8 ms·

So, no more install.sh scripts that you have to chmod +x, no more "undefined symbol" errors from games expecting old library files, no dependency hell (though,

So, no more install.sh scripts that you have to chmod +x, no more "undefined symbol" errors from games expecting old library files, no dependency hell (though, admittedly, I don't encounter those as much anymore). That I can definitely get behind!

jiggy2011 14y ago
Nope , just wait 10 minutes for Steam to load , check DRM and do all updates and your ready to go!
- muhfuhkuh 14y ago
  Believe me, I'd wait a few more seconds for it to do that than it erroring out to a prompt with "UNDEFINED SYMBOL: GTK_BUILDER_NEW", or worse, crash with a core dump where I'll never find it or know what to do with.
  - sliverstorm 14y ago
    But think of the freedom you get with those UNDEFINED SYMBOL and core dumps! I'll take DRM-free core dumps over playable games, any day!
    - sukuriant 14y ago
      </sarcasm>
    - shmerl 14y ago
      DRM free core dumps surely should be more fun than DRMed ones. ;) But seriously, having or not having DRM is not really directly related to how often it will crash.
      - dkersten 14y ago
        In the past I've had games crash because of the DRM. At least, thats what it sounded like from error messages and google searches. Tages and securom how I loathe thee!
- Splines 14y ago
  That's one of my biggest annoyances with Steam. It takes so long to load. I'm tempted to install another partition of Windows with nothing on it except steam and the drivers necessary for me to play games, to see if it'll make starting steam any faster.
  - jiggy2011 14y ago
    I've tried. It doesn't.
shmerl 14y ago
But you get all the DRM junk. Better to deal with chmod +x than with DRM restrictions.
- nikomen 14y ago
  Contrary to popular belief, game companies have salaries to pay and are interested in protecting their IP so they can continue to pay those salaries.
  - shmerl 14y ago
    Contrary to popular belief, not using DRM really shows respect by game creators for their users. I simply won't buy any DRMed game. Luckily some publishers like GOG emerged, who promote DRM free games, and have such major contributors like CD Projekt Red who aren't scared to show respect for their users by selling DRM free games. They (CD Projekt Red) managed not only to pay salaries and improve their products, but also attracted a lot of potential customers for their future titles. GOG is behind in providing Linux versions yet, but I'd rather get DRM free game to run under Wine, than DRMed native one.
    - Locke1689 14y ago
      Hold the phone everybody -- shmerl won't pay for DRM'd games. Better pack it up folks, we're done here. In all seriousness though (and this is a question that everyone should ask themselves semi-regularly in a product-consumer situation): why do you matter? If you don't have a compelling answer to this question, it may be that you don't.
      - shmerl 14y ago
        Your choice matters. In this case I'd call it "vote with your wallet". Preferring non DRMed games shows support for their developers, as simple as that.
        Locke1689 14y ago
pippy 14y ago
This is bigger than what many might think. I'd still be using Linux now if I didn't have to edit xorg.conf just to change the screen resolution. (Yes I'm aware of the http://xkcd.com/963/ http://xkcd.com/963/ comic). The gap between programmer and user is Linux's biggest fault. For example Unity, developers recognised an issue with the UI. Instead of doing user studies and tweaking it for the better they canned Gnome and reprogrammed it. Now they're in the same situation but with an entirely different codebase. Having a large company with a product that has to work will add consistency, and hopefully force Linux to start tweaking instead of redeveloping. I might actually install it on my next machine.
- tene 14y ago
  It's been many years since I've had to touch xorg.conf to change screen resolution. I can do it on the command line (xrandr) or through gui tools. Do you have significantly unusual hardware?
- fingerprinter 14y ago
  1. As someone else noted, literally years since you ever had to touch config file by hand. Use Ubuntu, you'll love it. 2. I do believe your view of Unity is a bit odd. Canonical recognized that the state of Linux UI/DE was NOT going to make the leap from programmer. They saw this VIA user studies. That is when they decided to create Unity. And user study after user study Unity keeps coming out ahead of all the other DE in Linux and is on par with usability of current OSX. Point being, Ubuntu is going after users the right way. Unity in 12.04 shows this and the reviews speak to it. 3. Sometimes you simply have to rewrite. This is a fact (sorry Joel) in software. The challenge is to recognize when it is necessary and avoid it when not 100% necessary to achieve your business objectives.
  - daeken 14y ago
    I use Ubuntu, and every time I switch between external displays and my laptop's display, I have to move an xorg.conf file. My external displays are on NVidia Twinview, my internal display is on an Intel GPU. I have no choice but to move my NVidia xorg.conf out of the way when I want to use the internal display, and then move it back when I get home and hook up to my monitors. In 2012.
ekianjo 14y ago
Chmod +x and install.sh scripts have rarely been a problem recently. It's not that complicated and most people familiar with Linux know about these basic commands. Dependencies is still a problem, however. There are still a few cases where I had to spend significant time to make a game run correctly because of dependencies. And the online resources on this matter are scarce. But even on a Linux backend, it's possible to introduce specific formats encompassing all needed libraries. That's what being done on the Open Pandora, where a single PND file contains, in a zipped format, the executable, all the needed libraries, and the data for the game. That way, you avoid the problem altogether.
MrScruff 14y ago
Perhaps tongue in cheek but it's normally easier to type sh install.sh

jiggy2011 14y ago

Nope , just wait 10 minutes for Steam to load , check DRM and do all updates and your ready to go!

muhfuhkuh 14y ago
Believe me, I'd wait a few more seconds for it to do that than it erroring out to a prompt with "UNDEFINED SYMBOL: GTK_BUILDER_NEW", or worse, crash with a core dump where I'll never find it or know what to do with.
- sliverstorm 14y ago
  But think of the freedom you get with those UNDEFINED SYMBOL and core dumps! I'll take DRM-free core dumps over playable games, any day!
  - sukuriant 14y ago
    </sarcasm>
  - shmerl 14y ago
    DRM free core dumps surely should be more fun than DRMed ones. ;) But seriously, having or not having DRM is not really directly related to how often it will crash.
    - dkersten 14y ago
      In the past I've had games crash because of the DRM. At least, thats what it sounded like from error messages and google searches. Tages and securom how I loathe thee!
Splines 14y ago
That's one of my biggest annoyances with Steam. It takes so long to load. I'm tempted to install another partition of Windows with nothing on it except steam and the drivers necessary for me to play games, to see if it'll make starting steam any faster.
- jiggy2011 14y ago
  I've tried. It doesn't.

shmerl 14y ago

But you get all the DRM junk. Better to deal with chmod +x than with DRM restrictions.

nikomen 14y ago
Contrary to popular belief, game companies have salaries to pay and are interested in protecting their IP so they can continue to pay those salaries.
- shmerl 14y ago
  Contrary to popular belief, not using DRM really shows respect by game creators for their users. I simply won't buy any DRMed game. Luckily some publishers like GOG emerged, who promote DRM free games, and have such major contributors like CD Projekt Red who aren't scared to show respect for their users by selling DRM free games. They (CD Projekt Red) managed not only to pay salaries and improve their products, but also attracted a lot of potential customers for their future titles. GOG is behind in providing Linux versions yet, but I'd rather get DRM free game to run under Wine, than DRMed native one.
  - Locke1689 14y ago
    Hold the phone everybody -- shmerl won't pay for DRM'd games. Better pack it up folks, we're done here. In all seriousness though (and this is a question that everyone should ask themselves semi-regularly in a product-consumer situation): why do you matter? If you don't have a compelling answer to this question, it may be that you don't.
    - shmerl 14y ago
      Your choice matters. In this case I'd call it "vote with your wallet". Preferring non DRMed games shows support for their developers, as simple as that.
      - Locke1689 14y ago

pippy 14y ago

This is bigger than what many might think. I'd still be using Linux now if I didn't have to edit xorg.conf just to change the screen resolution. (Yes I'm aware of the http://xkcd.com/963/ http://xkcd.com/963/ comic). The gap between programmer and user is Linux's biggest fault. For example Unity, developers recognised an issue with the UI. Instead of doing user studies and tweaking it for the better they canned Gnome and reprogrammed it. Now they're in the same situation but with an entirely different codebase. Having a large company with a product that has to work will add consistency, and hopefully force Linux to start tweaking instead of redeveloping. I might actually install it on my next machine.

tene 14y ago
It's been many years since I've had to touch xorg.conf to change screen resolution. I can do it on the command line (xrandr) or through gui tools. Do you have significantly unusual hardware?
fingerprinter 14y ago
1. As someone else noted, literally years since you ever had to touch config file by hand. Use Ubuntu, you'll love it. 2. I do believe your view of Unity is a bit odd. Canonical recognized that the state of Linux UI/DE was NOT going to make the leap from programmer. They saw this VIA user studies. That is when they decided to create Unity. And user study after user study Unity keeps coming out ahead of all the other DE in Linux and is on par with usability of current OSX. Point being, Ubuntu is going after users the right way. Unity in 12.04 shows this and the reviews speak to it. 3. Sometimes you simply have to rewrite. This is a fact (sorry Joel) in software. The challenge is to recognize when it is necessary and avoid it when not 100% necessary to achieve your business objectives.
- daeken 14y ago
  I use Ubuntu, and every time I switch between external displays and my laptop's display, I have to move an xorg.conf file. My external displays are on NVidia Twinview, my internal display is on an Intel GPU. I have no choice but to move my NVidia xorg.conf out of the way when I want to use the internal display, and then move it back when I get home and hook up to my monitors. In 2012.

ekianjo 14y ago

Chmod +x and install.sh scripts have rarely been a problem recently. It's not that complicated and most people familiar with Linux know about these basic commands. Dependencies is still a problem, however. There are still a few cases where I had to spend significant time to make a game run correctly because of dependencies. And the online resources on this matter are scarce. But even on a Linux backend, it's possible to introduce specific formats encompassing all needed libraries. That's what being done on the Open Pandora, where a single PND file contains, in a zipped format, the executable, all the needed libraries, and the data for the game. That way, you avoid the problem altogether.

MrScruff 14y ago

Perhaps tongue in cheek but it's normally easier to type sh install.sh