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I have FSD v12 and for my drives, in my part of the country, I have to do a mild safety intervention maybe once a week (like, getting closer to another car than

by drcode 2y ago

I have FSD v12 and for my drives, in my part of the country, I have to do a mild safety intervention maybe once a week (like, getting closer to another car than I'm comfortable with) sorry other people are having different experiences, but FSD is a significant quality of life improvement for me. Nothing is nicer than getting in the car after a long day and letting it chauffeur me home. (yes I still pay attention)

phantompeace 2y ago
Nothing beats standing up after my day’s ended and walking to the living room ;)
- drcode 2y ago
  I retired a long time ago, but agree working from home rocks
- m463 2y ago
  I will sell you the pentultimate AI to navigate. It will prevent dangerous sitations like: - entering a room and stopping abruptly while wondering why you entered. - stepping on legos. - the coffee table shin scenario.
rjh29 2y ago
People who drive often find basic driving "automatic"; if you still need to be vigilant, maybe even hypervigilant because you're not personally driving the car, what's the advantage?
- drcode 2y ago
  Maybe I'm just a bad driver, but it feels much safer to me having two entities paying attention, instead of just one It's much more comfortable not to have to micromanage the exact position of the car at every moment, as a manual driver does I think your "automatic driving" argument is wishful thinking
  - throwup238 2y ago
    > I think your "automatic driving" argument is wishful thinking See https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Highway_hypnosis https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Highway_hypnosis and https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Automaticity https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Automaticity It’s a well known phenomenon.
    - drcode 2y ago
      I don't dispute that people get used to driving, but I think arguing that "driving" requires the same amount of effort as "not driving" is a more specious claim
      - schmuelio 2y ago
        > I think arguing that "driving" requires the same amount of effort as "not driving" is a more specious claim It's really not, the human brain is _really_ good at abstracting. In pretty much exactly the same way you don't have to pay attention to balancing to walk, your brain learns to do the same thing for cycling and driving. It abstracts the mechanics of the car (e.g. turning the wheel to turn left/right) and sort of extends its view of your "body" to the car. This isn't an instantaneous process of course, it takes time to build up that abstraction, but it absolutely exists. If your brain wasn't good at doing those types of abstractions then walking/running/typing/speaking/breathing/etc. would take a phenomenal amount of attention and practice.
        jfoster 2y ago
        Do you have a theory as to why drcode feels "FSD is a significant quality of life improvement for me"?
        throwup238 2y ago
        Different people have different abilities, just like with literally everything else. For some people it’s easier to zone out and drive on auto, for others its easier to use FSD. Some people find it easy to zone out in bumper to bumper traffic, others not so much.
- yreg 2y ago
  >People who drive often find basic driving "automatic" And yet most of us like cruise control and lane keeping.
- kemiller 2y ago
  You don’t have to be hypervigilant. And in particular you don’t have to pay attention to basic lane keeping, which frees your attention to scanning ahead for potential issues. Not sure if or when it’ll ever be truly autonomous but it’s still a huge value as is. Maybe not $12k like they tried for a while, but significant
lucianbr 2y ago
I wonder if the guy who died when his Telsa drove under a truck would have written a similar comment the day before. What do you think? I mean this one: https://www.washingtonpost.com/technology/interactive/2023/tesla-autopilot-crash-analysis/ https://www.washingtonpost.com/technology/interactive/2023/t...
- drcode 2y ago
  Please stop using anecdotes and provide safety statistics in your argument, like this: https://electrek.co/wp-content/uploads/sites/3/2023/10/Tesla-safety-report.jpg?quality=82&strip=all https://electrek.co/wp-content/uploads/sites/3/2023/10/Tesla...
  - zwerdlds 2y ago
    But... Your comment was an anecdote too?
    - drcode 2y ago
      safety arguments need to be statistical in nature there's no such thing as perfect safety
  - TheAlchemist 2y ago
    If you care about statistics, you would check those numbers, and find that they are basically bullshit. Tesla does not release any verifiable data on FSD / Autopilot, and for a good reason (good for them).
    - drcode 2y ago
      They're legally required to provide accurate accident data to the government, that's what these figures are based on If you have information that Tesla is faking statistics it's giving to the government, you should make your evidence public
      - 2y ago
qsdf38100 2y ago
Still paying attention? With a "chauffeur" you don’t have to, that’s the point. Isn’t that a obvious?? Also you’re not personally responsible if your chauffeur has an accident. The Elon miracle, he scams you, but you still defend him and pretend like you’re happy with the scam. "In less than a year you’ll be able to get from New York to San Francisco during your sleep". That was in 2016. 8 years later, he says "robotaxi" and people still believe him. It’s a world scale Stockholm syndrome.
- drcode 2y ago
  nobody is forcing you to spend your money on things you don't like if you don't pay attention when you're driving with a taxi/Uber/chauffeur, that doesn't seem very smart
  - qsdf38100 2y ago
    Again, not paying attention to your chauffeur and the road situation is the point of having a chauffeur.
- qarl 2y ago
  > It’s a world scale Stockholm syndrome. There are a lot of those these days.
bufferoverflow 2y ago
Most people criticizing FSD here have never tried it, never even driven a Tesla. It's just pure derangement. The latest FSD is pretty damn good.
- tverbeure 2y ago
  Except for the cases where it takes the wrong exit, the wrong lane, starts oscillating, and ignores a don’t-turn-on-right. And that was in the first 3 of 3 tests. As the author of this blog post: I drive a Tesla, I tried FSD, and it failed miserably in near perfect conditions. How exactly is that derangement?

by drcode 2y ago

phantompeace 2y ago

Nothing beats standing up after my day’s ended and walking to the living room ;)

drcode 2y ago
I retired a long time ago, but agree working from home rocks
m463 2y ago
I will sell you the pentultimate AI to navigate. It will prevent dangerous sitations like: - entering a room and stopping abruptly while wondering why you entered. - stepping on legos. - the coffee table shin scenario.

rjh29 2y ago

People who drive often find basic driving "automatic"; if you still need to be vigilant, maybe even hypervigilant because you're not personally driving the car, what's the advantage?

drcode 2y ago
Maybe I'm just a bad driver, but it feels much safer to me having two entities paying attention, instead of just one It's much more comfortable not to have to micromanage the exact position of the car at every moment, as a manual driver does I think your "automatic driving" argument is wishful thinking
- throwup238 2y ago
  > I think your "automatic driving" argument is wishful thinking See https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Highway_hypnosis https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Highway_hypnosis and https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Automaticity https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Automaticity It’s a well known phenomenon.
  - drcode 2y ago
    I don't dispute that people get used to driving, but I think arguing that "driving" requires the same amount of effort as "not driving" is a more specious claim
    - schmuelio 2y ago
      > I think arguing that "driving" requires the same amount of effort as "not driving" is a more specious claim It's really not, the human brain is _really_ good at abstracting. In pretty much exactly the same way you don't have to pay attention to balancing to walk, your brain learns to do the same thing for cycling and driving. It abstracts the mechanics of the car (e.g. turning the wheel to turn left/right) and sort of extends its view of your "body" to the car. This isn't an instantaneous process of course, it takes time to build up that abstraction, but it absolutely exists. If your brain wasn't good at doing those types of abstractions then walking/running/typing/speaking/breathing/etc. would take a phenomenal amount of attention and practice.
      - jfoster 2y ago
        Do you have a theory as to why drcode feels "FSD is a significant quality of life improvement for me"?
        throwup238 2y ago
        Different people have different abilities, just like with literally everything else. For some people it’s easier to zone out and drive on auto, for others its easier to use FSD. Some people find it easy to zone out in bumper to bumper traffic, others not so much.
yreg 2y ago
>People who drive often find basic driving "automatic" And yet most of us like cruise control and lane keeping.
kemiller 2y ago
You don’t have to be hypervigilant. And in particular you don’t have to pay attention to basic lane keeping, which frees your attention to scanning ahead for potential issues. Not sure if or when it’ll ever be truly autonomous but it’s still a huge value as is. Maybe not $12k like they tried for a while, but significant

lucianbr 2y ago

I wonder if the guy who died when his Telsa drove under a truck would have written a similar comment the day before. What do you think? I mean this one: https://www.washingtonpost.com/technology/interactive/2023/tesla-autopilot-crash-analysis/ https://www.washingtonpost.com/technology/interactive/2023/t...

drcode 2y ago
Please stop using anecdotes and provide safety statistics in your argument, like this: https://electrek.co/wp-content/uploads/sites/3/2023/10/Tesla-safety-report.jpg?quality=82&strip=all https://electrek.co/wp-content/uploads/sites/3/2023/10/Tesla...
- zwerdlds 2y ago
  But... Your comment was an anecdote too?
  - drcode 2y ago
    safety arguments need to be statistical in nature there's no such thing as perfect safety
- TheAlchemist 2y ago
  If you care about statistics, you would check those numbers, and find that they are basically bullshit. Tesla does not release any verifiable data on FSD / Autopilot, and for a good reason (good for them).
  - drcode 2y ago
    They're legally required to provide accurate accident data to the government, that's what these figures are based on If you have information that Tesla is faking statistics it's giving to the government, you should make your evidence public
    - 2y ago

qsdf38100 2y ago

Still paying attention? With a "chauffeur" you don’t have to, that’s the point. Isn’t that a obvious?? Also you’re not personally responsible if your chauffeur has an accident. The Elon miracle, he scams you, but you still defend him and pretend like you’re happy with the scam. "In less than a year you’ll be able to get from New York to San Francisco during your sleep". That was in 2016. 8 years later, he says "robotaxi" and people still believe him. It’s a world scale Stockholm syndrome.

drcode 2y ago
nobody is forcing you to spend your money on things you don't like if you don't pay attention when you're driving with a taxi/Uber/chauffeur, that doesn't seem very smart
- qsdf38100 2y ago
  Again, not paying attention to your chauffeur and the road situation is the point of having a chauffeur.
qarl 2y ago
> It’s a world scale Stockholm syndrome. There are a lot of those these days.

bufferoverflow 2y ago

Most people criticizing FSD here have never tried it, never even driven a Tesla. It's just pure derangement. The latest FSD is pretty damn good.

tverbeure 2y ago
Except for the cases where it takes the wrong exit, the wrong lane, starts oscillating, and ignores a don’t-turn-on-right. And that was in the first 3 of 3 tests. As the author of this blog post: I drive a Tesla, I tried FSD, and it failed miserably in near perfect conditions. How exactly is that derangement?