7 ms·
The pay raise people say they need to be happy
- yamrzou 2y agohttps://archive.ph/xBGX4 https://archive.ph/xBGX4
- k__ 2y agoPeople don't need a pay rise; they need a way to leave the treadmill.
- resource_waste 2y agoI left the treadmill, it was so boring. I voluntarily went back on it, it is nice to know I can hop off. But I can't hop off, its too boring. Seriously.
- jakupovic 2y agoIt's boring because everyone else is on the treadmill and has no time to entertain you. Maybe first week or two, but the daily reality hits everyone and the basic fact is people need money and the best way we all have to make money is to work. So unless you give everyone around you money they have to work and cannot hang out with you ...
- imoverclocked 2y agoI’ve been off the treadmill for two years. There is plenty to do here :)
- emilamlom 2y agoRight. I feel like people that say it's boring maybe aren't being creative enough. Do that project you've been wanting to do forever, travel, go camping, pick up a sport, play video games you missed out on, or just work part time at a place you actually enjoy. Being financially secure opens up a ton of possibilities.
- resource_waste 2y agoSports and Video Games seemed so fake and trivial. (I'm not alone in this thought, so please don't just criticize it, I think its fair) I got into a few hobbies during it, but there was something missing about the hobby. I would try to replace that treadmill running with the hobby, but two things would happen: The hobby stops being fun or you never scratch the treadmill running itch. I don't really believe we just need to change our psychology or short term behaviors and try to enjoy what other people say they enjoy. My favorite hobby, reading/audiobook philosophy, can be done with the treadmill life. Best of both worlds.
- imoverclocked 2y ago> Sports and Video Games seemed so fake and trivial. Agreed. My inner armchair psychologist wants to ask, “what is fundamentally different between the treadmill and a hobby?” For me, I think it’s doing something that matters for the world. Hobbies on their own tend to be self-enriching (which is essential) while the notion of a treadmill is that you are accomplishing something greater than just yourself. If true, what we are all missing may be a sense of agency to effect meaningful change.
- emilamlom 2y agoWell, the "treadmill" implies doing work that accomplishes nothing to me. If you get meaning from working a standard job, then that's great. Guess I misunderstood what y'all meant by the treadmill.
- imoverclocked 2y ago… what are your thoughts on what the treadmill is?
- Centigonal 2y agoI wish they had a version of the figure with a log scale, since it seems like people of all income brackets except the very lowest say a 30-50% raise will make them happy.
- jwagenet 2y ago> Dunn said that many people might be happier if they focus on the best ways to use the money they have, rather than on getting more of it. So out of touch. Sure, the >$200k bracket saying they also need a 50% raise to be happier is a bit rich, but for a anyone else, especially <$100k, people don’t have time to make their money work better for them. The whole complaint about wage stagnation is that people need to work multiple jobs, commute long hours, etc so they don’t have time to eat well, go to the doctor, spend time with kids, or whatever they need to be happier. Whoever says otherwise either doesn’t live in our society or is already over the wage hump of living comfortably.
- imzadi 2y agoIt'd be so nice if basic needs were just met as part of the societal contract. Then work is the thing we do to fund the extras. People who can't work for whatever reason don't have to fight to survive and people who want to work or have more ambition can actually do something with the money they make.
- imoverclocked 2y agoWhat does that look like in terms of actual implementation? Also, where do we draw the line between basic needs and extras? Finally, who drives garbage trucks, picks food in hot fields, delivers goods by driving all night, etc when they have all of their basic needs met for free?
- kjkjadksj 2y agoMaybe something like the food stamp program. I haven’t personally used it but it seems to work, considering I’ve never seen an emaciated homeless person in the US.
- imzadi 2y agoMost homeless people don't get food stamps. Programs like food stamps usually require someone to have a mailing address, which can be difficult to establish if you are homeless. Some people think you can just go get a PO Box or third party mailbox, but you can't. The USPS requires you to have a physical address to get a PO Box, and third party mailboxes that want to accept USPS mail delivery have to apply the same standard.
- yamrzou 2y agoHere is a better figure highlighting the difference between the desired and the current salary: https://datawrapper.dwcdn.net/9aqrK/apple.png https://datawrapper.dwcdn.net/9aqrK/apple.png
- tr3ntg 2y agoWow. This is very interesting.
- tr3ntg 2y agoAnd where is this from?
- bena 2y agoThat is so weird. I've essentially been adjusting my saving/investing to keep my take home at about the same amount since I've reached a certain threshold. Now, I wouldn't say no to more, but I also don't feel I need more necessarily. Even now, I have about a year's worth of money tucked away "just in case". And the major reason for the saving/investing is to be able to generate enough cash to cover bills so I'm not reliant on a job for anything.
- rcxdude 2y agoWell, the question was "How much does your annual salary need to be for you to feel happy/less stressed?". So it's a relative position: how much more money to subjectively improve your life? In that sense it makes sense, given the general diminishing returns of the utility of money, that those with a higher salary would say they need more additional money to be happier: even if they're relatively happy already, it's not something a relatively smaller amount of money is going to change much. I find the inflection in the percentages somewhat interesting: it reduces from the lower to higher incomes until about 150k, then increases a lot. I wonder if that represents the salary range where financial independence starts to come into sight: then the responses there would be reflecting an estimate of the amount of money they'd need to retire early and live their current lifestyle off their savings.
- deadbabe 2y agoAs you access higher incomes the possibilities of things you could buy expands, thus you want more and more money to afford them, thus requiring bigger pay raises.
- kjkjadksj 2y agoAt a certain point though you start saving or investing hand over fist the excess you cannot manage to spend. A coca cola costs the same no matter how much you make after all.
- neuronerdgirl 2y agoRight but the salary ranges here are not that tipping point. Sure, a coke is a coke, but how many people can even consider the other options when it's 5 dozen for $10 for that or 5.99 for 8 Aura Boras? Having significant excess income allows you to stop making minimum choices and start choosing for quality, which leads to lots of benefits. For example, you may want to source your groceries from local farms and small grocers, which keeps money in the local economy rather than pushing it back to shareholders at kroger or amazon. You can afford high quality natural materials for your clothing a la the boots problem, leading to both greater longevity of your own personal wardrobe and also a reduction in microplastics down the road. You can consider the full range of brands of sodas, some of which are both smaller creators and perhaps zero calorie too, making you slightly healthier and at the same time pushing competition in favor of newer innovative companies. I think what we are seeing in these data is that people with less than enough money to have even started to conceive of these decision points simply don't factor it into their perceived desires for more income at all, and that has a sort of cliff effect on desired salary increases that falls off once people actually get out of the rut of survival wages. No one at 200k is being forced to buy the cheapest everything and pinching the pennies, but theyre also in no way "set for life" unless they've indeed been doing so.
- kjkjadksj 2y agoYou can do all of this stuff yet the small lot milk is only $8 and the smoothie at Erewhon is only like $10 still. This is what they mean by things being more expensive for poor people. Even with being choosy, prices can only realistically be so high. Say you are a working professional: the local economy by default has to price things such where they are somewhat affordable to a certain number of people to support the business. Unless you live in Monaco chances are you having a degree and using it in your work puts you at the elite end of the wage earning scale in your local city. Therefore to satisfy business cases, things are relatively cheaper for you and relatively more expensive for everyone else. This is true for coca cola, erewhon smoothies, local farmers markets, cars, plane tickets, and homes. Whatever it is. It's even more egregious for the filthy rich. How shameful we let someone like Lionel Messi only pay $10 for an Erewhon smoothie or only $100k for a mercedes considering what that relatively means to their bottom line compared to what it means for ours.
- kneel 2y agoI will never forget starting off my career as a 'contract employee' with no benefits. Working long hours I developed quite a few health problems within the first year. It was nearly impossible to see a doctor and when I finally did I had to fight the insurance company for weeks to cover a visit. I was making every single meal to save money, my supervisor used to sneak us food from the c-suite catered lunches after we were banned from going upstairs to scavenge their leftovers. When my contract was up they offered me another contract, after a year I expected to be offered full-time employment with benefits. I asked around to see if this was normal and met someone who had been a contract employee for 5 years. I quit the next week. I think California passed a law preventing contractor classification abuse shortly after this but it left a lasting impression on my view of corporate business culture.
- randomdata 2y ago> left a lasting impression on my view of corporate business culture. No different than culture in general, is it? If you meet someone walking down the street, you're not likely to hound them to make sure everything is okay and if there is anything you can do to make their stroll better. You are bound to just naturally assume that because they are walking down the street that they are happy to be there and everything is good. You're apt to assume that unless they cry out for help, they don't need another thought. But maybe they really do need help. You clearly did need the help, but as you kept showing up, there was no reason to think something was wrong in your case either.
- diob 2y agoI think in the middle, you reach a point where you think, "Wow, this is more than I ever imagined, this must be the most you can make." As a kid raised in poverty, that's definitely what I thought. But the higher you get, the greater your visibility of folks making even more money. This is coming from someone who started at 60k, currently at >200k.