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So political change in russia is literally impossible and everything will be exactly the same 50 years from now? Obviously not. Is such change easy? Again, obv

So political change in russia is literally impossible and everything will be exactly the same 50 years from now? Obviously not. Is such change easy? Again, obviously not, but the only way countries change is their own citizens wanting to make the change.

grishka 2y ago
Oh we do want to make this change. Desperately. The only minor issue with that is that we lack any means to do so. I'll be sure to do my part as soon as the window of opportunity opens.
- firesteelrain 2y ago
  Sure hope your govt is not monitoring your posts
- brokenmachine 2y ago
  It's probably risky, but absolutely there's a means to do so. Be the change you want to see in the world. Change happens slowly at first, and then all at once.
  - grishka 2y ago
    No, there really isn't any means right now. Even peacefully protesting gets one arrested in minutes. It's not probably risky, it's risky with absolute certainty. I did participate in opposition activities that were 100% safe. I signed for Nadezhdin and voted for Davankov for example.
    - brokenmachine 2y ago
      What you're saying is there's no 100% safe way, not that there is no way. Apparently desperately wanting change in Russia means desperately wanting someone else to change it for you, which perfectly aligns with the apathy the Russian population is infamous for. If Putin somehow became unable to provide the population with food for three days, or pay his security team, you'd all quickly discover what desperately means, and I'm confident the problem would resolve itself quickly. Your population's apathy has become the whole world's problem. pls fix.
      - grishka 2y ago
        So what, exactly, is your suggestion? "Do something"?
        brokenmachine 2y ago
        Yes, precisely that.
        grishka 2y ago
        And nothing more concrete?
        brokenmachine 2y ago
        Not sure what concrete advice you expect me to write here in a public comment. I'm not in Russia, only started learning about Russia 3 years ago, and know nothing about you. I presume you're good with computers so have the ability to access (and distribute) information that others may not. There's historical precedent, research how people have fought oppression in the past. Many books and manuals have been written about how this is done. You may be able to access forums where like minded people can discuss and possibly work together. Obviously stay as safe as you can. "Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful, committed citizens can change the world; indeed, it's the only thing that ever has. We must remember that one determined person can make a significant difference, and that a small group of determined people can change the course of history." You're the best one to know what you can achieve - but I can tell you this, it's not nothing. Anything that makes the mechanisms of oppression less efficient is a step in the right direction. Every mechanism has weak points, leaky abstractions and incomplete assumptions. Find them.
        grishka 2y ago
        There is no problem with access to information. Everyone who wants to access government-blocked resources knows how to do so. The problem is that political change can't happen on the internet. And as soon as anyone tries to do something — anything — to that end in the real world, they face very real and fierce repression. The consensus among most of the opposition-minded people at this point it that it's just better to wait it out because there's currently no opportunity for change.
nullifidian 2y ago
>So political change in russia is literally impossible Precisely. It's basically impossible. There has to be at least be a generational change, or a severe economic / military loss if we are talking about this decade, but even that isn't a guarantee since the system is perpetuating itself with force, with economic self-interest to continue doing so. Isolating Russian citizens from western sources of information (in addition to what the Russian government is already doing by itself) is not only not helping, it's counterproductive, since rejection engenders a rejection in return, lowering the probability that an inflection point in the Russian history would result in anything western. >countries change Authoritarian countries change when their enforcement class relaxes and loses control. It takes decades for it to occur. If there is no relaxation, then no change occurs, as demonstrated by numerous countries, not only Russia. Right now the control and propaganda are very tight. "Wanting to make change" publicly is literally a life-threatening activity.

grishka 2y ago

Oh we do want to make this change. Desperately. The only minor issue with that is that we lack any means to do so. I'll be sure to do my part as soon as the window of opportunity opens.

firesteelrain 2y ago
Sure hope your govt is not monitoring your posts
brokenmachine 2y ago
It's probably risky, but absolutely there's a means to do so. Be the change you want to see in the world. Change happens slowly at first, and then all at once.
- grishka 2y ago
  No, there really isn't any means right now. Even peacefully protesting gets one arrested in minutes. It's not probably risky, it's risky with absolute certainty. I did participate in opposition activities that were 100% safe. I signed for Nadezhdin and voted for Davankov for example.
  - brokenmachine 2y ago
    What you're saying is there's no 100% safe way, not that there is no way. Apparently desperately wanting change in Russia means desperately wanting someone else to change it for you, which perfectly aligns with the apathy the Russian population is infamous for. If Putin somehow became unable to provide the population with food for three days, or pay his security team, you'd all quickly discover what desperately means, and I'm confident the problem would resolve itself quickly. Your population's apathy has become the whole world's problem. pls fix.
    - grishka 2y ago
      So what, exactly, is your suggestion? "Do something"?
      - brokenmachine 2y ago
        Yes, precisely that.
        grishka 2y ago
        And nothing more concrete?
        brokenmachine 2y ago
        Not sure what concrete advice you expect me to write here in a public comment. I'm not in Russia, only started learning about Russia 3 years ago, and know nothing about you. I presume you're good with computers so have the ability to access (and distribute) information that others may not. There's historical precedent, research how people have fought oppression in the past. Many books and manuals have been written about how this is done. You may be able to access forums where like minded people can discuss and possibly work together. Obviously stay as safe as you can. "Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful, committed citizens can change the world; indeed, it's the only thing that ever has. We must remember that one determined person can make a significant difference, and that a small group of determined people can change the course of history." You're the best one to know what you can achieve - but I can tell you this, it's not nothing. Anything that makes the mechanisms of oppression less efficient is a step in the right direction. Every mechanism has weak points, leaky abstractions and incomplete assumptions. Find them.
        grishka 2y ago
        There is no problem with access to information. Everyone who wants to access government-blocked resources knows how to do so. The problem is that political change can't happen on the internet. And as soon as anyone tries to do something — anything — to that end in the real world, they face very real and fierce repression. The consensus among most of the opposition-minded people at this point it that it's just better to wait it out because there's currently no opportunity for change.

nullifidian 2y ago

>So political change in russia is literally impossible Precisely. It's basically impossible. There has to be at least be a generational change, or a severe economic / military loss if we are talking about this decade, but even that isn't a guarantee since the system is perpetuating itself with force, with economic self-interest to continue doing so. Isolating Russian citizens from western sources of information (in addition to what the Russian government is already doing by itself) is not only not helping, it's counterproductive, since rejection engenders a rejection in return, lowering the probability that an inflection point in the Russian history would result in anything western. >countries change Authoritarian countries change when their enforcement class relaxes and loses control. It takes decades for it to occur. If there is no relaxation, then no change occurs, as demonstrated by numerous countries, not only Russia. Right now the control and propaganda are very tight. "Wanting to make change" publicly is literally a life-threatening activity.