3 ms·

For Privilege Esc to be relevant, this would require having execution on the device already, but somehow not on user account (since then they wouldn't need to e

For Privilege Esc to be relevant, this would require having execution on the device already, but somehow not on user account (since then they wouldn't need to escalate to access recall data). If there was Priv Esc, then it doesn't matter how robust the security is because you make your way to root and you win regardless.

haswell 2y ago
The point was that it’s unnecessary for a user to explicitly change the permissions of the home directory as you had described for the data to be at risk. I agree with your last paragraph, and that is exactly what makes Recall such a big problem, and why the security community is reacting strongly against this feature. Assuming the attacker wins, which they currently do on a regular basis, they get to know everything about everyone who has used the computer to a degree of detail that is unprecedented both in scope and in detail. The harm of losing this information to an attacker is potentially extreme, with obvious consequences. Since this is an opt-out feature, Microsoft has essentially guaranteed that a sizable portion of their user base will overnight start feeding attackers more details than they could have ever hoped for. It’s incompetent, irresponsible, and should be categorically rejected by the tech community. I say this while also seeing the value of such a feature if it could be implemented safely. I hope someone figures out a safe architecture because I could see a local model trained on everything I’ve ever done on my PC being a transformational capability. But I wouldn’t go near Recall at this point.
- its-summertime 2y ago
  If Recall is such a big problem for that, then what of Thunderbird which would give your entire set of emails to anyone with read permissions, or Firefox which would give your email credentials and in turn your entire set of emails to anyone with read permissions. Unless you make a habit of going through all of your email archive one by one, that information is not going to be in recall. Same thing for Signal, Messenger, et al. Recall sees everything you see. Your credentials and local storage, cookies, cache, et al. see everything you see, and everything you don't see, and things you see on other devices too, and etc etc. - - - "Implemented safely" doesn't include security through obscurity. Past having an encrypted home directory, the only practical way to make it more secure than it currently is would be a separate device that records from tapping your monitor's cables.

haswell 2y ago

The point was that it’s unnecessary for a user to explicitly change the permissions of the home directory as you had described for the data to be at risk. I agree with your last paragraph, and that is exactly what makes Recall such a big problem, and why the security community is reacting strongly against this feature. Assuming the attacker wins, which they currently do on a regular basis, they get to know everything about everyone who has used the computer to a degree of detail that is unprecedented both in scope and in detail. The harm of losing this information to an attacker is potentially extreme, with obvious consequences. Since this is an opt-out feature, Microsoft has essentially guaranteed that a sizable portion of their user base will overnight start feeding attackers more details than they could have ever hoped for. It’s incompetent, irresponsible, and should be categorically rejected by the tech community. I say this while also seeing the value of such a feature if it could be implemented safely. I hope someone figures out a safe architecture because I could see a local model trained on everything I’ve ever done on my PC being a transformational capability. But I wouldn’t go near Recall at this point.

its-summertime 2y ago
If Recall is such a big problem for that, then what of Thunderbird which would give your entire set of emails to anyone with read permissions, or Firefox which would give your email credentials and in turn your entire set of emails to anyone with read permissions. Unless you make a habit of going through all of your email archive one by one, that information is not going to be in recall. Same thing for Signal, Messenger, et al. Recall sees everything you see. Your credentials and local storage, cookies, cache, et al. see everything you see, and everything you don't see, and things you see on other devices too, and etc etc. - - - "Implemented safely" doesn't include security through obscurity. Past having an encrypted home directory, the only practical way to make it more secure than it currently is would be a separate device that records from tapping your monitor's cables.