4 ms·

The problem is that Fandom ends up with better search engine rank than the replacement wiki that the actual community moved on to.

by Dwedit 2y ago

2muchcoffeeman 2y ago
What’s the replacement wiki?
- deleted 2y ago
  [deleted]
- itishappy 2y ago
  What you move to when you quit Fandom. Super common for games. Examples: Fandom: https://noita.fandom.com/wiki/Noita_Wiki https://noita.fandom.com/wiki/Noita_Wiki Official: https://noita.wiki.gg/wiki/Noita_Wiki https://noita.wiki.gg/wiki/Noita_Wiki Fandom: https://terraria.fandom.com/wiki/Terraria_Wiki https://terraria.fandom.com/wiki/Terraria_Wiki Official: https://terraria.wiki.gg/wiki/Terraria https://terraria.wiki.gg/wiki/Terraria Fandom: https://minecraft.fandom.com/wiki/Minecraft_Wiki https://minecraft.fandom.com/wiki/Minecraft_Wiki Official: https://minecraft.wiki/ https://minecraft.wiki/ Two of the three Fandom wiki's above are still ranked higher than the official ones on Google.
  - o11c 2y ago
    https://nethackwiki.com/wiki/Main_Page https://nethackwiki.com/wiki/Main_Page is ranked above the Fandom version these days.
- Falell 2y ago
  There isn't one, there are hundreds. Given that you end up on a small fandom wiki, you have no idea where 'the better community' is. You go to your search engine of choice and start clicking random wikis hoping at least one other one has decent info (most are useless). As a concrete example, Path of Exile moved to https://www.poewiki.net/ https://www.poewiki.net/ (which is a single MediaWiki instance not associated with a larger network). The content is quite good but it took probably 18 months for it to start reliably appearing in google search results.
  - freehorse 2y ago
    In many cases, it is not a big deal to just open a few links and figure it out. Fandom's content is usually too crap and incomplete. I have been mostly avoiding fandom and fextralife because of content reasons, and I had no idea of all the drama around them.
Ukv 2y ago
The (Old School) Runescape wiki mentioned in the article (https://runescape.wiki/ https://runescape.wiki/ and https://oldschool.runescape.wiki/ https://oldschool.runescape.wiki/) is higher up than the Fandom one on all search engines I'm aware of. The Minecraft wiki (https://minecraft.wiki/ https://minecraft.wiki/) also generally beats out the Fandom one (on Bing, Yandex, ... - but critically not yet Google). Definitely takes a lot of effort, but can be done.
- lucb1e 2y ago
  > but critically not yet Google). My takeaway from the recent Google search engine ranking documentation leak was that they very heavily uprank big brand names. A page on reddit with various short comments (many of them useful I'm sure) is going to always outrank a random individual's blog with a well-researched article about the same topic. Same for Quora, Facebook, and the other websites with big moderation teams and where we all know what to expect. There is something to be said for it as well: the quality of a reddit discussion or quora answers will probably be more consistent than if you serve up random other pages (those may be content farms, ad farms, unresearched opinions...). Other pages on the web may be better, or may be worse. I'm guessing that Google figures/found they look better if they don't serve up (m)any bad results but rather pretend that big brands are the internet now, sticking to an average (mediocre-ish) quality Perhaps that's why Google likes big brand Wikia better than this new domain
bisby 2y ago
https://libredirect.github.io/ https://libredirect.github.io/ LibRedirect has an automatic Fandom redirect option, so if someone sends you a fandom link, or you otherwise click one without realizing it, you won't wind up on fandom. You still give the analytics that you clicked a fandom link to whoever served you the link though.
- themagicteeth 2y ago
  Doesn’t it just redirect to BreezeWiki? BreezeWiki is just a Fandom mirror as far as I am aware. So while you won’t see Fandoms ads, the content is still on Fandom. Though, it is still better than the actual website by a lot… and the other redirects it offers are pretty great as well. https://breezewiki.com/ https://breezewiki.com/
  - chgs 2y ago
    That’s sounds brilliant. I typed “memory alpha” on the search page you linked to. Exception raised in Racket code at response generation time: json-pointer-value: contract violation Cest La vie. On desktop fandom is fine, ublock handles it. On an iPhone though forget it. It’s the videos.
  - jabroni_salad 2y ago
    Yeah. LibRedirect is a nice generalist tool, but for wikis you are better off with Indie Wiki Buddy[1] which is a community led tool to point to the best avaialble wiki, or breeze if there isn't one. You def want this because some communities have made it a point to poison the fandom pages (see Terraria which is full of fake items and crafting recipes now). [1] https://getindie.wiki/ https://getindie.wiki/
  - starkparker 2y ago
    BreezeWiki isn't a mirror, it's an API client. It pulls the content from Fandom via MediaWiki API and renders it.
- wizzwizz4 2y ago
  It's better to use https://getindie.wiki/ https://getindie.wiki/, which sends you to the specific replacement wikis rather than BreezeWiki (though it does support BreezeWiki).
RheingoldRiver 2y ago
I work for wiki.gg You can use one (or both) of these extensions to avoid Fandom: * https://getindie.wiki/ https://getindie.wiki/, should redirect you to any not-fandom equivalent * https://support.wiki.gg/wiki/Wiki.gg_Redirect https://support.wiki.gg/wiki/Wiki.gg_Redirect, is wiki.gg wikis only and will see updates for such wikis more frequently
edflsafoiewq 2y ago
So?
- ziddoap 2y ago
  So people looking for a wiki with a quick search end up clicking on the fandom link, being bombarded with ads as well as potentially outdated or incorrect information, instead of clicking on the wiki that doesn't have those issues. In turn, that gives fandom more ad views and potential clicks, perpetuating the problem.
- throwanem 2y ago
  So search engines continue to serve the SEO-riddled landgrab garbage over the valuable resource, new visitors to the community continue to get served bad information and deterred from involving themselves further, the maintainers of the real wiki have to waste spare time figuring out how to deal with this nonsense over maintaining the resource, and Fandom continues to pollute the informational commons to its own gain and everyone else's detriment.
0xTJ 2y ago
I'll take this chance to plug Kagi Search (a paid search engine), that I recently switched to, and have been loving. It's nice to actually be able to say "Hey, this site is trash, don't show it/de-rank it for me."
- layer8 2y ago
  That doesn’t solve the problem that most people will find Fandom first when searching for it.
  - 0xTJ 2y ago
    That's fair, but it'll keep individuals from ending up clicking to so many junk sites. And the more people using search engines that allow them to fight back against enshittification, the better.
- teroshan 2y ago
  Not only this, but I've been using Kagi's Redirect feature to redirect fandom results if I see some. For instance for Path of Exile, simply: ^https://pathofexile.fandom.com|https://poewiki.net https://pathofexile.fandom.com|https://poewiki.net Alternatively the Redirector extension can also achieve similar results, without having Kagi, and converting all links, not just search results [1]. [1]: https://github.com/einaregilsson/Redirector https://github.com/einaregilsson/Redirector
iamacyborg 2y ago
Yes and no. It definitely takes a little time but it’s not all that hard to outrank Fandom.

The problem is that Fandom ends up with better search engine rank than the replacement wiki that the actual community moved on to.

by Dwedit 2y ago

The problem is that Fandom ends up with better search engine rank than the replacement wiki that the actual community moved on to.

2muchcoffeeman 2y ago

What’s the replacement wiki?

deleted 2y ago
[deleted]
itishappy 2y ago
What you move to when you quit Fandom. Super common for games. Examples: Fandom: https://noita.fandom.com/wiki/Noita_Wiki https://noita.fandom.com/wiki/Noita_Wiki Official: https://noita.wiki.gg/wiki/Noita_Wiki https://noita.wiki.gg/wiki/Noita_Wiki Fandom: https://terraria.fandom.com/wiki/Terraria_Wiki https://terraria.fandom.com/wiki/Terraria_Wiki Official: https://terraria.wiki.gg/wiki/Terraria https://terraria.wiki.gg/wiki/Terraria Fandom: https://minecraft.fandom.com/wiki/Minecraft_Wiki https://minecraft.fandom.com/wiki/Minecraft_Wiki Official: https://minecraft.wiki/ https://minecraft.wiki/ Two of the three Fandom wiki's above are still ranked higher than the official ones on Google.
- o11c 2y ago
  https://nethackwiki.com/wiki/Main_Page https://nethackwiki.com/wiki/Main_Page is ranked above the Fandom version these days.
Falell 2y ago
There isn't one, there are hundreds. Given that you end up on a small fandom wiki, you have no idea where 'the better community' is. You go to your search engine of choice and start clicking random wikis hoping at least one other one has decent info (most are useless). As a concrete example, Path of Exile moved to https://www.poewiki.net/ https://www.poewiki.net/ (which is a single MediaWiki instance not associated with a larger network). The content is quite good but it took probably 18 months for it to start reliably appearing in google search results.
- freehorse 2y ago
  In many cases, it is not a big deal to just open a few links and figure it out. Fandom's content is usually too crap and incomplete. I have been mostly avoiding fandom and fextralife because of content reasons, and I had no idea of all the drama around them.

Ukv 2y ago

The (Old School) Runescape wiki mentioned in the article (https://runescape.wiki/ https://runescape.wiki/ and https://oldschool.runescape.wiki/ https://oldschool.runescape.wiki/) is higher up than the Fandom one on all search engines I'm aware of. The Minecraft wiki (https://minecraft.wiki/ https://minecraft.wiki/) also generally beats out the Fandom one (on Bing, Yandex, ... - but critically not yet Google). Definitely takes a lot of effort, but can be done.

lucb1e 2y ago
> but critically not yet Google). My takeaway from the recent Google search engine ranking documentation leak was that they very heavily uprank big brand names. A page on reddit with various short comments (many of them useful I'm sure) is going to always outrank a random individual's blog with a well-researched article about the same topic. Same for Quora, Facebook, and the other websites with big moderation teams and where we all know what to expect. There is something to be said for it as well: the quality of a reddit discussion or quora answers will probably be more consistent than if you serve up random other pages (those may be content farms, ad farms, unresearched opinions...). Other pages on the web may be better, or may be worse. I'm guessing that Google figures/found they look better if they don't serve up (m)any bad results but rather pretend that big brands are the internet now, sticking to an average (mediocre-ish) quality Perhaps that's why Google likes big brand Wikia better than this new domain

bisby 2y ago

https://libredirect.github.io/ https://libredirect.github.io/ LibRedirect has an automatic Fandom redirect option, so if someone sends you a fandom link, or you otherwise click one without realizing it, you won't wind up on fandom. You still give the analytics that you clicked a fandom link to whoever served you the link though.

themagicteeth 2y ago
Doesn’t it just redirect to BreezeWiki? BreezeWiki is just a Fandom mirror as far as I am aware. So while you won’t see Fandoms ads, the content is still on Fandom. Though, it is still better than the actual website by a lot… and the other redirects it offers are pretty great as well. https://breezewiki.com/ https://breezewiki.com/
- chgs 2y ago
  That’s sounds brilliant. I typed “memory alpha” on the search page you linked to. Exception raised in Racket code at response generation time: json-pointer-value: contract violation Cest La vie. On desktop fandom is fine, ublock handles it. On an iPhone though forget it. It’s the videos.
- jabroni_salad 2y ago
  Yeah. LibRedirect is a nice generalist tool, but for wikis you are better off with Indie Wiki Buddy[1] which is a community led tool to point to the best avaialble wiki, or breeze if there isn't one. You def want this because some communities have made it a point to poison the fandom pages (see Terraria which is full of fake items and crafting recipes now). [1] https://getindie.wiki/ https://getindie.wiki/
- starkparker 2y ago
  BreezeWiki isn't a mirror, it's an API client. It pulls the content from Fandom via MediaWiki API and renders it.
wizzwizz4 2y ago
It's better to use https://getindie.wiki/ https://getindie.wiki/, which sends you to the specific replacement wikis rather than BreezeWiki (though it does support BreezeWiki).

RheingoldRiver 2y ago

I work for wiki.gg You can use one (or both) of these extensions to avoid Fandom: * https://getindie.wiki/ https://getindie.wiki/, should redirect you to any not-fandom equivalent * https://support.wiki.gg/wiki/Wiki.gg_Redirect https://support.wiki.gg/wiki/Wiki.gg_Redirect, is wiki.gg wikis only and will see updates for such wikis more frequently

edflsafoiewq 2y ago

So?

ziddoap 2y ago
So people looking for a wiki with a quick search end up clicking on the fandom link, being bombarded with ads as well as potentially outdated or incorrect information, instead of clicking on the wiki that doesn't have those issues. In turn, that gives fandom more ad views and potential clicks, perpetuating the problem.
throwanem 2y ago
So search engines continue to serve the SEO-riddled landgrab garbage over the valuable resource, new visitors to the community continue to get served bad information and deterred from involving themselves further, the maintainers of the real wiki have to waste spare time figuring out how to deal with this nonsense over maintaining the resource, and Fandom continues to pollute the informational commons to its own gain and everyone else's detriment.

0xTJ 2y ago

I'll take this chance to plug Kagi Search (a paid search engine), that I recently switched to, and have been loving. It's nice to actually be able to say "Hey, this site is trash, don't show it/de-rank it for me."

layer8 2y ago
That doesn’t solve the problem that most people will find Fandom first when searching for it.
- 0xTJ 2y ago
  That's fair, but it'll keep individuals from ending up clicking to so many junk sites. And the more people using search engines that allow them to fight back against enshittification, the better.
teroshan 2y ago
Not only this, but I've been using Kagi's Redirect feature to redirect fandom results if I see some. For instance for Path of Exile, simply: ^https://pathofexile.fandom.com|https://poewiki.net https://pathofexile.fandom.com|https://poewiki.net Alternatively the Redirector extension can also achieve similar results, without having Kagi, and converting all links, not just search results [1]. [1]: https://github.com/einaregilsson/Redirector https://github.com/einaregilsson/Redirector

iamacyborg 2y ago

Yes and no. It definitely takes a little time but it’s not all that hard to outrank Fandom.