3 ms·

The displacement is only a bad thing if there are no interactions between the native ecology and the new one. If there are interactions, then the ecologies sta

by hosh 2y ago

The displacement is only a bad thing if there are no interactions between the native ecology and the new one. If there are interactions, then the ecologies start merging and adapting. The native species can still thrive because there is participation among both old and new.

throwup238 2y ago
So even by your standard of weapons grade copium, it's always bad. Invasive species outcompete native ones by definition so they can't thrive. Seriously, go look at the iceplant covering California's coasts [1]. Or the himalayan blackberry all over the pacific north west [2]. Or the kudzu vine all over the south east US [3]. They smother native competitors and eliminate them everywhere they go, turning once diverse ecosystems into monocultures. The ecosystems don't adapt, they get wiped clean of any native plants whose niche overlaps even slightly with the invader. If the native species could adapt, the introduced species wouldn't be called "invasive" but "naturalized" [1] https://www.fiscaliniranchpreserve.org/images/Photo%201%20NPS%20dunes-covered-in-iceplant.jpg https://www.fiscaliniranchpreserve.org/images/Photo%201%20NP... [2] https://extension.oregonstate.edu/sites/default/files/styles/full/public/images/2024-01/blackberry-thicket.jpg https://extension.oregonstate.edu/sites/default/files/styles... [3] https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/4/4c/Kudzu_on_trees_in_Atlanta%2C_Georgia.jpg https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/4/4c/Kudzu_on...
- wbazant 2y ago
  Something interesting about your three pictures, there's very little concrete or asphalt in them, just poor old plants that we did not spend enough effort protecting from other plants. Myth of wilderness? A typical knotweed patch that I see here in Scotland is in a disturbed urban area, for example by the railway. While it might be displacing a native species that takes over ruderal sites, e.g. blackberry or gorse, it still performs its functions of urban greenery - makes habitat for birds, cleans up the city air a bit, covers up trash on the ground.
  - exDM69 2y ago
    Its roots are very strong and go down 3 meters into the ground, known to destroy foundations of houses, under ground plumbing and wires and other infrastructure. Some of the roots I've dug out had about 8cm diameter and they were tough stuff. No you don't want this stuff even in urban wasteland. Or growing in railroad ballast where it's can cause a very expensive clean up operation or destabilize the foundation of the railroad.
- fuzztester 2y ago
  Also, water hyacinth, is a very invasive species. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pontederia_crassipes https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pontederia_crassipes Actually the article says it is invasive in many countries.
hosh 2y ago
I can’t reply directly to that. You have to introduce species that bridges the gap and creates those links. To give an example with kadzu: https://www.smithsonianmag.com/science-nature/true-story-kudzu-vine-ate-south-180956325/ https://www.smithsonianmag.com/science-nature/true-story-kud... Tldr: kadzu turns out not to be as invasive as people thought, and the kadzu bug has been eating its way through them.
- deleted 2y ago
  [deleted]

by hosh 2y ago

throwup238 2y ago

So even by your standard of weapons grade copium, it's always bad. Invasive species outcompete native ones by definition so they can't thrive. Seriously, go look at the iceplant covering California's coasts [1]. Or the himalayan blackberry all over the pacific north west [2]. Or the kudzu vine all over the south east US [3]. They smother native competitors and eliminate them everywhere they go, turning once diverse ecosystems into monocultures. The ecosystems don't adapt, they get wiped clean of any native plants whose niche overlaps even slightly with the invader. If the native species could adapt, the introduced species wouldn't be called "invasive" but "naturalized" [1] https://www.fiscaliniranchpreserve.org/images/Photo%201%20NPS%20dunes-covered-in-iceplant.jpg https://www.fiscaliniranchpreserve.org/images/Photo%201%20NP... [2] https://extension.oregonstate.edu/sites/default/files/styles/full/public/images/2024-01/blackberry-thicket.jpg https://extension.oregonstate.edu/sites/default/files/styles... [3] https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/4/4c/Kudzu_on_trees_in_Atlanta%2C_Georgia.jpg https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/4/4c/Kudzu_on...

wbazant 2y ago
Something interesting about your three pictures, there's very little concrete or asphalt in them, just poor old plants that we did not spend enough effort protecting from other plants. Myth of wilderness? A typical knotweed patch that I see here in Scotland is in a disturbed urban area, for example by the railway. While it might be displacing a native species that takes over ruderal sites, e.g. blackberry or gorse, it still performs its functions of urban greenery - makes habitat for birds, cleans up the city air a bit, covers up trash on the ground.
- exDM69 2y ago
  Its roots are very strong and go down 3 meters into the ground, known to destroy foundations of houses, under ground plumbing and wires and other infrastructure. Some of the roots I've dug out had about 8cm diameter and they were tough stuff. No you don't want this stuff even in urban wasteland. Or growing in railroad ballast where it's can cause a very expensive clean up operation or destabilize the foundation of the railroad.
fuzztester 2y ago
Also, water hyacinth, is a very invasive species. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pontederia_crassipes https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pontederia_crassipes Actually the article says it is invasive in many countries.

hosh 2y ago

I can’t reply directly to that. You have to introduce species that bridges the gap and creates those links. To give an example with kadzu: https://www.smithsonianmag.com/science-nature/true-story-kudzu-vine-ate-south-180956325/ https://www.smithsonianmag.com/science-nature/true-story-kud... Tldr: kadzu turns out not to be as invasive as people thought, and the kadzu bug has been eating its way through them.

deleted 2y ago
[deleted]