4 ms·

Seems odd to exclude PHEVs. Most rides are under 50 miles, which means emission-free rides on most occasions. They don't hound chargers and need smaller batter

by screye 2y ago

Seems odd to exclude PHEVs. Most rides are under 50 miles, which means emission-free rides on most occasions. They don't hound chargers and need smaller batteries. Win-win if you ask me.

toomuchtodo 2y ago
They burn fossil fuels forever. EVs get greener as the grid approaches 100% low carbon energy, which will happen based on all available trajectory data. If cell manufacturing is the supply constraint, continue to scale up.
- dzhiurgis 2y ago
  > If cell manufacturing is the supply constraint It hasn’t been for few years now
giantg2 2y ago
In my opinion, if we're banning ads for certain types of cars, we should ban ads for all cars. Tires, brakes, roads, manufacturing related pollution, etc are substantial for all. It just seems like feel-good legislation when we ignore the obvious.
- screye 2y ago
  Good call. If I remember right, then tire-wear [1] is the primary contributor to particulate emissions and a signifcant portion of vehicular pollution comes from the existence of the vehicle itself. (manufacturing, road maintenence) [1] https://dynomight.net/tires/ https://dynomight.net/tires/
- tzs 2y ago
  Personal cars are not going away anytime soon. All of the problems you mention are much less important than dealing with CO₂ and so more good is accomplished by allowing advertising to influence those who are going to buy cars to buy those that are lower when it comes to CO₂.
  - giantg2 2y ago
    I think you're missing that those things involve CO2 as well. While CO2 is important, it's level of importance as ranked against other concerns is largely based on one's opinion.
pyr0hu 2y ago
Issues with PHEV in my experience that people CBA to charge their car when the battery depletes and will treat their cars as if they are ICE only. And in that case they just weigh more, put more pressure on the road and the battery takes up quite the bit of cargo space.
- mathgradthrow 2y ago
  Why are people making this claim?
  - toomuchtodo 2y ago
    PHEVs have the potential to lower emissions, but humans are lazy based on the data. Ergo, you have to engineer around the human (support BEVs, do not support PHEVs through policy). https://cars.usnews.com/cars-trucks/features/phev-owners-not-plugging-in https://cars.usnews.com/cars-trucks/features/phev-owners-not... https://blog.ucsusa.org/dave-reichmuth/plug-in-hybrids-are-they-really-a-solution-to-reducing-emissions/ https://blog.ucsusa.org/dave-reichmuth/plug-in-hybrids-are-t...
    - mathgradthrow 2y ago
      I don't think these studies are saying what you think they are. The incentives are clear for a PHEV that you can plug in yourself in your home. its cheaper and not hard to do. This is a very strong prior, and with a little digging you can find out that these cars are being bought by tax credits, and then used by people who do not have access to chargers. Either because it is a rental or because it is a company car. If it is a company car, the reimbursement process for gas is easier, and why would I go through the hassle if I'm not the one saving money? The case for PHEVs is very strong, it is a much more economical use of lithium battery capacity, is cheaper to operate, produces less CO2, and can be operated like an ICE vehicle in a pinch. They strategically dominate EVs. Its absurd to suggest otherwise
      - deleted 2y ago
        [deleted]
deepsun 2y ago
I rented a PHEV in France (Paris area) recently. Electricity is more expensive than gas, and even though I wanted to pay extra in most towns there was no charging stations. So I mostly drove it on gas.
- screye 2y ago
  Isn't this a major win for the PHEV ? Through regenerative braking, so you get the benfits of a Hybrid. You can charge your PHEV at home during the week, and avoid the inconvienences of an EV when on a road trip.
  - deepsun 2y ago
    Well, yes, mileage was very good indeed.
qball 2y ago
>Seems odd to exclude PHEVs. Not if this is just in service of an overarching goal of banning cars entirely.

by screye 2y ago

Seems odd to exclude PHEVs. Most rides are under 50 miles, which means emission-free rides on most occasions. They don't hound chargers and need smaller batteries. Win-win if you ask me.

toomuchtodo 2y ago

They burn fossil fuels forever. EVs get greener as the grid approaches 100% low carbon energy, which will happen based on all available trajectory data. If cell manufacturing is the supply constraint, continue to scale up.

dzhiurgis 2y ago
> If cell manufacturing is the supply constraint It hasn’t been for few years now

giantg2 2y ago

In my opinion, if we're banning ads for certain types of cars, we should ban ads for all cars. Tires, brakes, roads, manufacturing related pollution, etc are substantial for all. It just seems like feel-good legislation when we ignore the obvious.

screye 2y ago
Good call. If I remember right, then tire-wear [1] is the primary contributor to particulate emissions and a signifcant portion of vehicular pollution comes from the existence of the vehicle itself. (manufacturing, road maintenence) [1] https://dynomight.net/tires/ https://dynomight.net/tires/
tzs 2y ago
Personal cars are not going away anytime soon. All of the problems you mention are much less important than dealing with CO₂ and so more good is accomplished by allowing advertising to influence those who are going to buy cars to buy those that are lower when it comes to CO₂.
- giantg2 2y ago
  I think you're missing that those things involve CO2 as well. While CO2 is important, it's level of importance as ranked against other concerns is largely based on one's opinion.

pyr0hu 2y ago

Issues with PHEV in my experience that people CBA to charge their car when the battery depletes and will treat their cars as if they are ICE only. And in that case they just weigh more, put more pressure on the road and the battery takes up quite the bit of cargo space.

mathgradthrow 2y ago
Why are people making this claim?
- toomuchtodo 2y ago
  PHEVs have the potential to lower emissions, but humans are lazy based on the data. Ergo, you have to engineer around the human (support BEVs, do not support PHEVs through policy). https://cars.usnews.com/cars-trucks/features/phev-owners-not-plugging-in https://cars.usnews.com/cars-trucks/features/phev-owners-not... https://blog.ucsusa.org/dave-reichmuth/plug-in-hybrids-are-they-really-a-solution-to-reducing-emissions/ https://blog.ucsusa.org/dave-reichmuth/plug-in-hybrids-are-t...
  - mathgradthrow 2y ago
    I don't think these studies are saying what you think they are. The incentives are clear for a PHEV that you can plug in yourself in your home. its cheaper and not hard to do. This is a very strong prior, and with a little digging you can find out that these cars are being bought by tax credits, and then used by people who do not have access to chargers. Either because it is a rental or because it is a company car. If it is a company car, the reimbursement process for gas is easier, and why would I go through the hassle if I'm not the one saving money? The case for PHEVs is very strong, it is a much more economical use of lithium battery capacity, is cheaper to operate, produces less CO2, and can be operated like an ICE vehicle in a pinch. They strategically dominate EVs. Its absurd to suggest otherwise
    - deleted 2y ago
      [deleted]

deepsun 2y ago

I rented a PHEV in France (Paris area) recently. Electricity is more expensive than gas, and even though I wanted to pay extra in most towns there was no charging stations. So I mostly drove it on gas.

screye 2y ago
Isn't this a major win for the PHEV ? Through regenerative braking, so you get the benfits of a Hybrid. You can charge your PHEV at home during the week, and avoid the inconvienences of an EV when on a road trip.
- deepsun 2y ago
  Well, yes, mileage was very good indeed.

qball 2y ago

>Seems odd to exclude PHEVs. Not if this is just in service of an overarching goal of banning cars entirely.