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I used to work in luxury automotive infotainment. The general feeling is that luxury customers want luxury level systems. EVs are still considered by the indust

I used to work in luxury automotive infotainment. The general feeling is that luxury customers want luxury level systems. EVs are still considered by the industry to be upper-level vehicles. Which is to say they still believe they’re catering to with more money. We’re not going to see a low-tech EV for a long time. In my opinion, we’re not ever going to see one. And respectfully to you and all the other folks here who feel like you, I don’t think you represent the average driver in this regard.

defrost 2y ago
> We’re not going to see a low-tech EV for a long time. Have a look at last years low end BYD domestic market EV offers, there's a crazy amount of choice in style, design, and no frills offerings. By "we" I'm guessing you mean the tariff protected domestic north american and european markets. The domestic BYD Seagull sells for under $10K USD on home soil and isn't being exported much ATM: https://www.drive.com.au/news/2023-byd-seagull-unveiled-not-for-australia/ https://www.drive.com.au/news/2023-byd-seagull-unveiled-not-... China spins out a lot of variations on a theme, there's bound to be limited run versions with little more than the absolute bare essentials to have a functional EV - the asian phone market is an indicator of the kind of range that is just not seen in the western markets.
- sircastor 2y ago
  > By "we" I'm guessing you mean the tariff protected domestic north american and european markets. Yes, I apologize for the western-centric approach there, though I would extend that position to the UAE and Saudi-Arabia. The NA OEMs are not interested in bringing very low-cost vehicles to market. And the low-cost OEMs from Europe haven’t really been able to reach the American market. aside from a very outlier products.
  - defrost 2y ago
    No drama. Odd aside, these days "low tech" (minimal effort, low cost) cars are going to have screens and control by wire interfaces for many things - it's 2024 and touch screens are a throw away disposable item compared to physical controls, tension cables, routing looms for every physical switch and interface light bulb, etc. In a sense the ideal notion of a "low tech car" is now a hand crafted artisan object.
    - dpeckett 2y ago
      Exactly this whole discussion hinges on the idea that modern vehicle interfaces are somehow "fancy". Touchscreens, ARM boards running Linux, CMOS camera sensors, and drive-by-wire (heck Tesla is even adopting Ethernet) are totally commoditized. They were fancy 30 years ago, but today they are the boring cheap option. It's pure nostalgia.
      - defrost 2y ago
        The nostalgia is understandably for fully user transparent, user controlled, "home" repairable cars .. which is understandable and a goal I'd like to see in EV's. Open source code, no phone home or hidden backdoors, optionally no wireless or external connectivity other than by on board physical port, etc. Cars of yore have car manuals, manifolds and heads can be replaced with official parts or scrap yard parts or third party vendor alternatives, etc. I use EV's for work related applications, I'm still holding off a personal EV until I can find something in Australia that fits my list. Until then I do most local area travel via walking, electric scooter, or homebuilt EV trike with basket for shopping - there's a Land Cruiser for the rural trips and hauling loads but that's more a once per week driver.
        shiroiushi 2y ago
        >Cars of yore have car manuals No, most cars of yore only had manuals available to dealership technicians, and no one else. Genuine manufacturer-made manuals were difficult or impossible to find. Everyone else bought Haynes or Chilton "manuals" which were really done by reverse-engineering.
        fragmede 2y ago
        If you go back to before 2001 with Google and BitTorrent, sure. Things did get easier with those. Full manufacturer service manuals getting leaked to the pirate bay for popular cars, not just the Haynes/Chilton manuals, though those were certainly there too.
        2y ago

defrost 2y ago

> We’re not going to see a low-tech EV for a long time. Have a look at last years low end BYD domestic market EV offers, there's a crazy amount of choice in style, design, and no frills offerings. By "we" I'm guessing you mean the tariff protected domestic north american and european markets. The domestic BYD Seagull sells for under $10K USD on home soil and isn't being exported much ATM: https://www.drive.com.au/news/2023-byd-seagull-unveiled-not-for-australia/ https://www.drive.com.au/news/2023-byd-seagull-unveiled-not-... China spins out a lot of variations on a theme, there's bound to be limited run versions with little more than the absolute bare essentials to have a functional EV - the asian phone market is an indicator of the kind of range that is just not seen in the western markets.

sircastor 2y ago
> By "we" I'm guessing you mean the tariff protected domestic north american and european markets. Yes, I apologize for the western-centric approach there, though I would extend that position to the UAE and Saudi-Arabia. The NA OEMs are not interested in bringing very low-cost vehicles to market. And the low-cost OEMs from Europe haven’t really been able to reach the American market. aside from a very outlier products.
- defrost 2y ago
  No drama. Odd aside, these days "low tech" (minimal effort, low cost) cars are going to have screens and control by wire interfaces for many things - it's 2024 and touch screens are a throw away disposable item compared to physical controls, tension cables, routing looms for every physical switch and interface light bulb, etc. In a sense the ideal notion of a "low tech car" is now a hand crafted artisan object.
  - dpeckett 2y ago
    Exactly this whole discussion hinges on the idea that modern vehicle interfaces are somehow "fancy". Touchscreens, ARM boards running Linux, CMOS camera sensors, and drive-by-wire (heck Tesla is even adopting Ethernet) are totally commoditized. They were fancy 30 years ago, but today they are the boring cheap option. It's pure nostalgia.
    - defrost 2y ago
      The nostalgia is understandably for fully user transparent, user controlled, "home" repairable cars .. which is understandable and a goal I'd like to see in EV's. Open source code, no phone home or hidden backdoors, optionally no wireless or external connectivity other than by on board physical port, etc. Cars of yore have car manuals, manifolds and heads can be replaced with official parts or scrap yard parts or third party vendor alternatives, etc. I use EV's for work related applications, I'm still holding off a personal EV until I can find something in Australia that fits my list. Until then I do most local area travel via walking, electric scooter, or homebuilt EV trike with basket for shopping - there's a Land Cruiser for the rural trips and hauling loads but that's more a once per week driver.
      - shiroiushi 2y ago
        >Cars of yore have car manuals No, most cars of yore only had manuals available to dealership technicians, and no one else. Genuine manufacturer-made manuals were difficult or impossible to find. Everyone else bought Haynes or Chilton "manuals" which were really done by reverse-engineering.
        fragmede 2y ago
        If you go back to before 2001 with Google and BitTorrent, sure. Things did get easier with those. Full manufacturer service manuals getting leaked to the pirate bay for popular cars, not just the Haynes/Chilton manuals, though those were certainly there too.
        2y ago