4 ms·

I think you're taking this the wrong way. I understand that it probably feels patronizing and you don't give a shit that a trait you have that makes your life p

I think you're taking this the wrong way. I understand that it probably feels patronizing and you don't give a shit that a trait you have that makes your life personally hell might be good for the health of the species overall, but I still think it is. I get into this with my wife every now and again because she had ADHD and has often argued she shouldn't procreate because of it. That kind of perspective is narrow to the current human environment, which is not permanent. We're living in a tiny infinitesimal speck of the spectrum of the whole biological timeline of earth, let alone entirely different planets we might someday inhabit. Her constant worry and distractedness might be disadvantageous in a world that requires you to concentrate on unstimulating tasks and in which the threats you see yourself surrounded by are largely imagined and extremely unlikely to be realized. But that is because we currently live in a society of laws and stability, presumably somewhere near the height of civilization. There is no guarantee it will always be this way. When shit hits the fan and the threats get real, my perfectly well adapted to the current world self who fixates for days at a time on narrow tasks, pays little attention to surroundings, and worries about almost nothing, will get killed off within days if not hours. It'll be up to people like her and you to give humanity a chance to make it into the far future. This is why we need diversity. Because even if it sucks to be you who isn't well adapted to the current moment, the current moment is short. It doesn't mean you're a superhero. It just means we have no idea what sorts of traits and behaviors might keep us going under drastically different future pressures and we may as well keep as many different traits around as possible just in case.

emptysongglass 2y ago
I reject your premise entirely. The decades spent living unmedicated taught me that even when I was free to pursue my own interests, I was unable to engage with any of them in any depth, even those artistic or that might otherwise be a more suitable fit to certain spheres of human activity some argue (ignorantly) I'd have an evolutionary advantage in. It impacts everything: healthy regulation of emotions, satisfaction in relationships intimate and platonic, frequency of damaging behavior like substance abuse, and addiction to novel sensory media. It's novelty-seeking that is broken, that's all there is to it. We are lucky medication is available. Others who struggle with other mental pathologies are not so lucky. Self-hatred is not the answer. So is any attempt to make it a virtue. You can just be with the acknowledgement of a maladaptive state.
- rezonant 2y ago
  I'm sorry to hear about the struggles this has put you through, but I might mention that it is not universal that diagnosed sufferers of ADHD are unable to engage with their interests. In fact often direct interests can be highly engaging, while things that need to be done but are not interesting are debilitatingly difficult (executive dysfunction). As with ASD and neurodivergency at large, ADHD is a spectrum, with differing impacts for differing people.
  - doktrin 2y ago
    Could not disagree more. Nothing is “interesting” in perpetuity. Hence why so many with ADHD engage with various topics in an intense but sporadic manner. In the overwhelming majority of cases this scattershot approach is deeply frustrating for the individual, and orders of magnitude less productive - in terms of meaningful creation and innovation - than persevering on a focused set of tasks.
    - andoando 2y ago
      But most people I would say dont even take any interest in any tasks.
    - willy_k 2y ago
      I don’t think your comments are in conflict, being engaged with an interest does not necessarily mean being directly engaged with a project/task related to that interest. I definitely empathize with the scattershot approach being frustrating, but i think that comes out of an intense interest in a topic, and a lack of ability to focus on a specific task, even if it is self-selected and related to an interest. I can think of many examples of times where I was unable to complete a project (in part) due to a drive to answer every question that I encountered in the process, and questions branching from those answers. So yes it does definitely impact productivity and perseverance for specific tasks, but I would separate that from the unique ability to learn intensely about interesting topics with reasonable depth and exceptional breadth that ADHD seems to give.
- doktrin 2y ago

emptysongglass 2y ago

I reject your premise entirely. The decades spent living unmedicated taught me that even when I was free to pursue my own interests, I was unable to engage with any of them in any depth, even those artistic or that might otherwise be a more suitable fit to certain spheres of human activity some argue (ignorantly) I'd have an evolutionary advantage in. It impacts everything: healthy regulation of emotions, satisfaction in relationships intimate and platonic, frequency of damaging behavior like substance abuse, and addiction to novel sensory media. It's novelty-seeking that is broken, that's all there is to it. We are lucky medication is available. Others who struggle with other mental pathologies are not so lucky. Self-hatred is not the answer. So is any attempt to make it a virtue. You can just be with the acknowledgement of a maladaptive state.

rezonant 2y ago
I'm sorry to hear about the struggles this has put you through, but I might mention that it is not universal that diagnosed sufferers of ADHD are unable to engage with their interests. In fact often direct interests can be highly engaging, while things that need to be done but are not interesting are debilitatingly difficult (executive dysfunction). As with ASD and neurodivergency at large, ADHD is a spectrum, with differing impacts for differing people.
- doktrin 2y ago
  Could not disagree more. Nothing is “interesting” in perpetuity. Hence why so many with ADHD engage with various topics in an intense but sporadic manner. In the overwhelming majority of cases this scattershot approach is deeply frustrating for the individual, and orders of magnitude less productive - in terms of meaningful creation and innovation - than persevering on a focused set of tasks.
  - andoando 2y ago
    But most people I would say dont even take any interest in any tasks.
  - willy_k 2y ago
    I don’t think your comments are in conflict, being engaged with an interest does not necessarily mean being directly engaged with a project/task related to that interest. I definitely empathize with the scattershot approach being frustrating, but i think that comes out of an intense interest in a topic, and a lack of ability to focus on a specific task, even if it is self-selected and related to an interest. I can think of many examples of times where I was unable to complete a project (in part) due to a drive to answer every question that I encountered in the process, and questions branching from those answers. So yes it does definitely impact productivity and perseverance for specific tasks, but I would separate that from the unique ability to learn intensely about interesting topics with reasonable depth and exceptional breadth that ADHD seems to give.
doktrin 2y ago