https://www.ft.com/content/901c78e6-b4d0-467c-ab87-6fc44c8a0...> “The energy required to do reprocessing is higher than the energy required to make the [plastic] in the first place,” he said. To limit carbon emissions in line with the global warming goals of the Paris climate accord, it would be better to “bury the stuff”, according to Hallett.
      - mariusor 2y ago
        Sure, but if a truck that picked up sorted plastic arrives at the landfill, it's going to be dumped all in one place. If at any time in the future we devise a way to efficiently get rid of it, it's easier to remove it from one single place, than having to sift through tonnes of unsorted trash. I frankly think that an enterprise that can build robots able to sort landfills would make mint.
- SoftTalker 2y ago
  If and when that future arrives, we will have plenty of plastic waste to deal with, without digging up that which is buried. Buried plastic is largely inert. It is one of the least nasty things that is in a landfill.

mariusor 2y ago

> nothing you do with plastic actually makes a difference ... yet. Do you think that in a wonderful future where we get some technical advancement to be able to deal with plastics effectively, will it be easier to deal with it when it's uniformly spread through the world's landfills, or when it's sorted and dumped in bulk?

samatman 2y ago
This is why I continue to dutifully rinse out plastics and throw them into the landfill via the separate 'recycling' process. I'd rather it go to the special plastic landfill, where, like cryogenically-frozen Effective Altruists, future generations can give it a new life with yet-undiscovered technology.
- mariusor 2y ago
  I'm not sure if you're being sarcastic, but yes, that's exactly what I'm doing too.
  - c-linkage 2y ago
    I, too, will keep using the separate stream, more out of habit than anything else. But the plastic doesn't currently go into a special landfill, it goes into the same ones as all of the other trash. <https://www.nytimes.com/2024/06/17/climate/ask-nyt-climate-recycling.html https://www.nytimes.com/2024/06/17/climate/ask-nyt-climate-r...> [I]f the [recycling] plant can find a buyer at a price that makes sense, the bundles will be shipped off to a recycling plant. Sometimes a local one, and sometimes one as far away as Africa or Southeast Asia. If they can’t, everything goes into a landfill or gets incinerated. And even though my original comment is at zero, the industry specifically pushed recycling because by making people feel like they were helping, they would ignore the real problem. <https://www.npr.org/2020/09/11/897692090/how-big-oil-misled-the-public-into-believing-plastic-would-be-recycled https://www.npr.org/2020/09/11/897692090/how-big-oil-misled-...> Yet the industry spent millions telling people to recycle, because, as one former top industry insider told NPR, selling recycling sold plastic, even if it wasn't true. "If the public thinks that recycling is working, then they are not going to be as concerned about the environment," Larry Thomas, former president of the Society of the Plastics Industry, known today as the Plastics Industry Association and one of the industry's most powerful trade groups in Washington, D.C., told NPR." Burying the plastic is probably the better option. <https://www.ft.com/content/901c78e6-b4d0-467c-ab87-6fc44c8a004c https://www.ft.com/content/901c78e6-b4d0-467c-ab87-6fc44c8a0...> “The energy required to do reprocessing is higher than the energy required to make the [plastic] in the first place,” he said. To limit carbon emissions in line with the global warming goals of the Paris climate accord, it would be better to “bury the stuff”, according to Hallett.
    - mariusor 2y ago
      Sure, but if a truck that picked up sorted plastic arrives at the landfill, it's going to be dumped all in one place. If at any time in the future we devise a way to efficiently get rid of it, it's easier to remove it from one single place, than having to sift through tonnes of unsorted trash. I frankly think that an enterprise that can build robots able to sort landfills would make mint.
SoftTalker 2y ago
If and when that future arrives, we will have plenty of plastic waste to deal with, without digging up that which is buried. Buried plastic is largely inert. It is one of the least nasty things that is in a landfill.