4 ms·

Is this another in the string of 737 MAX issues? Or would other aircraft have experienced the same event under the same conditions? Edit: Aplogies for asking a

Is this another in the string of 737 MAX issues? Or would other aircraft have experienced the same event under the same conditions? Edit: Aplogies for asking about content that was obvious, but behind a paywall. Thanks to the archive link shared, it sounds like it was (inexperienced) human error.

CaliforniaKarl 2y ago
It’s weather-related, not 737-related.
- taylodl 2y ago
  We'll see what the FAA finds. The United flight in 2022 was deemed to be weather-related, not this flight. It's still undergoing investigation.
  - lxgr 2y ago
    Do you mean UAL1722 (December 2022)? That was miscommunication between the pilots and a resulting incorrect flaps setting, not weather: https://www.flightradar24.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2023/08/NTSB_United_777_Altitude_Final_Report.pdf https://www.flightradar24.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2023/0...
    - taylodl 2y ago
      That was determined after an independent investigation by both the FAA and NTSB. This incident hasn't been investigated by anyone but Southwest Airlines.
  - therobots927 2y ago
    Shouldn’t this be the NTSB’s job?
- bobwaycott 2y ago
  My apologies for asking the question when I could only read the first two paragraphs due to paywall. The archive link shared cleared up my concern, and makes it clear that it was human error during a weather-related re-approach. Thanks, though!
- barbazoo 2y ago
  Where does it say it's weather related? > The captain opted to put the “newer” first officer in command on the short flight to Lihue despite the forecasts, according to the memo. The less-experienced first officer “inadvertently” pushed forward on the control column, then cut the speed causing the airplane to descend. Soon after, a warning system sounded alarms the jet was getting too close to the surface and the captain ordered the first officer to increase thrust. The plane then “climbed aggressively” at 8,500 feet per minute, the memo said.
jjulius 2y ago
Article makes it clear it was human error.
- bobwaycott 2y ago
  My bad. The article makes that clear behind a paywall. I could only read the first two paragraphs before I asked the question. Luckily the archive link shared had the full text and I was able to read the full incident description. Thank you!
taylodl 2y ago
If it's Boeing, I ain't going! Seriously, after seeing several Boeing engineers saying they wouldn't fly on a Boeing aircraft, and seeing how their management has handled their crises, I'm not flying Boeing. That company needs a major restructure and "come to Jesus" moment before I'll ever trust them again. So far, that isn't even on the horizon.
- philsnow 2y ago
  I've had similar thoughts, but how does that work for you in practice? If you book a flight that says it's an airbus plane and then you show up and the airline had to sub in a boeing plane, do you just cancel your trip? If you don't have the expensive tickets that allow same-day rebooking, I can't imagine any airline would humor an attempt to get a refund or to have them waive a rebooking fee. Similarly if you're traveling for business and your company has paid for the ticket, some companies let you book your own travel and then get it reimbursed, but presumably you're needed at the destination so if the day of travel comes and the plane is an airbus and you "nope" out of there, you're going to have to hope that your work is okay with your explanation. All of this is because "if it's boeing, I ain't going" can seem alarmist or reactionary since the FAA has so far declined to drop the hammer on them.
  - taylodl 2y ago
    In practice, you can only (reasonably) minimize your odds of flying on Boeing. That means "no" to Southwest Airlines. It means "yes" to Frontier Airlines, whose entire fleet consists only of Airbus planes. Thank goodness where I'm located and often need to go to are well-served by Frontier Airlines! BUT - many airlines operate a mixed fleet. Book on an Airbus. They rarely change planes, but if they do, say your prayers! Unless you have tickets easily allowing you to re-book, which most of us aren't purchasing.
    - rootusrootus 2y ago
      That's a tough one. I care more about the airline than the airliner, and Frontier definitely is not near the top of my list.

CaliforniaKarl 2y ago

It’s weather-related, not 737-related.

taylodl 2y ago
We'll see what the FAA finds. The United flight in 2022 was deemed to be weather-related, not this flight. It's still undergoing investigation.
- lxgr 2y ago
  Do you mean UAL1722 (December 2022)? That was miscommunication between the pilots and a resulting incorrect flaps setting, not weather: https://www.flightradar24.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2023/08/NTSB_United_777_Altitude_Final_Report.pdf https://www.flightradar24.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2023/0...
  - taylodl 2y ago
    That was determined after an independent investigation by both the FAA and NTSB. This incident hasn't been investigated by anyone but Southwest Airlines.
- therobots927 2y ago
  Shouldn’t this be the NTSB’s job?
bobwaycott 2y ago
My apologies for asking the question when I could only read the first two paragraphs due to paywall. The archive link shared cleared up my concern, and makes it clear that it was human error during a weather-related re-approach. Thanks, though!
barbazoo 2y ago
Where does it say it's weather related? > The captain opted to put the “newer” first officer in command on the short flight to Lihue despite the forecasts, according to the memo. The less-experienced first officer “inadvertently” pushed forward on the control column, then cut the speed causing the airplane to descend. Soon after, a warning system sounded alarms the jet was getting too close to the surface and the captain ordered the first officer to increase thrust. The plane then “climbed aggressively” at 8,500 feet per minute, the memo said.

jjulius 2y ago

Article makes it clear it was human error.

bobwaycott 2y ago
My bad. The article makes that clear behind a paywall. I could only read the first two paragraphs before I asked the question. Luckily the archive link shared had the full text and I was able to read the full incident description. Thank you!

taylodl 2y ago

If it's Boeing, I ain't going! Seriously, after seeing several Boeing engineers saying they wouldn't fly on a Boeing aircraft, and seeing how their management has handled their crises, I'm not flying Boeing. That company needs a major restructure and "come to Jesus" moment before I'll ever trust them again. So far, that isn't even on the horizon.

philsnow 2y ago
I've had similar thoughts, but how does that work for you in practice? If you book a flight that says it's an airbus plane and then you show up and the airline had to sub in a boeing plane, do you just cancel your trip? If you don't have the expensive tickets that allow same-day rebooking, I can't imagine any airline would humor an attempt to get a refund or to have them waive a rebooking fee. Similarly if you're traveling for business and your company has paid for the ticket, some companies let you book your own travel and then get it reimbursed, but presumably you're needed at the destination so if the day of travel comes and the plane is an airbus and you "nope" out of there, you're going to have to hope that your work is okay with your explanation. All of this is because "if it's boeing, I ain't going" can seem alarmist or reactionary since the FAA has so far declined to drop the hammer on them.
- taylodl 2y ago
  In practice, you can only (reasonably) minimize your odds of flying on Boeing. That means "no" to Southwest Airlines. It means "yes" to Frontier Airlines, whose entire fleet consists only of Airbus planes. Thank goodness where I'm located and often need to go to are well-served by Frontier Airlines! BUT - many airlines operate a mixed fleet. Book on an Airbus. They rarely change planes, but if they do, say your prayers! Unless you have tickets easily allowing you to re-book, which most of us aren't purchasing.
  - rootusrootus 2y ago
    That's a tough one. I care more about the airline than the airliner, and Frontier definitely is not near the top of my list.