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worthwhile comment by jonathansnook: "The problem with the current state of HTML is that it’s elements for interactivity are quite limited without JavaScript. W

by diN0bot 18y ago

worthwhile comment by jonathansnook: "The problem with the current state of HTML is that it’s elements for interactivity are quite limited without JavaScript. We have a limited set of form elements and then we fall back to the page request/response of old. This is a problem that SVG does not solve. Sure, it might make certain presentation elements easier to create but that’s more of a CSS issue than an HTML issue. This is something that HTML5 is trying to address with additional input types. We’ll still need JavaScript though to mimic more common complex desktop interactions like tree structures and tri-state inputs."

newt0311 18y ago
A more pressing problem with SVG is that it is like every other W3C standard: bloated, unwieldy, and obfuscated. Not to mention that SVG does not have all the capabilities of PS. PS is a complete turing complete language specialized for drawing vector graphics. SVG is more restricted and certainly slower to work with, not as well supported, and very very verbose.
- jsrn 18y ago
  > [...] and very very verbose it's possible to write compact SVG. For example, it has a simple and very compact sub-language for specifying paths (with one-letter commands): http://www.w3.org/TR/SVG/paths.html#PathDataBNF http://www.w3.org/TR/SVG/paths.html#PathDataBNF What do you mean by 'not as well supported'? SVG is supported by Firefox, Opera and Webkit (Safari / Chrome). I'm not aware of any Browser that supports Postscript. As for turing complete: SVG is fully scriptable with Javascript, which is turing complete and built-in in every browser.
  - kragen 18y ago
    Some parts of SVG are supported by those browsers; other parts aren't. Generally the implementations are pretty slow and, last I checked, unstable too.
  - Raphael 18y ago
    I've tried using it, and at some points it starts to break down. For example, if I want to change just one point on a path, I have to parse through the entire string instead of just setting a property to a value.
  - newt0311 18y ago
    Every linux box in existence supports PS, very well. So does every PDF reader. That covers over 80% of all computers. Extending this support could be done through a plugin. Compare this to the fact that IE does not support SVG and PS is a far better standard to work with in terms of vector drawing. As to the turing completeness of SVG, how efficiently can JS transform vectors in comparison to PS. Not very fast. Also, nobody wants to draw just paths.
    - ralph 18y ago
      "So does every PDF reader." I don't think every PDF reader supports PostScript very well. Is that what you meant to say?
- cousin_it 18y ago
  Yes, that's true. Did you know SVG 1.2 has sockets? http://www.w3.org/TR/2004/WD-SVG12-20041027/api.html#socket http://www.w3.org/TR/2004/WD-SVG12-20041027/api.html#socket

by diN0bot 18y ago

newt0311 18y ago

A more pressing problem with SVG is that it is like every other W3C standard: bloated, unwieldy, and obfuscated. Not to mention that SVG does not have all the capabilities of PS. PS is a complete turing complete language specialized for drawing vector graphics. SVG is more restricted and certainly slower to work with, not as well supported, and very very verbose.

jsrn 18y ago
> [...] and very very verbose it's possible to write compact SVG. For example, it has a simple and very compact sub-language for specifying paths (with one-letter commands): http://www.w3.org/TR/SVG/paths.html#PathDataBNF http://www.w3.org/TR/SVG/paths.html#PathDataBNF What do you mean by 'not as well supported'? SVG is supported by Firefox, Opera and Webkit (Safari / Chrome). I'm not aware of any Browser that supports Postscript. As for turing complete: SVG is fully scriptable with Javascript, which is turing complete and built-in in every browser.
- kragen 18y ago
  Some parts of SVG are supported by those browsers; other parts aren't. Generally the implementations are pretty slow and, last I checked, unstable too.
- Raphael 18y ago
  I've tried using it, and at some points it starts to break down. For example, if I want to change just one point on a path, I have to parse through the entire string instead of just setting a property to a value.
- newt0311 18y ago
  Every linux box in existence supports PS, very well. So does every PDF reader. That covers over 80% of all computers. Extending this support could be done through a plugin. Compare this to the fact that IE does not support SVG and PS is a far better standard to work with in terms of vector drawing. As to the turing completeness of SVG, how efficiently can JS transform vectors in comparison to PS. Not very fast. Also, nobody wants to draw just paths.
  - ralph 18y ago
    "So does every PDF reader." I don't think every PDF reader supports PostScript very well. Is that what you meant to say?
cousin_it 18y ago
Yes, that's true. Did you know SVG 1.2 has sockets? http://www.w3.org/TR/2004/WD-SVG12-20041027/api.html#socket http://www.w3.org/TR/2004/WD-SVG12-20041027/api.html#socket