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If it is a pop how can Big Tech walk it back? Am I overreacting here or have companies like Google and Microsoft pimped out their reputations in an irreversible

by tmpz22 2y ago

If it is a pop how can Big Tech walk it back? Am I overreacting here or have companies like Google and Microsoft pimped out their reputations in an irreversible fashion?

pjc50 2y ago
Not like you have a choice? Reputation for those two is kind of irrelevant.
cogman10 2y ago
How did big tech walk back crypto, ML, Web 2.0? They really don't need to walk back anything. If the features are too expensive to support and ultimately unused, then they'll just quietly kill them off. Otherwise, it'll just be another feature in the feature lists. Not something that really buys anything but also not something making them a lot of money.
- dag11 2y ago
  I'm struggling to think of any mainstream big tech products that incorporated crypto at all. Besides some financial apps adding an additional tab for it.
- j16sdiz 2y ago
  Funny you put crypto on the same list with ML. (and I guess you meant Web 3.0, not 2.0)
  - cogman10 2y ago
    Nah, web 2.0 was a super hype back in the late 90s early 00s. Everyone was all about advertising their adoption and development of web 2.0. Web 3.0 was never really a thing, beyond some crypto enthusiasts nobody cared. As for crypto, I probably should have said blockchain instead. There was one point recently where everything was block chained.
    - Hasu 2y ago
      They didn't walk web 2.0 back because web 2.0 won so completely that web 1.0 sites are noted for being quaint and charming callbacks to an older era. Web 2.0 was "social web", wikis, AJAX requests, and the move towards SPAs. It's very much still the reigning paradigm.
    - danaris 2y ago
      "Everything"—but not from the big tech giants. None of the FAANG companies, to my knowledge, offered a blockchain-based product.
      - deleted 2y ago
        [deleted]
    - ben_w 2y ago
      """Web 2.0 (also known as participative (or participatory)[1] web and social web)[2] refers to websites that emphasize user-generated content, ease of use, participatory culture and interoperability (i.e., compatibility with other products, systems, and devices) for end users.""" - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Web_2.0 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Web_2.0 I don't think I need to elaborate this quotation? But if I do, note the domain I'm quoting from and the website in which you are reading this comment from me.
- gjm11 2y ago
  I don't think I understand your first sentence. Big tech wasn't invested in crypto in the way it is in AI. For a few days Meta pretended they were going to launch a cryptocurrency, but that's kinda it. Whereas in this case all the biggest tech players are making a lot of noise about how AI is The Future and investing a tremendous amount of resources into trying to make their AI be The Future. Big tech investment into machine learning didn't need walking back because machine learning morphed smoothly into AI. Big tech investment into "Web 2.0" didn't need walking back because "Web 2.0", to whatever extent it was a definite specific thing, was a huge success and now we just call it the web. (If you meant "Web 3.0", that didn't need walking back for the same reason as crypto didn't: it was never a very big thing for very big tech.) So I'm not seeing how any of those things was like AI today. If it turns out that present-day AI is a bubble and it bursts, it will not be like crypto or "Web 3.0" for the big tech companies because those were only ever fads that the big tech companies didn't particularly tie themselves to. It won't be like machine learning because it will be the same bubble, just later on. And it won't be like "Web 2.0" because that wasn't a bubble and didn't burst.
  - pjc50 2y ago
    A better example from Meta is probably the Metaverse losses: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-66913551 https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-66913551
- Theodores 2y ago
  There is a difference in zealotry. With blockchain technology there were many people prepared to die on that hill. It was going to solve world hunger albeit not the obesity epidemic. It also had all of its own lingo for not selling or buying the dip. I remember people saying how things would be replaced with blockchain technology such as ecommerce, and apps 'on the chain' would find many thousands of uses. People were quite insistent. On HN you risked getting modded down to hell and shadowbanned for life if you said anything wrongful about crypto. It was bizarre. With AI we don't have this level of zealotry. You can say it is a load of rubbish and nobody wants to kill you. Weird, but indicative that AI has found some use, even if it is for 'art' and just marketing. Nonetheless, if someone does get a bit zealous about it, I can tell them that I have all problems solved already with blockchain technology apps, just for trolling value.
ryandrake 2y ago
Everyone will walk it back like they walked back 'blockchain.' And then they'll go and find another technology to conspicuously chase. The hype cycle will repeat.
bee_rider 2y ago
Yeah, I think you are probably overreacting. Microsoft and Google already have sort of bad reputations anyway, but they haven’t actually done anything that widely hurt customers yet with this AI stuff. If it doesn’t work out, it will just be a silly R&D project from the public’s point of view. Or they’ll use it to make stuff like Cortana (or whatever they are calling it now) slightly less useless.
swatcoder 2y ago
None of the big players have staked reputation on AI yet at all, which is telling in its own way. They've invested in it and explored products and demonstrated their R&D commitment but they haven't made it their new brand identity or anything. The most vulnerable Big Tech organization are the ones like OpenAI and Anthropic that are swollen with investment specifically for AI but need to find a business or growth plan that can sustain that investment, plus the smaller and startup companies that have bet the farm on AI before it matured. But these same companies are the ones that have the potential to win big if there's another key breakthrough on either capabilities or product insight.
- halostatue 2y ago
  I’m not sure how Google and Meta placing massive AI visibility in their everyday user interfaces isn’t staking reputation.
  - SXX 2y ago
    Will Google or Meta pop if they'll just remove all of that overnight? I doubt it.
AlexandrB 2y ago
This kind of thing is not irreversible. Remember when Google tried to get everyone on Google+? A far more annoying product push than shoving AI into Google search.
lovethevoid 2y ago
One thing big tech is very good at is walking it back. Microsoft was one of the earlier big adopters of cryptocurrency, and now it’s nowhere to be found. Nobody cares because Microsoft didn’t make a big deal out of it. Because current AI is effectively being pitched as assistants 2.0, I don’t see them wiping AI from their lineup, but letting it rot is a possibility as they all have done for their v1 assistants. Due to the attention economy, most aren’t going to care within a year. Google is still a dominant company despite killing off beloved services so if they can do that, the others certainly can weather failed AI products. There might be some exceptions like Adobe, it depends on what they do. That’s my take on it anyways, in general there was just way too much pumped into AI without much thorough thought. The fact that Rabbit was even a thing people got hyped over speaks volumes to how out of touch with reality current AI pushes are.
rsynnott 2y ago
I mean, see, say, Google+, or that Facebook metaverse thing, or the various Windows Phones, or IBM's adventures in the blockchain. Companies get over-excited about the latest trend and do silly stuff all the time. People generally more or less forget.

by tmpz22 2y ago

If it is a pop how can Big Tech walk it back? Am I overreacting here or have companies like Google and Microsoft pimped out their reputations in an irreversible fashion?

pjc50 2y ago

Not like you have a choice? Reputation for those two is kind of irrelevant.

cogman10 2y ago

How did big tech walk back crypto, ML, Web 2.0? They really don't need to walk back anything. If the features are too expensive to support and ultimately unused, then they'll just quietly kill them off. Otherwise, it'll just be another feature in the feature lists. Not something that really buys anything but also not something making them a lot of money.

dag11 2y ago
I'm struggling to think of any mainstream big tech products that incorporated crypto at all. Besides some financial apps adding an additional tab for it.
j16sdiz 2y ago
Funny you put crypto on the same list with ML. (and I guess you meant Web 3.0, not 2.0)
- cogman10 2y ago
  Nah, web 2.0 was a super hype back in the late 90s early 00s. Everyone was all about advertising their adoption and development of web 2.0. Web 3.0 was never really a thing, beyond some crypto enthusiasts nobody cared. As for crypto, I probably should have said blockchain instead. There was one point recently where everything was block chained.
  - Hasu 2y ago
    They didn't walk web 2.0 back because web 2.0 won so completely that web 1.0 sites are noted for being quaint and charming callbacks to an older era. Web 2.0 was "social web", wikis, AJAX requests, and the move towards SPAs. It's very much still the reigning paradigm.
  - danaris 2y ago
    "Everything"—but not from the big tech giants. None of the FAANG companies, to my knowledge, offered a blockchain-based product.
    - deleted 2y ago
      [deleted]
  - ben_w 2y ago
    """Web 2.0 (also known as participative (or participatory)[1] web and social web)[2] refers to websites that emphasize user-generated content, ease of use, participatory culture and interoperability (i.e., compatibility with other products, systems, and devices) for end users.""" - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Web_2.0 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Web_2.0 I don't think I need to elaborate this quotation? But if I do, note the domain I'm quoting from and the website in which you are reading this comment from me.
gjm11 2y ago
I don't think I understand your first sentence. Big tech wasn't invested in crypto in the way it is in AI. For a few days Meta pretended they were going to launch a cryptocurrency, but that's kinda it. Whereas in this case all the biggest tech players are making a lot of noise about how AI is The Future and investing a tremendous amount of resources into trying to make their AI be The Future. Big tech investment into machine learning didn't need walking back because machine learning morphed smoothly into AI. Big tech investment into "Web 2.0" didn't need walking back because "Web 2.0", to whatever extent it was a definite specific thing, was a huge success and now we just call it the web. (If you meant "Web 3.0", that didn't need walking back for the same reason as crypto didn't: it was never a very big thing for very big tech.) So I'm not seeing how any of those things was like AI today. If it turns out that present-day AI is a bubble and it bursts, it will not be like crypto or "Web 3.0" for the big tech companies because those were only ever fads that the big tech companies didn't particularly tie themselves to. It won't be like machine learning because it will be the same bubble, just later on. And it won't be like "Web 2.0" because that wasn't a bubble and didn't burst.
- pjc50 2y ago
  A better example from Meta is probably the Metaverse losses: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-66913551 https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-66913551
Theodores 2y ago
There is a difference in zealotry. With blockchain technology there were many people prepared to die on that hill. It was going to solve world hunger albeit not the obesity epidemic. It also had all of its own lingo for not selling or buying the dip. I remember people saying how things would be replaced with blockchain technology such as ecommerce, and apps 'on the chain' would find many thousands of uses. People were quite insistent. On HN you risked getting modded down to hell and shadowbanned for life if you said anything wrongful about crypto. It was bizarre. With AI we don't have this level of zealotry. You can say it is a load of rubbish and nobody wants to kill you. Weird, but indicative that AI has found some use, even if it is for 'art' and just marketing. Nonetheless, if someone does get a bit zealous about it, I can tell them that I have all problems solved already with blockchain technology apps, just for trolling value.

ryandrake 2y ago

Everyone will walk it back like they walked back 'blockchain.' And then they'll go and find another technology to conspicuously chase. The hype cycle will repeat.

bee_rider 2y ago

Yeah, I think you are probably overreacting. Microsoft and Google already have sort of bad reputations anyway, but they haven’t actually done anything that widely hurt customers yet with this AI stuff. If it doesn’t work out, it will just be a silly R&D project from the public’s point of view. Or they’ll use it to make stuff like Cortana (or whatever they are calling it now) slightly less useless.

swatcoder 2y ago

None of the big players have staked reputation on AI yet at all, which is telling in its own way. They've invested in it and explored products and demonstrated their R&D commitment but they haven't made it their new brand identity or anything. The most vulnerable Big Tech organization are the ones like OpenAI and Anthropic that are swollen with investment specifically for AI but need to find a business or growth plan that can sustain that investment, plus the smaller and startup companies that have bet the farm on AI before it matured. But these same companies are the ones that have the potential to win big if there's another key breakthrough on either capabilities or product insight.

halostatue 2y ago
I’m not sure how Google and Meta placing massive AI visibility in their everyday user interfaces isn’t staking reputation.
- SXX 2y ago
  Will Google or Meta pop if they'll just remove all of that overnight? I doubt it.

AlexandrB 2y ago

This kind of thing is not irreversible. Remember when Google tried to get everyone on Google+? A far more annoying product push than shoving AI into Google search.

lovethevoid 2y ago

One thing big tech is very good at is walking it back. Microsoft was one of the earlier big adopters of cryptocurrency, and now it’s nowhere to be found. Nobody cares because Microsoft didn’t make a big deal out of it. Because current AI is effectively being pitched as assistants 2.0, I don’t see them wiping AI from their lineup, but letting it rot is a possibility as they all have done for their v1 assistants. Due to the attention economy, most aren’t going to care within a year. Google is still a dominant company despite killing off beloved services so if they can do that, the others certainly can weather failed AI products. There might be some exceptions like Adobe, it depends on what they do. That’s my take on it anyways, in general there was just way too much pumped into AI without much thorough thought. The fact that Rabbit was even a thing people got hyped over speaks volumes to how out of touch with reality current AI pushes are.

rsynnott 2y ago

I mean, see, say, Google+, or that Facebook metaverse thing, or the various Windows Phones, or IBM's adventures in the blockchain. Companies get over-excited about the latest trend and do silly stuff all the time. People generally more or less forget.