4 ms·

It's a bit of an audience thing, but for a talk at a technical conference I tend to roll my eyes at introduction slides. I already chose to attend your talk, te

It's a bit of an audience thing, but for a talk at a technical conference I tend to roll my eyes at introduction slides. I already chose to attend your talk, telling me why it's interesting is preaching to the choir. And typical hacker ethic involves judging people by their skills, not their credentials. You can slip in a "btw I invented the thing we are talking about". But don't read me your CV, impress me with your insights. This isn't true in all contexts. Some audiences care a lot about credentials. And if people don't choose to be at your talk specifically you have to give enough context. But even then you are often better off catching their attention first, and once you got it bring it back to the introduction

foobarian 2y ago
I think there is a lot of cargo culting in presentations. Title slide? But of course we must have a title slide, that is the way. And an introduction, and motivation... everybody else has one!
- bee_rider 2y ago
  A motivation slide can be useful if you are giving a presentation to people who are more experienced than you (which, for any given audience, there ought to be some). It tells them what built in assumptions you made without being aware of.
- supplied_demand 2y ago
  The presentation may eventually be viewed by people who aren't in the room to hear you speak. In that instance, a title/intro slide makes perfect sense.
  - chatmasta 2y ago
    You don’t need to present from the same copy of the slides you distribute.
- mandevil 2y ago
  Slides have two distinct purposes: as a part of a presentation, and separately as a way to learn or review material outside of the presentation. Unfortunately they are at cross-purposes. For accompanying an oral presentation you don't want lots of data, you want a simple clear image that sync with what you are saying, and to change them rapidly. For learning outside the actual presentation, you want rich, detailed slides with lots of data on them, and leave them up for a while so people can absorb the information. Ideally, we would build two different decks, each optimized for their purpose. But no one has time for that, so people try and do both in one deck, generally going with lots of information except for one or two images keyed to specific jokes. And it makes the whole thing less effective.
  - andrecarini 2y ago
    Ideally you'd have slides purely for presentation, and an accompanying interactive self-contained HTML document for the documentation of the talk.
    - ghaff 2y ago
      And nobody wants to do both (or has the incentive to do both). I'll do sorta-both but probably in an informal way--e.g. article that grew out of a talk--or vice versa.
      - simonw 2y ago
        I've been doing annotated versions of my talks for a while, takes. Few hours of extra effort but greatly increases the impact the talk can have: https://simonwillison.net/tags/annotatedtalks/ https://simonwillison.net/tags/annotatedtalks/
        ghaff 2y ago
        Maybe it's because I write a lot but I reached the conclusion that if it makes sense to do an article/blog, I should do so rather than speaker notes--which make sense in handing off a presentation to someone else in a company setting but I'm less sold on, in general, as a personal thing.
- Minor49er 2y ago
  What you're saying makes sense, though "cargo culting" is not the right term here
  - digging 2y ago
    Right, that's just the normal way people learn to do something they haven't been trained or educated to do. Look at how other people successfully do it. You don't just discard every feature you don't immediately see the value of or you might jettison the important bits. Once you're more confident you understand the skill, you can drop the rituals you don't find useful.
    - hatthew 2y ago
      something something chesterton's fence
    - stoperaticless 2y ago
      So true. Some people are just allergic to accepting advise from others. (On the other hand best way to learn not to play with fire is to get burned)
  - aspenmayer 2y ago
    Counterpoint: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cargo_cult_programming https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cargo_cult_programming > Cargo cult programming is a style of computer programming characterized by the ritual inclusion of code or program structures that serve no real purpose. > Cargo cult programming can also refer to the practice of applying a design pattern or coding style blindly without understanding the reasons behind that design principle. Arguably, designing a presentation in a particular way out of habit or convention would fall under one or both of these definitions. It's a common vernacular usage. > As awareness of cargo cults spread in the West, they became a metaphor for empty promises and rituals, used most prominently by physicist Richard Feynman. The term "cargo-cult programming" appeared in version 2.5.1 of the Jargon File, a glossary of computing slang, released in January 1991.
    - 2y ago
- II2II 2y ago
  In many contexts, the title slide is there to let people know they are in the right place or to let people know what a presentation is about while they wait for things to begin. It is not necessarily a part of the talk itself. If it is up and the subject of discussion for the first five minute (or more!), I will agree that something has gone wrong.
ghaff 2y ago
Knowing your audience is a big thing in general. If the talk isn't to some large degree about your journey, that probably shouldn't be the focus. But also, face it, your talk isn't going to work for everyone. When I was doing a lot of keynotes, I'd get feedback on the same talk to the effect of "That was great. It really helped me understand $X" and "I was totally lost." Even given technical difficulty ratings, no one pays any attention.
hinkley 2y ago
I think the main value of the first two slides is: if you’ve done a lot of presentations it can be difficult to keep them straight. The first slide is really for you, to make sure you opened the right file.
- johannes1234321 2y ago
  The title slide I see more for the audience: You are in the right room (and there was no schedule change you missed) that's also why I try to keep the title on that slide as announced.

foobarian 2y ago

I think there is a lot of cargo culting in presentations. Title slide? But of course we must have a title slide, that is the way. And an introduction, and motivation... everybody else has one!

bee_rider 2y ago
A motivation slide can be useful if you are giving a presentation to people who are more experienced than you (which, for any given audience, there ought to be some). It tells them what built in assumptions you made without being aware of.
supplied_demand 2y ago
The presentation may eventually be viewed by people who aren't in the room to hear you speak. In that instance, a title/intro slide makes perfect sense.
- chatmasta 2y ago
  You don’t need to present from the same copy of the slides you distribute.
mandevil 2y ago
Slides have two distinct purposes: as a part of a presentation, and separately as a way to learn or review material outside of the presentation. Unfortunately they are at cross-purposes. For accompanying an oral presentation you don't want lots of data, you want a simple clear image that sync with what you are saying, and to change them rapidly. For learning outside the actual presentation, you want rich, detailed slides with lots of data on them, and leave them up for a while so people can absorb the information. Ideally, we would build two different decks, each optimized for their purpose. But no one has time for that, so people try and do both in one deck, generally going with lots of information except for one or two images keyed to specific jokes. And it makes the whole thing less effective.
- andrecarini 2y ago
  Ideally you'd have slides purely for presentation, and an accompanying interactive self-contained HTML document for the documentation of the talk.
  - ghaff 2y ago
    And nobody wants to do both (or has the incentive to do both). I'll do sorta-both but probably in an informal way--e.g. article that grew out of a talk--or vice versa.
    - simonw 2y ago
      I've been doing annotated versions of my talks for a while, takes. Few hours of extra effort but greatly increases the impact the talk can have: https://simonwillison.net/tags/annotatedtalks/ https://simonwillison.net/tags/annotatedtalks/
      - ghaff 2y ago
        Maybe it's because I write a lot but I reached the conclusion that if it makes sense to do an article/blog, I should do so rather than speaker notes--which make sense in handing off a presentation to someone else in a company setting but I'm less sold on, in general, as a personal thing.
Minor49er 2y ago
What you're saying makes sense, though "cargo culting" is not the right term here
- digging 2y ago
  Right, that's just the normal way people learn to do something they haven't been trained or educated to do. Look at how other people successfully do it. You don't just discard every feature you don't immediately see the value of or you might jettison the important bits. Once you're more confident you understand the skill, you can drop the rituals you don't find useful.
  - hatthew 2y ago
    something something chesterton's fence
  - stoperaticless 2y ago
    So true. Some people are just allergic to accepting advise from others. (On the other hand best way to learn not to play with fire is to get burned)
- aspenmayer 2y ago
  Counterpoint: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cargo_cult_programming https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cargo_cult_programming > Cargo cult programming is a style of computer programming characterized by the ritual inclusion of code or program structures that serve no real purpose. > Cargo cult programming can also refer to the practice of applying a design pattern or coding style blindly without understanding the reasons behind that design principle. Arguably, designing a presentation in a particular way out of habit or convention would fall under one or both of these definitions. It's a common vernacular usage. > As awareness of cargo cults spread in the West, they became a metaphor for empty promises and rituals, used most prominently by physicist Richard Feynman. The term "cargo-cult programming" appeared in version 2.5.1 of the Jargon File, a glossary of computing slang, released in January 1991.
  - 2y ago
II2II 2y ago
In many contexts, the title slide is there to let people know they are in the right place or to let people know what a presentation is about while they wait for things to begin. It is not necessarily a part of the talk itself. If it is up and the subject of discussion for the first five minute (or more!), I will agree that something has gone wrong.

ghaff 2y ago

Knowing your audience is a big thing in general. If the talk isn't to some large degree about your journey, that probably shouldn't be the focus. But also, face it, your talk isn't going to work for everyone. When I was doing a lot of keynotes, I'd get feedback on the same talk to the effect of "That was great. It really helped me understand $X" and "I was totally lost." Even given technical difficulty ratings, no one pays any attention.

hinkley 2y ago

I think the main value of the first two slides is: if you’ve done a lot of presentations it can be difficult to keep them straight. The first slide is really for you, to make sure you opened the right file.

johannes1234321 2y ago
The title slide I see more for the audience: You are in the right room (and there was no schedule change you missed) that's also why I try to keep the title on that slide as announced.