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Honestly, I can't even finish reading through this comment. This is the opposite of idealism - is there a word for it? You seem to be complaining that something

Honestly, I can't even finish reading through this comment. This is the opposite of idealism - is there a word for it? You seem to be complaining that something is impossible because it can't be implemented in a perfect utopian way. Well, guess what, we already have an implementation of the internet that imperfectly respects "the public good", and it sucks. Let's imagine something better.

cheeseomlit 2y ago
>You seem to be complaining that something is impossible because it can't be implemented in a perfect utopian way. That's not what I'm saying, in fact 'perfect utopian' projects are exactly what I'm expressing skepticism towards. The problems we have with the internet are mostly just symptoms of deeper societal issues, and they arent infrastructure problems that can be easily fixed like a road or bridge with some massive spending bill. If the US actually enforced anti-trust laws and broke up the tech cartels it would solve a whole lot of problems with the internet, but I doubt that idea would get much traction with whoever ends up on the 'new internet committee'. And I dont see it as a lack of idealism, its just plain pragmatism
jujube3 2y ago
> Honestly, I can't even finish reading through this comment. This is the opposite of idealism - is there a word for it? realism
- digging 2y ago
  No, it's more like defeatism.
  - Gormo 2y ago
    Nah, idealism is itself defeatism -- nothing sustains the status quo greater than people wallowing in speculation unmoored from reality instead of taking practical measures to address the problems before them.
Karrot_Kream 2y ago
Just take a look at the schism between Japanese Mastodon instances vs Western Mastodon instances and their vehement disagreement on what constitutes pornography and CSAM. These are userbases composed of mostly developed country users with liberal values, high incomes, and varying degrees of social infrastructure. If you can't even get these entities to agree, how do you think you'll get NATO countries onboard, let alone BRICS?
Gormo 2y ago
> This is the opposite of idealism - is there a word for it? Far from being the opposite of idealism, this approach is in fact the only one by which high ideals can be approximated in reality. > You seem to be complaining that something is impossible because it can't be implemented in a perfect utopian way. Quite to the contrary, the complaint is not merely that the pursuit of these goals would fall short of perfection, but rather that the consequences would largely be the inverse of the intentions. In essence, idealism is its own opposite -- if you're looking for a single word to describe this critique, some good options might be "correctness", "efficacy", and "reasonableness".

cheeseomlit 2y ago

>You seem to be complaining that something is impossible because it can't be implemented in a perfect utopian way. That's not what I'm saying, in fact 'perfect utopian' projects are exactly what I'm expressing skepticism towards. The problems we have with the internet are mostly just symptoms of deeper societal issues, and they arent infrastructure problems that can be easily fixed like a road or bridge with some massive spending bill. If the US actually enforced anti-trust laws and broke up the tech cartels it would solve a whole lot of problems with the internet, but I doubt that idea would get much traction with whoever ends up on the 'new internet committee'. And I dont see it as a lack of idealism, its just plain pragmatism

jujube3 2y ago

> Honestly, I can't even finish reading through this comment. This is the opposite of idealism - is there a word for it? realism

digging 2y ago
No, it's more like defeatism.
- Gormo 2y ago
  Nah, idealism is itself defeatism -- nothing sustains the status quo greater than people wallowing in speculation unmoored from reality instead of taking practical measures to address the problems before them.

Karrot_Kream 2y ago

Just take a look at the schism between Japanese Mastodon instances vs Western Mastodon instances and their vehement disagreement on what constitutes pornography and CSAM. These are userbases composed of mostly developed country users with liberal values, high incomes, and varying degrees of social infrastructure. If you can't even get these entities to agree, how do you think you'll get NATO countries onboard, let alone BRICS?

Gormo 2y ago

> This is the opposite of idealism - is there a word for it? Far from being the opposite of idealism, this approach is in fact the only one by which high ideals can be approximated in reality. > You seem to be complaining that something is impossible because it can't be implemented in a perfect utopian way. Quite to the contrary, the complaint is not merely that the pursuit of these goals would fall short of perfection, but rather that the consequences would largely be the inverse of the intentions. In essence, idealism is its own opposite -- if you're looking for a single word to describe this critique, some good options might be "correctness", "efficacy", and "reasonableness".