4 ms·

Self employed since 2011. In Italy. I know how this world works. If you get 2 to 4K a month you can easily live an absolutely normal life or even above average.

Suppafly 2y ago
I suppose it depends on how you are defining normal. Does that mean owning a home and vehicle and supporting a wife and kids, or does that mean sharing an apartment with multiple people and using public transport and not having any savings? I get that the cost of living is lower in Italy, but different people have different ideas about what constitutes comfortable. Just from googling, the 2k seems like it'd be a bit of a struggle but the 4k seems like it'd be pretty nice.
- manuelmoreale 2y ago
  2k/mo pre taxes as a self employed would allow you to live a normal life meaning you’d not struggle to get through the month. 4k/mo would allow you to easily buy a house and live an above average life. This is obviously true for most of the country and it’s different if you want to live in one of the big cities but that goes without saying.
  - kazinator 2y ago
    If you happen to be supporting a four-member family on that 2K, it's barely above the poverty line. Even when you're young and single, it behooves you to think about retirement; it's sooner than you think. You need a safety net in case something happens, leaving you unable to work for a long time. If you support a family, you have to think about things like education funds for the kids, and what happens if you suddenly die.
    - manuelmoreale 2y ago
      Agree on the family but if 2 people are working (which is normal) with two 2k salaries you’re doing just fine. Retirement is provided by the state here so it’s not something I have to plan for. Again, just to reiterate, the original post was using 2k/mo as the absolute minimum and the point I was trying to make is that a few Ks a month is a reasonable living in way more places that people realize. But I suspect a non negligible % of people here on HN have a distorted view of the world and how much living cost.
      - newaccount74 2y ago
        In Austria, 2k/mo before taxes is roughly what you earn as a part-time employee filling shelves at the supermarket [1]. [1]: Typical supermarket job in Austria: https://jobs.aldi-hofer.com/hofer-karriere-at/job/Linz-BACKBOX-&-Regalbetreuer-%28mwd%29-Spittelwiese-6%2C-4020-Linz-Ober-4020/719967001/?feedId=245101 https://jobs.aldi-hofer.com/hofer-karriere-at/job/Linz-BACKB... The advertised salary for 21 hours/week of 1330€ is paid 14 times per year and comes to a total income of ~15.7k€ after taxes. If you make 24k€ a year as a self-employed person, you will have to pay ~400€ taxes + 6.5k€ pension + health insurance leaving a total of ~17k€ after taxes.

Suppafly 2y ago

I suppose it depends on how you are defining normal. Does that mean owning a home and vehicle and supporting a wife and kids, or does that mean sharing an apartment with multiple people and using public transport and not having any savings? I get that the cost of living is lower in Italy, but different people have different ideas about what constitutes comfortable. Just from googling, the 2k seems like it'd be a bit of a struggle but the 4k seems like it'd be pretty nice.

manuelmoreale 2y ago
2k/mo pre taxes as a self employed would allow you to live a normal life meaning you’d not struggle to get through the month. 4k/mo would allow you to easily buy a house and live an above average life. This is obviously true for most of the country and it’s different if you want to live in one of the big cities but that goes without saying.
- kazinator 2y ago
  If you happen to be supporting a four-member family on that 2K, it's barely above the poverty line. Even when you're young and single, it behooves you to think about retirement; it's sooner than you think. You need a safety net in case something happens, leaving you unable to work for a long time. If you support a family, you have to think about things like education funds for the kids, and what happens if you suddenly die.
  - manuelmoreale 2y ago
    Agree on the family but if 2 people are working (which is normal) with two 2k salaries you’re doing just fine. Retirement is provided by the state here so it’s not something I have to plan for. Again, just to reiterate, the original post was using 2k/mo as the absolute minimum and the point I was trying to make is that a few Ks a month is a reasonable living in way more places that people realize. But I suspect a non negligible % of people here on HN have a distorted view of the world and how much living cost.
    - newaccount74 2y ago
      In Austria, 2k/mo before taxes is roughly what you earn as a part-time employee filling shelves at the supermarket [1]. [1]: Typical supermarket job in Austria: https://jobs.aldi-hofer.com/hofer-karriere-at/job/Linz-BACKBOX-&-Regalbetreuer-%28mwd%29-Spittelwiese-6%2C-4020-Linz-Ober-4020/719967001/?feedId=245101 https://jobs.aldi-hofer.com/hofer-karriere-at/job/Linz-BACKB... The advertised salary for 21 hours/week of 1330€ is paid 14 times per year and comes to a total income of ~15.7k€ after taxes. If you make 24k€ a year as a self-employed person, you will have to pay ~400€ taxes + 6.5k€ pension + health insurance leaving a total of ~17k€ after taxes.