4 ms·

Finding New Pastures: Big Nerd Ranch's Next Chapter

76 points by zdw 2y ago

natch 2y ago
Did I miss the why? Or was it not stated? Closest I see is that “the landscape of tech education has evolved.” I agree but it would be interesting to hear more of their take.
- downrightmike 2y ago
  Bootcamps don't have anywhere near the quality employers want and they all get lumped together. Its worth less that the University of Phoenix.
  - wordToDaBird 2y ago
    They used to be a wonderful place for a company that needs to upskill their employees on a tech stack quickly. But, those books though. There books seduced my soul to the depth of knowledge and intricate nature to the mobile ecosystem. I legitimately can’t think of books that were better on mobile.
    - musicale 2y ago
      Agreed - their books were/are inspiring. I think we need books more than ever for iOS and macOS since Apple's documentation doesn't seem to be as good as it used to be.
      - _mlbt 2y ago
        It seems that Apple intends people to mostly use WWDC videos to learn their newest tech.
  - sircastor 2y ago
    Big Nerd Ranch was running boot camps long before the crop of web dev camps that came up in the last little while. It really was a way you could get into Mac OS X and iOS dev early on. Beyond that, it felt like the best way was to have already been an OpenStep developer.
shrubble 2y ago
I assume they got nailed by the combination of covid travel restrictions followed by the pause in tech hirings/layoffs. Looks like at some point they got acquired, also have an arm that does custom design and app development; possibly that simply pays better.
- deleted 2y ago
  [deleted]
wordToDaBird 2y ago
I have read 4/5 of their books. and 4 editions of the Big Nerd Ranch Android Development, 2 of the Big Nerd Ranch iOS Programming. I found those books exemplary with their quality and depth of the topics with which they taught. I would put the technical guides of similar quality to O’Reilly, and I want to say better than Pakt and I like Pakt. I am sad to see this go. I read the first one of their books when I was less than a year in the industry.
- danpalmer 2y ago
  I wholeheartedly agree on the quality of BNR books, but I’ve always found Pakt to be pretty poor. I consider Pakt books to be overpriced even when 90% off in some big bundle. If you’re getting value out of them, great, I don’t want to diminish that, but for anyone considering them, there are far better options. I say this having been a technical reviewer on a Pakt book. It was filled with errors, surface level, poorly written and edited, and my main feedback was ignored because it would have added 10 pages, even though it would also have significantly improved the learning outcomes of the book for the specific topic it was about.
  - BrentOzar 2y ago
    To anyone considering writing for Pakt, you owe it to yourself to read any random 5 of their books, and then consider whether you want your name to be attached to that reputation. The books really are that bad. I think less of someone when I know they've written a book for Pakt.
    - danpalmer 2y ago
      I tech-reviewed "Node Security". It was something like 7 chapters, where each chapter basically took 1 popular at the time Node library related to auth and implemented in a web app. I checked all the code samples, found a vulnerability in one, pushed for some misc changes. The quality of the English in it was atrocious (no criticism of the author, writing prose isn't everyone's strong suit) even post Pakt's editing, and I actually found 90% of my feedback was correcting grammar or improving readability, things I'd expect them to be doing. My main contribution was recommending a chapter on deployment. Fine, the book isn't going to be a technical marvel, but a quick last chapter saying "put your server behind Nginx, here's a bit of config" would have massively improved the security posture of anything being developed from the book, and also educated readers about Node Security far more than any of the other chapters. I gave a thorough and reasoned technical rationale for the inclusion of the chapter. They said no, the book was a 7 chapter book. I got paid with 1 physical copy of the <100 page book, and 1 free ebook voucher for any other Pakt title.
ChrisMarshallNY 2y ago
One of my favorite classes (and I've taken a lot of classes and seminars), ever, was a BNR bootcamp, about 12 years ago. They ran a good shop, but teaching is a tough gig.
semireg 2y ago
My favorite quote was in the preface “how to learn” of one of their Obj-C/Cocoa books. TLDR: You are not stupid. This stuff is hard. —- While learning something new, many students will think, "Damn, this is hard for me. I wonder it am stupid." Because stupidity is such an unthinkably terrible thing in our culture, the students will then spend hours constructing arguments that explain why they are intelligent yet are having difficulties. The moment you start down this path, you have lost your focus. Aaron used to have a boss named Rock. Rock had earned a degree in astrophysics from Cal Tech and had never had a job that used his knowledge of the heavens. He was once asked if he regretted getting the degree. "Actually, my degree in astrophysics has proved to be very valuable," he said. "Some things in this world are just hard. When I am struggling with something, I sometimes think Damn, this is hard for me. I wonder if I am stupid,' and then I remember that I have a degree in astrophysics from Cal Tech; I must not be stupid." Before going any further, assure yourself that you are not stupid and that some things are just hard. Armed with this silly affirmation and a well-rested mind, you are ready to conquer Cocoa.
- wwweston 2y ago
  Wasn’t there also a passage advising getting 10 hours of sleep per night?
  - semireg 2y ago
    Ha, yes! The previous two paragraphs: All sorts of people come to our class: the bright and the not so bright, the motivated and the lazy, the experienced and the novice. Inevitably, the people who get the most from the class share one characteristic: They remain focused on the topic at hand. The first trick to maintaining focus is to get enough sleep: ten hours of sleep each night while you are studying new ideas. Before dismissing this idea, try it. You will wake up refreshed and ready to learn. Caffeine is not a substitute for sleep.
    - d13 2y ago
      I also remember that from the same book. The best piece of coding advice I’ve ever received.
butterfi 2y ago
I took a bootcamp with them many many years ago and have to agree it was one of the better training experiences. Best wishes on your next chapter.
arthurofbabylon 2y ago
I first learned to program with the Big Nerd Ranch book on Objective-C and book on iOS programming. The format and quality of these books made the learning process work for me. Since that early exposure, I’ve always had a deep respect and appreciation for the authors of those books. I spent some $50 on them, and received so, so much more. To do this day, when my code composition is going well, it feels like I am completing one of the challenges at the end of a BNR chapter: thinking about the problem when I’m supposed to be doing something else, having my mind blown when the solution appears from an unexpected place, and realizing how far I can stretch my thinking processes and operating paradigms.
__mharrison__ 2y ago
Well that was vague...
juris 2y ago
If you're reading this, you'll be missed! Your books have got my SO and I started on our careers in mobile; they have just the right mix of code, background context, and chutzpah-- as compared to the 'picture books' that you might find in B&N these days. Thanks for everything; your voice will be missed. Digging a little further into the Glassdoor reviews, it's likely that Stellar Elements acquired them for their client base and drove them into the ground due to poor management. Most of the BNR reviews rank positive, but the latest of them complain about the acquisition, and the Stellar Elements reviews have always ranked low.
- ChuckMcM 2y ago
  Interesting genealogy; Stellar Elements was a non descript B2B consulting firm with no real footprint (like one of many) then gets bought by Amdocs[1], an Israeli company HQ in St Louis? in 2017, at which point SE goes on an acquisition spree, picking of five companies, Ora Interactive, Cibo Global, then BNR, then ADK Group then Roam Digital. Cibo was basically a PR firm, BNR actually had a product, and the other three were IT consulting services. Looking at various news stories and social media they seem to have tried to synthesize some sort of contract services/training thing. Given that BNR has a huge person-to-person product and they were acquired in June of 2020, I would speculate that the pandemic killed their training business and they couldn't make payroll[2] and sold themselves off to SE as 'rescue'. In my experience acquisitions that happen where the two options are 'get acquired' or 'go out of business' the power imbalance is really super significant. The acquired company gets basically zero say in how they should run their own business. With luck it is aligned with the acquirer, sometimes they acquirer just wants some staff and maybe some IP and the rest is just leftovers. I agree the GlassDoor reviews read like an acquiring company that doesn't care about people they acquired. Often there are retention bonuses for people that are needed to extract the desired parts so I hopefully some of that happened. It is really sad to me as I think application specific training resources are something big companies don't really do any more and the market is hit or miss with regard to combined in person + reference material. It sounds like I would have enjoyed going to their iOs development class. [1] Amdocs' web site is awash in "GenAI" buzzwordiness. Which makes me wonder if it was all crypto before :-). I don't know anything about the company really since I've never talked to anyone who works there but man, that website, really throws off a lot of red flags for me. [2] Although this seems odd given the PPP program but its just a guess right?
steve1977 2y ago
I fondly remember the very first Mac OS X book by Aaron Hillegass. Which was pretty much the only 3rd party book back then, else there was only the Apple docs (which to part still were the NeXT docs). I always wanted to do the in-person course back then (early 2000s), but never got around it (living in Europe, the whole thing would have been quite expensive). Oh well, times long gone by, also for BNR it seems.
ChristopherDrum 2y ago
The bicycle book and bootcamp with Aaron Hillegass, pre iPhone days, put me on the path to making shareware for MacOS X. That hobby morphed overnight into an iOS programming career when the platform opened up, which persists to this day. I still proudly drink from my Big Nerd Ranch (now vintage?!) mug and owe more than I can say to Aaron's teachings. It was through those works that programming finally clicked for me. Thank you, Big Nerd Ranch! (Aaron, if you're reading these; do you recall a vegetarian attending bootcamp about 20 years ago and the cooks didn't know anything about how to prepare vegetarian food?)
soferio 2y ago
Sad to see them gone. Are there any Swift/Swift UI 1–5 day Bootcamps anywhere in the world that can be recommended?
- cwdegidio 2y ago
  I don't know anyone doing good 1-5 day bootcamps, but I did recently do the multi-week live Kodeco (formerly Ray Wenderlich) iOS / SwiftUI bootcamp and really enjoyed it. I believe they also now offer an at-your-own-pace version as well.
mentos 2y ago
Thank you for taking me by the hand and leading me to a career in software development. Delivery estimate: May 17, 2012 1 "iOS Programming: The Big Nerd Ranch Guide (3rd Edition) (Big Nerd Ranch Guides)" Conway, Joe; Paperback; $27.26 In Stock Sold by: Amazon.com
dickersnoodle 2y ago
I still have signed copies of some of their books that I got when I toured their offices a few years ago. They created a really good space for developers with private soundproofed offices for the extroverted sales types to yak on the phone without disturbing everyone else in the building, a large very quiet room with a library vibe where everyone had to STFU and a group room where everyone could talk.
adamgordonbell 2y ago
I did a podcast episode in part about a anthropologist embedding himself the big nerd ranch bootcamps. The books were the way they were because the bootcamps were constantly testing them. And Aaron was orginally an internal trainer for NeXT and then cocoa. Aaron and others there put a lot of thought into teaching methodology.
zquestz 2y ago
I have extremely fond memories of the ranch. It was what got Throttled Pro off the ground and was by far the best Objective-C resource I could have possibly imagined. Aaron will forever be a hero in my book. Best of luck in the future.

76 points by zdw 2y ago

Did I miss the why? Or was it not stated? Closest I see is that “the landscape of tech education has evolved.” I agree but it would be interesting to hear more of their take.

downrightmike 2y ago
Bootcamps don't have anywhere near the quality employers want and they all get lumped together. Its worth less that the University of Phoenix.
- wordToDaBird 2y ago
  They used to be a wonderful place for a company that needs to upskill their employees on a tech stack quickly. But, those books though. There books seduced my soul to the depth of knowledge and intricate nature to the mobile ecosystem. I legitimately can’t think of books that were better on mobile.
  - musicale 2y ago
    Agreed - their books were/are inspiring. I think we need books more than ever for iOS and macOS since Apple's documentation doesn't seem to be as good as it used to be.
    - _mlbt 2y ago
      It seems that Apple intends people to mostly use WWDC videos to learn their newest tech.
- sircastor 2y ago
  Big Nerd Ranch was running boot camps long before the crop of web dev camps that came up in the last little while. It really was a way you could get into Mac OS X and iOS dev early on. Beyond that, it felt like the best way was to have already been an OpenStep developer.

shrubble 2y ago

I assume they got nailed by the combination of covid travel restrictions followed by the pause in tech hirings/layoffs. Looks like at some point they got acquired, also have an arm that does custom design and app development; possibly that simply pays better.

deleted 2y ago
[deleted]

wordToDaBird 2y ago

I have read 4/5 of their books. and 4 editions of the Big Nerd Ranch Android Development, 2 of the Big Nerd Ranch iOS Programming. I found those books exemplary with their quality and depth of the topics with which they taught. I would put the technical guides of similar quality to O’Reilly, and I want to say better than Pakt and I like Pakt. I am sad to see this go. I read the first one of their books when I was less than a year in the industry.

danpalmer 2y ago
I wholeheartedly agree on the quality of BNR books, but I’ve always found Pakt to be pretty poor. I consider Pakt books to be overpriced even when 90% off in some big bundle. If you’re getting value out of them, great, I don’t want to diminish that, but for anyone considering them, there are far better options. I say this having been a technical reviewer on a Pakt book. It was filled with errors, surface level, poorly written and edited, and my main feedback was ignored because it would have added 10 pages, even though it would also have significantly improved the learning outcomes of the book for the specific topic it was about.
- BrentOzar 2y ago
  To anyone considering writing for Pakt, you owe it to yourself to read any random 5 of their books, and then consider whether you want your name to be attached to that reputation. The books really are that bad. I think less of someone when I know they've written a book for Pakt.
  - danpalmer 2y ago
    I tech-reviewed "Node Security". It was something like 7 chapters, where each chapter basically took 1 popular at the time Node library related to auth and implemented in a web app. I checked all the code samples, found a vulnerability in one, pushed for some misc changes. The quality of the English in it was atrocious (no criticism of the author, writing prose isn't everyone's strong suit) even post Pakt's editing, and I actually found 90% of my feedback was correcting grammar or improving readability, things I'd expect them to be doing. My main contribution was recommending a chapter on deployment. Fine, the book isn't going to be a technical marvel, but a quick last chapter saying "put your server behind Nginx, here's a bit of config" would have massively improved the security posture of anything being developed from the book, and also educated readers about Node Security far more than any of the other chapters. I gave a thorough and reasoned technical rationale for the inclusion of the chapter. They said no, the book was a 7 chapter book. I got paid with 1 physical copy of the <100 page book, and 1 free ebook voucher for any other Pakt title.

ChrisMarshallNY 2y ago

One of my favorite classes (and I've taken a lot of classes and seminars), ever, was a BNR bootcamp, about 12 years ago. They ran a good shop, but teaching is a tough gig.

semireg 2y ago

My favorite quote was in the preface “how to learn” of one of their Obj-C/Cocoa books. TLDR: You are not stupid. This stuff is hard. —- While learning something new, many students will think, "Damn, this is hard for me. I wonder it am stupid." Because stupidity is such an unthinkably terrible thing in our culture, the students will then spend hours constructing arguments that explain why they are intelligent yet are having difficulties. The moment you start down this path, you have lost your focus. Aaron used to have a boss named Rock. Rock had earned a degree in astrophysics from Cal Tech and had never had a job that used his knowledge of the heavens. He was once asked if he regretted getting the degree. "Actually, my degree in astrophysics has proved to be very valuable," he said. "Some things in this world are just hard. When I am struggling with something, I sometimes think Damn, this is hard for me. I wonder if I am stupid,' and then I remember that I have a degree in astrophysics from Cal Tech; I must not be stupid." Before going any further, assure yourself that you are not stupid and that some things are just hard. Armed with this silly affirmation and a well-rested mind, you are ready to conquer Cocoa.

wwweston 2y ago
Wasn’t there also a passage advising getting 10 hours of sleep per night?
- semireg 2y ago
  Ha, yes! The previous two paragraphs: All sorts of people come to our class: the bright and the not so bright, the motivated and the lazy, the experienced and the novice. Inevitably, the people who get the most from the class share one characteristic: They remain focused on the topic at hand. The first trick to maintaining focus is to get enough sleep: ten hours of sleep each night while you are studying new ideas. Before dismissing this idea, try it. You will wake up refreshed and ready to learn. Caffeine is not a substitute for sleep.
  - d13 2y ago
    I also remember that from the same book. The best piece of coding advice I’ve ever received.

butterfi 2y ago

I took a bootcamp with them many many years ago and have to agree it was one of the better training experiences. Best wishes on your next chapter.

arthurofbabylon 2y ago

I first learned to program with the Big Nerd Ranch book on Objective-C and book on iOS programming. The format and quality of these books made the learning process work for me. Since that early exposure, I’ve always had a deep respect and appreciation for the authors of those books. I spent some $50 on them, and received so, so much more. To do this day, when my code composition is going well, it feels like I am completing one of the challenges at the end of a BNR chapter: thinking about the problem when I’m supposed to be doing something else, having my mind blown when the solution appears from an unexpected place, and realizing how far I can stretch my thinking processes and operating paradigms.

__mharrison__ 2y ago

Well that was vague...

juris 2y ago

If you're reading this, you'll be missed! Your books have got my SO and I started on our careers in mobile; they have just the right mix of code, background context, and chutzpah-- as compared to the 'picture books' that you might find in B&N these days. Thanks for everything; your voice will be missed. Digging a little further into the Glassdoor reviews, it's likely that Stellar Elements acquired them for their client base and drove them into the ground due to poor management. Most of the BNR reviews rank positive, but the latest of them complain about the acquisition, and the Stellar Elements reviews have always ranked low.

ChuckMcM 2y ago
Interesting genealogy; Stellar Elements was a non descript B2B consulting firm with no real footprint (like one of many) then gets bought by Amdocs[1], an Israeli company HQ in St Louis? in 2017, at which point SE goes on an acquisition spree, picking of five companies, Ora Interactive, Cibo Global, then BNR, then ADK Group then Roam Digital. Cibo was basically a PR firm, BNR actually had a product, and the other three were IT consulting services. Looking at various news stories and social media they seem to have tried to synthesize some sort of contract services/training thing. Given that BNR has a huge person-to-person product and they were acquired in June of 2020, I would speculate that the pandemic killed their training business and they couldn't make payroll[2] and sold themselves off to SE as 'rescue'. In my experience acquisitions that happen where the two options are 'get acquired' or 'go out of business' the power imbalance is really super significant. The acquired company gets basically zero say in how they should run their own business. With luck it is aligned with the acquirer, sometimes they acquirer just wants some staff and maybe some IP and the rest is just leftovers. I agree the GlassDoor reviews read like an acquiring company that doesn't care about people they acquired. Often there are retention bonuses for people that are needed to extract the desired parts so I hopefully some of that happened. It is really sad to me as I think application specific training resources are something big companies don't really do any more and the market is hit or miss with regard to combined in person + reference material. It sounds like I would have enjoyed going to their iOs development class. [1] Amdocs' web site is awash in "GenAI" buzzwordiness. Which makes me wonder if it was all crypto before :-). I don't know anything about the company really since I've never talked to anyone who works there but man, that website, really throws off a lot of red flags for me. [2] Although this seems odd given the PPP program but its just a guess right?

steve1977 2y ago

I fondly remember the very first Mac OS X book by Aaron Hillegass. Which was pretty much the only 3rd party book back then, else there was only the Apple docs (which to part still were the NeXT docs). I always wanted to do the in-person course back then (early 2000s), but never got around it (living in Europe, the whole thing would have been quite expensive). Oh well, times long gone by, also for BNR it seems.

ChristopherDrum 2y ago

The bicycle book and bootcamp with Aaron Hillegass, pre iPhone days, put me on the path to making shareware for MacOS X. That hobby morphed overnight into an iOS programming career when the platform opened up, which persists to this day. I still proudly drink from my Big Nerd Ranch (now vintage?!) mug and owe more than I can say to Aaron's teachings. It was through those works that programming finally clicked for me. Thank you, Big Nerd Ranch! (Aaron, if you're reading these; do you recall a vegetarian attending bootcamp about 20 years ago and the cooks didn't know anything about how to prepare vegetarian food?)

soferio 2y ago

Sad to see them gone. Are there any Swift/Swift UI 1–5 day Bootcamps anywhere in the world that can be recommended?

cwdegidio 2y ago
I don't know anyone doing good 1-5 day bootcamps, but I did recently do the multi-week live Kodeco (formerly Ray Wenderlich) iOS / SwiftUI bootcamp and really enjoyed it. I believe they also now offer an at-your-own-pace version as well.

mentos 2y ago

Thank you for taking me by the hand and leading me to a career in software development. Delivery estimate: May 17, 2012 1 "iOS Programming: The Big Nerd Ranch Guide (3rd Edition) (Big Nerd Ranch Guides)" Conway, Joe; Paperback; $27.26 In Stock Sold by: Amazon.com

dickersnoodle 2y ago

I still have signed copies of some of their books that I got when I toured their offices a few years ago. They created a really good space for developers with private soundproofed offices for the extroverted sales types to yak on the phone without disturbing everyone else in the building, a large very quiet room with a library vibe where everyone had to STFU and a group room where everyone could talk.

adamgordonbell 2y ago

I did a podcast episode in part about a anthropologist embedding himself the big nerd ranch bootcamps. The books were the way they were because the bootcamps were constantly testing them. And Aaron was orginally an internal trainer for NeXT and then cocoa. Aaron and others there put a lot of thought into teaching methodology.

zquestz 2y ago

I have extremely fond memories of the ranch. It was what got Throttled Pro off the ground and was by far the best Objective-C resource I could have possibly imagined. Aaron will forever be a hero in my book. Best of luck in the future.