4 ms·

I still wonder, how come noone cares who did it... or why the ones that do, don't get mad at the government. It was billions of damage, a huge ecological disast

I still wonder, how come noone cares who did it... or why the ones that do, don't get mad at the government. It was billions of damage, a huge ecological disaster, and everyone acts as if nothing has happened... there should be daily questioning of the politicians (by the journalists, etc.) about who did what, and what the reaction will be.

eigenket 2y ago
I think no one cares because basing your energy policy on buying gas from Russia is such an obviously stupid idea that no one wants to bring it up. Russia is not your ally, Russia isn't even a reliable neutral party. Russia is explicitly the enemy of Europe and when Germans get that into their heads things will be a lot simpler.
- forloni 2y ago
  Angela Merkel is more pragmatic than that.
  - eigenket 2y ago
    She failed to come up with a workable energy policy and made Germany dependent on the thugs in Moscow as a result.
- ajsnigrutin 2y ago
  I mean... considering the rise of AfD, people do care. Would you really not care if someone burned your car?
  - eigenket 2y ago
    I don't think many people are voting for AfD because of gas pipes. Nordstream isn't a case of someone burning down the German people's car. Its more like Russia persuaded the German people to pay for the chains and manacles which kept Germany captive. Sure you paid for them, but they were still your chains. Its worth pointing out that Nordstream 2 never delivered any gas, and Nordstream 1 stopped delivering gas a year before the destruction, so its not like they were actually helping Germany's energy situation at all.
mpreda 2y ago
It should not have been built in the first place. That's where the billions were wasted. A strategical mistake.
Moldoteck 2y ago
bc the natural question after that would be "why do you care so much? Do you support russia? Do you want to pay money to the Russia's war machine?" And tbh these questions are somewhat valid. The NS blowing was a signal for germany to reorient it's dependency on other re-sources, be that from US liquified gas, or gas pipes from norway, or buy nuclear from france, or buy solar panels from china
- ajsnigrutin 2y ago
  It was the biggest terorist attack on german infrastructure ever. It was billions of investment and an ecological disaster.... why wouldn't I care? Why do you not care? If someone burned your car today, would you care? I mean... do you wan't to support chinese spare parts manufacturers?
  - Moldoteck 2y ago
    the biggest ecological disaster was building this pipe, blowing it just made it worse
Y-bar 2y ago
What do you mean? For months there were many long detailed news articles and segments, government inquiries, international cooperation between the Baltic states, Denmark, and Sweden. They are still ongoing. Scientists are still monitoring how much gas dissolved in the waters as we write this. Previously when it was built, the environmental lobby was raging mad that it got green-lit (and even the military leadership sort of opposed it by saying that "it affects our security") but the commercial interests and ruling parties allowed it to go through anyway. I think it was a Russian operation, it makes most sense to me that they would try to deprive Europe of gas and make Europe war-weary to stop supporting Ukraine sooner. But at the same time I would not be very surprised that a small group of Ukrainian operatives (as rumoured) did it to deprive Russia of income from the gas line.
- ajsnigrutin 2y ago
  > I think it was a Russian operation, But the russians have the valves, and the "just stop the sancions and we bring back the gas supply"... why would they destroy their own pipes. And again.. it's what "you think"... is there proof? > But at the same time I would not be very surprised that a small group of Ukrainian operatives (as rumoured) did it to deprive Russia of income from the gas line. Ok, so you don't know who it was... but it might be a biggest terrorist attack on german infrastructure, and the "antiterrorist" action by germany is to send them more weapons?
  - Y-bar 2y ago
    > But the russians have the valves […] Why spout this nonsense? Gazprom were (are) contractually obliged to deliver gas through the pipe as long as they are able to do so. If they just shut if off Germany and Netherlands and USA could legally seize anything they needed to satisfy the contract from the company's international assets.
- forloni 2y ago
  [flagged]
  - 2y ago

eigenket 2y ago

I think no one cares because basing your energy policy on buying gas from Russia is such an obviously stupid idea that no one wants to bring it up. Russia is not your ally, Russia isn't even a reliable neutral party. Russia is explicitly the enemy of Europe and when Germans get that into their heads things will be a lot simpler.

forloni 2y ago
Angela Merkel is more pragmatic than that.
- eigenket 2y ago
  She failed to come up with a workable energy policy and made Germany dependent on the thugs in Moscow as a result.
ajsnigrutin 2y ago
I mean... considering the rise of AfD, people do care. Would you really not care if someone burned your car?
- eigenket 2y ago
  I don't think many people are voting for AfD because of gas pipes. Nordstream isn't a case of someone burning down the German people's car. Its more like Russia persuaded the German people to pay for the chains and manacles which kept Germany captive. Sure you paid for them, but they were still your chains. Its worth pointing out that Nordstream 2 never delivered any gas, and Nordstream 1 stopped delivering gas a year before the destruction, so its not like they were actually helping Germany's energy situation at all.

mpreda 2y ago

It should not have been built in the first place. That's where the billions were wasted. A strategical mistake.

Moldoteck 2y ago

bc the natural question after that would be "why do you care so much? Do you support russia? Do you want to pay money to the Russia's war machine?" And tbh these questions are somewhat valid. The NS blowing was a signal for germany to reorient it's dependency on other re-sources, be that from US liquified gas, or gas pipes from norway, or buy nuclear from france, or buy solar panels from china

ajsnigrutin 2y ago
It was the biggest terorist attack on german infrastructure ever. It was billions of investment and an ecological disaster.... why wouldn't I care? Why do you not care? If someone burned your car today, would you care? I mean... do you wan't to support chinese spare parts manufacturers?
- Moldoteck 2y ago
  the biggest ecological disaster was building this pipe, blowing it just made it worse

Y-bar 2y ago

What do you mean? For months there were many long detailed news articles and segments, government inquiries, international cooperation between the Baltic states, Denmark, and Sweden. They are still ongoing. Scientists are still monitoring how much gas dissolved in the waters as we write this. Previously when it was built, the environmental lobby was raging mad that it got green-lit (and even the military leadership sort of opposed it by saying that "it affects our security") but the commercial interests and ruling parties allowed it to go through anyway. I think it was a Russian operation, it makes most sense to me that they would try to deprive Europe of gas and make Europe war-weary to stop supporting Ukraine sooner. But at the same time I would not be very surprised that a small group of Ukrainian operatives (as rumoured) did it to deprive Russia of income from the gas line.

ajsnigrutin 2y ago
> I think it was a Russian operation, But the russians have the valves, and the "just stop the sancions and we bring back the gas supply"... why would they destroy their own pipes. And again.. it's what "you think"... is there proof? > But at the same time I would not be very surprised that a small group of Ukrainian operatives (as rumoured) did it to deprive Russia of income from the gas line. Ok, so you don't know who it was... but it might be a biggest terrorist attack on german infrastructure, and the "antiterrorist" action by germany is to send them more weapons?
- Y-bar 2y ago
  > But the russians have the valves […] Why spout this nonsense? Gazprom were (are) contractually obliged to deliver gas through the pipe as long as they are able to do so. If they just shut if off Germany and Netherlands and USA could legally seize anything they needed to satisfy the contract from the company's international assets.
forloni 2y ago
[flagged]
- 2y ago