3 ms·

Memory is the wrong word to use even like that. To the extent that there is DNA methylation in gametes, it will up or down regulate the expression of existing g

by ch4s3 2y ago

Memory is the wrong word to use even like that. To the extent that there is DNA methylation in gametes, it will up or down regulate the expression of existing genes in the DNA. Nothing is created de-novo as in memory, you can’t look at the resultant gene regulation and look backwards to a cause.

giantg2 2y ago
Then please go tell all the publications and researcher that they are wrong for using the term "Epigenetic memory" in thier domain. Or are you a domain expert (in the minority if you are)?
- ch4s3 2y ago
  The study[1] mentioned in the guardian does not contain the phrase "epigenetic memory", and only contains the word memory twice, and both uses are of the conventional definition. The author in the guardian is misrepresenting the science. [1] https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3923835/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3923835/
  - giantg2 2y ago
    I agree that the article is garage. The point of contention is around epigenetic memory being a thing or not. It is a common term used in the domain, such as in this paper and others. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7225062/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7225062/
    - ch4s3 2y ago
      You could probably replace the word memory in that paper with maguffin and not change the meaning. It's totally unconnected to the common definition or the use in neurology. I guess what I'm getting at is that this kind of reporting obscures what's going on intentionally for the political aims of the guardian. Which I think is lousy.
      - giantg2 2y ago
        Yes, and that's true of computer "memory" as well.
      - moralestapia 2y ago
        >what's going on intentionally for the political aims of the guardian Ok, now this is something! So, please enlighten me, what could be the political agenda being pushed by an article pondering around whether memories can be inherited or not?
        ch4s3 2y ago
        Vague notions of "inherited trauma" are a regular hobby horse of people in the broader political sphere of the guardian at the moment.
- biotinker 2y ago
  I'm not a domain expert in epigenetics, but in grad school for bioinformatics I did a bunch of research on nucleosome positioning[0] which is epigenetics-adjacent. "Epigenetic memory" is the term of art I was taught in grad school. Either they've changed that in the last 10 years, or ch4s3 is attempting to assert a different definition of "memory" than the one used in the field. They are also incorrect. DNA methylation is an actual methyl group chemically binding to an actual DNA nucleotide, and staying there. When we flip a bit on a hard drive platter we call that "memory" as well. [0] https://scholar.google.com/citations?user=MJO2lYIAAAAJ&hl=en https://scholar.google.com/citations?user=MJO2lYIAAAAJ&hl=en

by ch4s3 2y ago

giantg2 2y ago

Then please go tell all the publications and researcher that they are wrong for using the term "Epigenetic memory" in thier domain. Or are you a domain expert (in the minority if you are)?

ch4s3 2y ago
The study[1] mentioned in the guardian does not contain the phrase "epigenetic memory", and only contains the word memory twice, and both uses are of the conventional definition. The author in the guardian is misrepresenting the science. [1] https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3923835/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3923835/
- giantg2 2y ago
  I agree that the article is garage. The point of contention is around epigenetic memory being a thing or not. It is a common term used in the domain, such as in this paper and others. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7225062/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7225062/
  - ch4s3 2y ago
    You could probably replace the word memory in that paper with maguffin and not change the meaning. It's totally unconnected to the common definition or the use in neurology. I guess what I'm getting at is that this kind of reporting obscures what's going on intentionally for the political aims of the guardian. Which I think is lousy.
    - giantg2 2y ago
      Yes, and that's true of computer "memory" as well.
    - moralestapia 2y ago
      >what's going on intentionally for the political aims of the guardian Ok, now this is something! So, please enlighten me, what could be the political agenda being pushed by an article pondering around whether memories can be inherited or not?
      - ch4s3 2y ago
        Vague notions of "inherited trauma" are a regular hobby horse of people in the broader political sphere of the guardian at the moment.
biotinker 2y ago
I'm not a domain expert in epigenetics, but in grad school for bioinformatics I did a bunch of research on nucleosome positioning[0] which is epigenetics-adjacent. "Epigenetic memory" is the term of art I was taught in grad school. Either they've changed that in the last 10 years, or ch4s3 is attempting to assert a different definition of "memory" than the one used in the field. They are also incorrect. DNA methylation is an actual methyl group chemically binding to an actual DNA nucleotide, and staying there. When we flip a bit on a hard drive platter we call that "memory" as well. [0] https://scholar.google.com/citations?user=MJO2lYIAAAAJ&hl=en https://scholar.google.com/citations?user=MJO2lYIAAAAJ&hl=en