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The post I was responding to: "and in general russians are seen as enemies. Not just russian soldiers, but people with a russian cultural background. Nationali

The post I was responding to: "and in general russians are seen as enemies. Not just russian soldiers, but people with a russian cultural background. Nationalism in all its glory." is complete BS. My reference regarding attitudes towards Mexicans was a response to that comment, not to the law you just mentioned. But what a weird argument you make. Canada has numerous laws like these in order to protect French speakers. How much 'expected violence' by Anglo Canadians has that resulted in? Again, in my experience, every Ukrainian I have met can speak some russian. A good portion can not speak ukrainian. The President of Ukraine's native language is Russian and was a well known Russian language entertainer who stared in 'Servant of the People' a Ukrainian TV show where he spoke Russian. Strange for a country that's being labeled so historically and systemically anti-Russia. Edit: See also Zelensky performing on Russian state TV New Years special https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cTmhTxzAH70 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cTmhTxzAH70

rufus_foreman 2y ago
>> The post I was responding to: "and in general russians are seen as enemies. Not just russian soldiers, but people with a russian cultural background. Nationalism in all its glory." OK, now I am laughing. The post you were responding to: >> Also the russian language get supressed and in general russians are seen as enemies. Not just russian soldiers, but people with a russian cultural background. Nationalism in all its glory. Any reason you would leave out that first part? Seems sort of relevant does it not?
- _DeadFred_ 2y ago
  Yes, because 'and' here indicates an additional point being made, which was the point I was responding to (notice I talked about Mexicans and not about spanish). Now please respond to my Canadian laws that protect and/or elevate the french language challenge to your assertion that there would be violence if Canada had laws that favored a specific language. Because Canada has just those very laws to protect French.
  - rufus_foreman 2y ago
    >> Now please respond to my Canadian laws that protect and/or elevate the french language challenge I'm honestly not sure what your point is here. Are you comparing laws like the ones in Canada that guarantee an ethnic minority the right to be educated in their own language to laws like the ones in Ukraine that deny an ethnic minority the right to be educated in their own language? To me, those seem to be very different things.
    - _DeadFred_ 2y ago
      Why different? English speakers are the minority in Quebec. French speakers in a majority French speaking region felt their language should be protected from the much larger influence english. Ukrainian speakers feel their language should be protected from the much larger influence russian language. Again see my above video of the President of Ukraine performing on Russian state TV in the russian language to celebrate New Years. Hardly the behavior of a Russophobe. https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/montreal/bill-96-major-provisions-into-effect-1.6861311 https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/montreal/bill-96-major-provis...
lukan 2y ago
"in general russians are seen as enemies" My wording was indeed bad, what I meant was there is a general trend towards doing that, not that the majority already does it. But the ukrainian Ultra Nationalist do. They are the black spot I am seeing. There are hardcore Nazis in my (german) home town - and they went to support their nationalistic comrades in Azow and co. They do not fight for democracy.
- racional 2y ago
  There are hardcore Nazis in my (german) home town - and they went to support their nationalistic comrades in Azow and co So you base your view of what's going on in Ukraine not from talking broadly to Ukrainians; not from an objective reading of history and news reports -- but on what the Nazis in your hometown are saying?
  - lukan 2y ago
    How do you conclude, I just use the Nazis as a point of reference? It is just a pretty strong indicator. And what people are saying does not matter so much to me, as what people are doing.
    - racional 2y ago
      Because you offered them as your primary point of reference. These people aren't a "pretty strong indicator" of anything. They definitely do not have an interesting or useful perspective as to what mainstream Ukrainian society thinks or is actually like.
      - lukan 2y ago
        Let's put it like this, in germany we try to keep those people away from weapons and police actually (partly) prevented them from going to Ukraine. In Ukraine they would officially armed. So yeah, germany is not directly in war and if a war comes here, we probably would also arm our Nazis again and hope they shoot in the direction we want - but I would be against that and I would consider this "black".

rufus_foreman 2y ago

>> The post I was responding to: "and in general russians are seen as enemies. Not just russian soldiers, but people with a russian cultural background. Nationalism in all its glory." OK, now I am laughing. The post you were responding to: >> Also the russian language get supressed and in general russians are seen as enemies. Not just russian soldiers, but people with a russian cultural background. Nationalism in all its glory. Any reason you would leave out that first part? Seems sort of relevant does it not?

_DeadFred_ 2y ago
Yes, because 'and' here indicates an additional point being made, which was the point I was responding to (notice I talked about Mexicans and not about spanish). Now please respond to my Canadian laws that protect and/or elevate the french language challenge to your assertion that there would be violence if Canada had laws that favored a specific language. Because Canada has just those very laws to protect French.
- rufus_foreman 2y ago
  >> Now please respond to my Canadian laws that protect and/or elevate the french language challenge I'm honestly not sure what your point is here. Are you comparing laws like the ones in Canada that guarantee an ethnic minority the right to be educated in their own language to laws like the ones in Ukraine that deny an ethnic minority the right to be educated in their own language? To me, those seem to be very different things.
  - _DeadFred_ 2y ago
    Why different? English speakers are the minority in Quebec. French speakers in a majority French speaking region felt their language should be protected from the much larger influence english. Ukrainian speakers feel their language should be protected from the much larger influence russian language. Again see my above video of the President of Ukraine performing on Russian state TV in the russian language to celebrate New Years. Hardly the behavior of a Russophobe. https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/montreal/bill-96-major-provisions-into-effect-1.6861311 https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/montreal/bill-96-major-provis...

lukan 2y ago

"in general russians are seen as enemies" My wording was indeed bad, what I meant was there is a general trend towards doing that, not that the majority already does it. But the ukrainian Ultra Nationalist do. They are the black spot I am seeing. There are hardcore Nazis in my (german) home town - and they went to support their nationalistic comrades in Azow and co. They do not fight for democracy.

racional 2y ago
There are hardcore Nazis in my (german) home town - and they went to support their nationalistic comrades in Azow and co So you base your view of what's going on in Ukraine not from talking broadly to Ukrainians; not from an objective reading of history and news reports -- but on what the Nazis in your hometown are saying?
- lukan 2y ago
  How do you conclude, I just use the Nazis as a point of reference? It is just a pretty strong indicator. And what people are saying does not matter so much to me, as what people are doing.
  - racional 2y ago
    Because you offered them as your primary point of reference. These people aren't a "pretty strong indicator" of anything. They definitely do not have an interesting or useful perspective as to what mainstream Ukrainian society thinks or is actually like.
    - lukan 2y ago
      Let's put it like this, in germany we try to keep those people away from weapons and police actually (partly) prevented them from going to Ukraine. In Ukraine they would officially armed. So yeah, germany is not directly in war and if a war comes here, we probably would also arm our Nazis again and hope they shoot in the direction we want - but I would be against that and I would consider this "black".