3 ms·

What you say has an element of truth, but it comes across like the warnings of an abuse victim, who's only move is not to anger the elders lest they get hurt.

What you say has an element of truth, but it comes across like the warnings of an abuse victim, who's only move is not to anger the elders lest they get hurt. Good elders would respond with terms. "You can contradict me, but not in {cases X} or in {format Y}, and it must be in good faith" etc. A blanket "don't contradict" just means they're narcissists and they're telling you you need to get out from under their power ASAP. It's also false that a good tone is enough - these types view any independence of thought an affront.

claytongulick 2y ago
If "Bob" was just starting in engineering, and an experienced engineer with 30+ years of experience told Bob something that he didn't think was right, do you think Bob should contradict the senior engineer? I think that Bob should understand that while the senior engineer may be incorrect, it's best to ask questions and seek to understand first. It's more likely that Bob is missing something. Even if not, this would come out in a better way through polite questions than direct contradiction. Life is like this too. It's a skill that we should be improving over time. People who have been doing it longer that us probably have insight that we don't. I think it's arrogant to assume otherwise. Avoiding contradiction shows respect for the experience and knowledge of the other person, while directly contradicting someone encourages conflict and argument. Whenever a conversation turns into an argument, both people lose. You've caused conflict that can have significant consequences. This was a costly lesson for me to learn. Manners are the lubricant of civilization. Without them the whole machine fails.
- s1artibartfast 2y ago
  This is exactly what the proposal is, as is the linked story. It is about having an open and honest dialog with mutual respect on both sides. I feel like several people in this thread dont know the difference between a respectful discussion and a gutter fight.

claytongulick 2y ago

If "Bob" was just starting in engineering, and an experienced engineer with 30+ years of experience told Bob something that he didn't think was right, do you think Bob should contradict the senior engineer? I think that Bob should understand that while the senior engineer may be incorrect, it's best to ask questions and seek to understand first. It's more likely that Bob is missing something. Even if not, this would come out in a better way through polite questions than direct contradiction. Life is like this too. It's a skill that we should be improving over time. People who have been doing it longer that us probably have insight that we don't. I think it's arrogant to assume otherwise. Avoiding contradiction shows respect for the experience and knowledge of the other person, while directly contradicting someone encourages conflict and argument. Whenever a conversation turns into an argument, both people lose. You've caused conflict that can have significant consequences. This was a costly lesson for me to learn. Manners are the lubricant of civilization. Without them the whole machine fails.

s1artibartfast 2y ago
This is exactly what the proposal is, as is the linked story. It is about having an open and honest dialog with mutual respect on both sides. I feel like several people in this thread dont know the difference between a respectful discussion and a gutter fight.