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So they are giving Musk ~8% of their current market cap. I guess the logic from shareholders is "if we don't approve the package, the stock is likely to drop mo

So they are giving Musk ~8% of their current market cap. I guess the logic from shareholders is "if we don't approve the package, the stock is likely to drop more than 10%". I don't know exactly how the vote was carried out... but I do wonder if the vote was manipulated in any way.

jauntywundrkind 2y ago
The funny part is the original case that got Elon's pay package revoked was that the board was around the board not being independent enough. So the same board going & reapproving a pay package doesn't seem like real remedy for the case against Elon's pay package. > Judge Kathaleen McCormick threw out Musk’s pay package in January, ruling that the board members had been insufficiently independent from the Tesla CEO while negotiating the package. https://www.theguardian.com/technology/article/2024/jun/14/elon-musks-45bn-tesla-pay-package-not-a-done-deal-say-legal-experts https://www.theguardian.com/technology/article/2024/jun/14/e... If this stock starts being liquidated at any significant volume, the stock will also definitely drop. Even if these holdings are to be doled out & possible exercised, it sure seems like the company could hire & keep a lot of great people with this stock holding.
- JamesBarney 2y ago
  But the shareholders voted for it again. If the board and shareholders all agree to pay the CEO a share of their money, who some judge in delaware to disagree. > If this stock starts being liquidated at any significant volume, the stock will also definitely drop. Even if these holdings are to be doled out & possible exercised, it sure seems like the company could hire & keep a lot of great people with this stock holding. Yeah but maybe not Elon, and I believe based on this vote the shareholders fear losing him.
  - jauntywundrkind 2y ago
    If he illegally appoints a board of yes men who remain faithful to him, then it doesn't matter how the board votes: it's not a legal & legitimate board looking out for the company as a whole. That case has already been decided. And the board re-voting doesn't change that outcome.
    - JamesBarney 2y ago
      Maybe you missed this but it was the shareholders who voted for it again. Not just the board members. The concern was that even though the shareholders were fully aware of the package and voted for it maybe they relied on the expertise of the board to make sure it was a fair package.
    - JamesBarney 2y ago
      Also he didn't illegally appoint the board. That was not the issue in this case.
- peterisza 2y ago
  He was paid in stock options. He is not allowed sell the stock for 5 years after exercising. He hasn't exercised any of them so far. Here's the 2018 compensation plan: https://ml.globenewswire.com/Resource/Download/edfcfa2e-bcb6-43ed-ab53-4b08b3bf21ca?size=0 https://ml.globenewswire.com/Resource/Download/edfcfa2e-bcb6... It basically says that Elon doesn't get anything unless the stockholders at least 2x their investment, and Elon gets approximately 10% of the company if stockholders 10x their investment. Each tranch had revenue and EBITDA requirements as well, so it was not possible for Elon to just pump the stock. He achieved all the milestones: the company grew significantly, the stockholders 10x-ed their investment. The judge thought that the stockholders were not properly informed about the board in 2018. Now in 2024, not only have they been informed but they reelected Kimbal Musk as well. BTW this deal was the most stockholder-friendly deal ever, because Elon only got his compensation if the stockholders got rich. I think it was a good thing, the first of its kind. If they made a new package like this (+10% for another 10x from here), I would vote for it. Also worth mentioning that his compensation package was worth 2.3B in 2018 when the shares were separated. Also worth mentioning that everybody found the milestones ridiculous and unachievable in 2018.
  - yihtserns 2y ago
    > Also worth mentioning that everybody found the milestones ridiculous and unachievable in 2018. Who is "everybody"? Few months back I manage to find some old articles that basically said somebody said that, but none of those articles ever reported any names.
    - peterisza 2y ago
      Yeah, sorry, I shouldn't have written "everybody". I wasn't one of them! However, this was the common sentiment in 2018 as I remember it. Just like nowadays the general opinion is that Tesla FSD is at least 5 years away or will never work.

jauntywundrkind 2y ago

The funny part is the original case that got Elon's pay package revoked was that the board was around the board not being independent enough. So the same board going & reapproving a pay package doesn't seem like real remedy for the case against Elon's pay package. > Judge Kathaleen McCormick threw out Musk’s pay package in January, ruling that the board members had been insufficiently independent from the Tesla CEO while negotiating the package. https://www.theguardian.com/technology/article/2024/jun/14/elon-musks-45bn-tesla-pay-package-not-a-done-deal-say-legal-experts https://www.theguardian.com/technology/article/2024/jun/14/e... If this stock starts being liquidated at any significant volume, the stock will also definitely drop. Even if these holdings are to be doled out & possible exercised, it sure seems like the company could hire & keep a lot of great people with this stock holding.

JamesBarney 2y ago
But the shareholders voted for it again. If the board and shareholders all agree to pay the CEO a share of their money, who some judge in delaware to disagree. > If this stock starts being liquidated at any significant volume, the stock will also definitely drop. Even if these holdings are to be doled out & possible exercised, it sure seems like the company could hire & keep a lot of great people with this stock holding. Yeah but maybe not Elon, and I believe based on this vote the shareholders fear losing him.
- jauntywundrkind 2y ago
  If he illegally appoints a board of yes men who remain faithful to him, then it doesn't matter how the board votes: it's not a legal & legitimate board looking out for the company as a whole. That case has already been decided. And the board re-voting doesn't change that outcome.
  - JamesBarney 2y ago
    Maybe you missed this but it was the shareholders who voted for it again. Not just the board members. The concern was that even though the shareholders were fully aware of the package and voted for it maybe they relied on the expertise of the board to make sure it was a fair package.
  - JamesBarney 2y ago
    Also he didn't illegally appoint the board. That was not the issue in this case.
peterisza 2y ago
He was paid in stock options. He is not allowed sell the stock for 5 years after exercising. He hasn't exercised any of them so far. Here's the 2018 compensation plan: https://ml.globenewswire.com/Resource/Download/edfcfa2e-bcb6-43ed-ab53-4b08b3bf21ca?size=0 https://ml.globenewswire.com/Resource/Download/edfcfa2e-bcb6... It basically says that Elon doesn't get anything unless the stockholders at least 2x their investment, and Elon gets approximately 10% of the company if stockholders 10x their investment. Each tranch had revenue and EBITDA requirements as well, so it was not possible for Elon to just pump the stock. He achieved all the milestones: the company grew significantly, the stockholders 10x-ed their investment. The judge thought that the stockholders were not properly informed about the board in 2018. Now in 2024, not only have they been informed but they reelected Kimbal Musk as well. BTW this deal was the most stockholder-friendly deal ever, because Elon only got his compensation if the stockholders got rich. I think it was a good thing, the first of its kind. If they made a new package like this (+10% for another 10x from here), I would vote for it. Also worth mentioning that his compensation package was worth 2.3B in 2018 when the shares were separated. Also worth mentioning that everybody found the milestones ridiculous and unachievable in 2018.
- yihtserns 2y ago
  > Also worth mentioning that everybody found the milestones ridiculous and unachievable in 2018. Who is "everybody"? Few months back I manage to find some old articles that basically said somebody said that, but none of those articles ever reported any names.
  - peterisza 2y ago
    Yeah, sorry, I shouldn't have written "everybody". I wasn't one of them! However, this was the common sentiment in 2018 as I remember it. Just like nowadays the general opinion is that Tesla FSD is at least 5 years away or will never work.