4 ms·

I've lived in a few of these, and the "cheap" part is really the biggest concern. Besides the fact that they all share in their corrugated-metal hideousness, th

I've lived in a few of these, and the "cheap" part is really the biggest concern. Besides the fact that they all share in their corrugated-metal hideousness, they're a symptom of developers pushing the boundaries of building code to save a few bucks. Without doxxing myself, I'll say that I was among the first group of residents of a 5-over-1 that made local news for the safety problems associated with its cheap construction. Non-functional smoke detectors, incorrectly installed fire walls, flood markings in the concrete basement, paint smears on the cabinets, doors with massive and varying gaps underneath, the whole 9 yards. In a brand new building. Truly a remarkable exercise in corner-cutting.

bobthepanda 2y ago
this is a problem in every era of construction, though. developers have not really changed their mindset or their ability to cut corners, they just change the flavor of building they like. Seattle is full of Sears catalog Craftsman homes that are not at all climate appropriate, and while they are historic and beloved today that was not always the case. If you buy one of them today they're probably moldy.
- ryukoposting 2y ago
  The tough thing with Sears homes is you never know who built them. They showed up in a boxcar and you either hired someone to build them, or you built them yourself. Here in the Midwest we have plenty of Sears homes and I've never heard a bad thing about them. I guess that traces back to your "the problem is the builder, not the building" argument. You're right, but I think it's okay to dislike a blatant symbol of half-assedness.
  - bobthepanda 2y ago
    what i mean to say by "while they are historic and beloved today that was not always the case." is that people often complained about them in the era that they were built, because people back then also did not like the new cheap stuff and had rose tinted glasses about the good old days. As a general example, New York's iconic brownstones were also complained about in their era because they were prone to crumbling and flaking, and yet now they are beloved pieces of city history worth millions of dollars. https://www.nytimes.com/2012/10/23/nyregion/saying-goodbye-to-the-face-of-new-yorks-brownstones.html https://www.nytimes.com/2012/10/23/nyregion/saying-goodbye-t...
    - tomcam 2y ago
      I too am crumbling and flakey. Many people complain about me as well.
    - kjkjadksj 2y ago
      Fixing up housing and selling it to richer people is a new concept. It used to be you would build new things and clear out the old. Of course when we make legal systems that favor the status quo, suddenly it becomes a luxury prospect to live in the few good units of whats left since we aren’t allowing for any more. Historical significance arguments basically emerged in our society along with the very ordinances that prevented these same historical structures from ever being built again. There would be no reason to deem something historical and protect it if it was constantly being renewed as it is, after all.
  - kjkjadksj 2y ago
    Sears homes were precut I believe. Your crew was probably drunk anyhow no matter what but that gives them a bit of a helping hand with one less precision task to be done. I think theres a serious survivorship bias among them today. Most of the ones you would consider buying have been well maintained and upkept. The ones we rented from slumlord landlords in college on the other hand. Some of the floors were so warped it looked like the tide. Most bathrooms full of mold from 7 students showering daily with no shower vent. Most exterior trim wood rotting from lack of regular painting. Most windows single pane with poor seals. Most work would happen when something catastrophic demanded it from a code habitability issue, like a roof leak destroying the ceiling, that would only be addressed after the unit became legally uninhabitable.
c5karl 2y ago
None of the flaws you cite is attributable to the stick-built construction. Dishonest and/or incompetent contractors can screw up a building made of any materials.
kjkjadksj 2y ago
I saw a building that was entirely finished for years. Vacant but finished, aside from the fact they never built an apron to the road for the sunken garage. Last year they did up the apron seemingly overnight but no activity yet for any of the brand new units. I don’t think I will ever fully understand the economics of development if this behavior somehow makes pragmatic business sense, all these years not collecting rent probably writing off the loss to support other investments.

bobthepanda 2y ago

this is a problem in every era of construction, though. developers have not really changed their mindset or their ability to cut corners, they just change the flavor of building they like. Seattle is full of Sears catalog Craftsman homes that are not at all climate appropriate, and while they are historic and beloved today that was not always the case. If you buy one of them today they're probably moldy.

ryukoposting 2y ago
The tough thing with Sears homes is you never know who built them. They showed up in a boxcar and you either hired someone to build them, or you built them yourself. Here in the Midwest we have plenty of Sears homes and I've never heard a bad thing about them. I guess that traces back to your "the problem is the builder, not the building" argument. You're right, but I think it's okay to dislike a blatant symbol of half-assedness.
- bobthepanda 2y ago
  what i mean to say by "while they are historic and beloved today that was not always the case." is that people often complained about them in the era that they were built, because people back then also did not like the new cheap stuff and had rose tinted glasses about the good old days. As a general example, New York's iconic brownstones were also complained about in their era because they were prone to crumbling and flaking, and yet now they are beloved pieces of city history worth millions of dollars. https://www.nytimes.com/2012/10/23/nyregion/saying-goodbye-to-the-face-of-new-yorks-brownstones.html https://www.nytimes.com/2012/10/23/nyregion/saying-goodbye-t...
  - tomcam 2y ago
    I too am crumbling and flakey. Many people complain about me as well.
  - kjkjadksj 2y ago
    Fixing up housing and selling it to richer people is a new concept. It used to be you would build new things and clear out the old. Of course when we make legal systems that favor the status quo, suddenly it becomes a luxury prospect to live in the few good units of whats left since we aren’t allowing for any more. Historical significance arguments basically emerged in our society along with the very ordinances that prevented these same historical structures from ever being built again. There would be no reason to deem something historical and protect it if it was constantly being renewed as it is, after all.
- kjkjadksj 2y ago
  Sears homes were precut I believe. Your crew was probably drunk anyhow no matter what but that gives them a bit of a helping hand with one less precision task to be done. I think theres a serious survivorship bias among them today. Most of the ones you would consider buying have been well maintained and upkept. The ones we rented from slumlord landlords in college on the other hand. Some of the floors were so warped it looked like the tide. Most bathrooms full of mold from 7 students showering daily with no shower vent. Most exterior trim wood rotting from lack of regular painting. Most windows single pane with poor seals. Most work would happen when something catastrophic demanded it from a code habitability issue, like a roof leak destroying the ceiling, that would only be addressed after the unit became legally uninhabitable.

c5karl 2y ago

None of the flaws you cite is attributable to the stick-built construction. Dishonest and/or incompetent contractors can screw up a building made of any materials.

kjkjadksj 2y ago

I saw a building that was entirely finished for years. Vacant but finished, aside from the fact they never built an apron to the road for the sunken garage. Last year they did up the apron seemingly overnight but no activity yet for any of the brand new units. I don’t think I will ever fully understand the economics of development if this behavior somehow makes pragmatic business sense, all these years not collecting rent probably writing off the loss to support other investments.