10 ms·

I will be getting my first mac soon (I am still sad about it), which means I will need to figure out the WM. Currently I am considering yabai and amethyst. I

I will be getting my first mac soon (I am still sad about it), which means I will need to figure out the WM. Currently I am considering yabai and amethyst. I guess now I should add AeroSpace to the list. If you are actually using tiling WM on mac, could you share which one and why?

bee_rider 2y ago
I wonder… this isn’t what you want, but maybe just tmux in a full screen, or half-screen terminal (if you need a web browser) would suffice? Plus their built in “spaces” (workspaces) feature.
andrewla 2y ago
For what it's worth, I don't think there's a lot of value in these. I hate the MacOS environment as much as anyone, but all the attempts to create tiling managers have resulted in strange unusable quirky behavior. You're better off just sucking it up and using the native UI until you get sufficiently familiar with it that it rarely gets in your way too much. Meanwhile keep lobbying your employer (assuming that you are being forced into this by your job) to support Linux for development workstations.
- happymellon 2y ago
  Completely agree with this take. No matter how sophisticated these Mac Window Managers get, MacOS will always mess with the windows because it knows better than you. That's why people buy Macs, and it's not going to change. If you don't like this, then you actually don't like Macs. It's opinionated, and it's opinions do not match yours. I would have liked window snapping, but instead we have 1/2 baked split screen virtual desktops. I simply don't understand why people use them for development environments, the "Unix underneath" doesn't help enough in enough scenarios when it's hostile in so many others.
  - jwells89 2y ago
    > I would have liked window snapping, but instead we have 1/2 baked split screen virtual desktops. There’s at least non-fullscreen tiling available now if you hold down Option/Alt when hovering over the green traffic light (which also changes the corresponding Window menu items to “Move Window to (Left|Right) Side of Screen). There should probably be a toggle somewhere that makes this the default. > I simply don't understand why people use them for development environments, the "Unix underneath" doesn't help enough in enough scenarios when it's hostile in so many others. A lot of it is that the hardware is well-rounded and not as riddled with gambles/compromises as most other laptops are. Usually non-Apple laptops have at least one or two things that suck about them, with the most frequent being battery life, fan noise, and poor thermal design but include mediocre screen, bad keyboard, bad trackpad, bad power management, bad unplugged performance, bad port placement, and chintzy build among other things. Some percentage of users also just like macOS as it is, though.
  - positus 2y ago
    I buy computers that run macOS for a couple reasons: - it’s generally smooth and stable from a UI standpoint - it has mostly sane defaults - it has great font rendering - the video and audio subsystems are rock solid - it has access to every development tool I need daily via homebrew It seems like there are generally two perspectives: - “I shouldn’t have to change the way I want to do things” - “I don’t mind changing to another way of doing things” The first group I think has a harder time with macOS. A while back I decided to experiment with only using the default first-party apps for macOS for everything, and it greatly changed the amount of OS customization I did from that point on. I still live in iTerm for most of the day, but I don’t really feel hindered by the OS in any way anymore. From my experience Windows actively attempts to subvert my clear, authoritative commands, second guesses every admin instruction, interrupts me with focus changes and dialog boxes instead of giving the active window absolute priority (this happens sometimes with macOS, too), and comes with bloat right out of the box. When this developer thinks about a hostile OS, Windows 11 is rhe first thing that comes to mind.
    - happymellon 2y ago
      > When this developer thinks about a hostile OS, Windows 11 is rhe first thing that comes to mind. Why bring up whataboutism? I honestly don't care that Windows is also hostile. It also has the worst implementation of virtual desktops. What has that got to do with MacOS also being generally terrible. The rest of your comment adds nothing, as it just repeats what I said.
    - gray_-_wolf 2y ago
      The problems is that I will still use linux for all my spare-time computing, so obviously I would like the experience to be as same as possible.
- vidarh 2y ago
  Fully agree with this. Used Yabai at first last time I was forced to use a Mac. Hated it with a passion. It was "close", but not close enough, and so I felt I was fighting it all the time. Ended up running most applications full-screen instead, and relying on tiling in iTerm2 or the applications most of the time instead. It helped that I was connected to a second monitor most of the time.
- darkteflon 2y ago
  Generally agree with this - have had lots of buggy experiences with Amethyst, Yabai, Hammerspoon, etc. That said, Rectangle works - in my experience - flawlessly and is an essential addition to Mac window management. It’s not as ambitious as a full TWM, but what it does provide (snapping, hotkeys, etc) is essential.
wizhi 2y ago
I've been there, being forced to use it for work.. I tried both Yabai and Amethyst and, frankly, neither provide a clean experience. Yabai requires disabling some OS security feature iirc, which may or may not be an issue for you. I seem to recall having issues with it, and switching to Amethyst pretty soon after. It might also only support BSP layout, which I dislike - stacks all the way. Amethyst feels a little half baked. It works well enough, but configuration is through a GUI and saved in some non text format, making it not difficult friendly. It also doesn't support things like moving windows between workspaces, meaning you need to have additional bindings for that through the MacOS command center or whatever it's called. Overall, I managed with Amethyst for close to 2 years, so that's the one I'd recommend of the two. Luckily I'm back on a Linux machine and can use river now. :) Good luck!
- happymellon 2y ago
  > It also doesn't support things like moving windows between workspaces It's been a while since I used Amethyst as the Mac is now on complete corporate lockdown, but I remember that being the biggest feature I used on Amethyst. MacOS doesn't support it, but Amethyst did.
  - tanelso217 2y ago
    I lost my Amethyst due to corporate lockdown rebuild a few weeks ago. MacOS window management is obnoxious without it and I'm much less productive due to losing my tools.
  - wizhi 2y ago
    I am likely misremembering, and mixing it was something else! There definitely was something vital I wasn't able to do through just Amethyst though.
namdnay 2y ago
I'm not an expert, but isn't Rectangle the simplest and easiest way to manage this? I love it
- vundercind 2y ago
  Hell, I’m still on Spectacle. I’ll look at switching to something else as soon as it gives me even a single problem. Zero in years and years, including several years of no longer being updated.
- __MatrixMan__ 2y ago
  I've spent some time evaluating MacOS tiling apps. Rectangle is one of them. I've so far given up on all of them because they lack the ability to directionally reassign focus. So like if I have windows in four corners, and focus is in the bottom left, I want something like ?-k ?-l to move focus up and then right. Now focus should be in the upper right window. Have I missed it? Does rectangle make this possible? Amethyst (xmonad inspired) gets close, but I want directionality, not cycles within cycles. So far my solution is to just use i3 on my desktop and have a bunch of ssh sessions into my macbook, which is fine until I do a clipboard-yank through the ssh session and wonder why I can't paste the contents into the browser on the linux side.
torstenvl 2y ago
It isn't i3-like, more window snapping than fractal tiling, but I really like Rectangle. I used Magnet previously and also liked it.
Cu3PO42 2y ago
Out of all of these, I've only tried Yabai. It's fine. Things mostly work like I expect them to and I rarely encounter a situation that isn't fixed by restarting Yabai. That said, I'm hardly a power user. I have not disabled SIP and instead simulate features that would require it as best as possible through other means. E.g. workspaces can be switched by dispatching a key combination that is handled by macOS natively. You can check out my configs here [0] if you are so inclined, but it's not super polished. [0] https://github.com/Cu3PO42/gleaming-glacier/tree/next https://github.com/Cu3PO42/gleaming-glacier/tree/next

bee_rider 2y ago

I wonder… this isn’t what you want, but maybe just tmux in a full screen, or half-screen terminal (if you need a web browser) would suffice? Plus their built in “spaces” (workspaces) feature.

andrewla 2y ago

For what it's worth, I don't think there's a lot of value in these. I hate the MacOS environment as much as anyone, but all the attempts to create tiling managers have resulted in strange unusable quirky behavior. You're better off just sucking it up and using the native UI until you get sufficiently familiar with it that it rarely gets in your way too much. Meanwhile keep lobbying your employer (assuming that you are being forced into this by your job) to support Linux for development workstations.

happymellon 2y ago
Completely agree with this take. No matter how sophisticated these Mac Window Managers get, MacOS will always mess with the windows because it knows better than you. That's why people buy Macs, and it's not going to change. If you don't like this, then you actually don't like Macs. It's opinionated, and it's opinions do not match yours. I would have liked window snapping, but instead we have 1/2 baked split screen virtual desktops. I simply don't understand why people use them for development environments, the "Unix underneath" doesn't help enough in enough scenarios when it's hostile in so many others.
- jwells89 2y ago
  > I would have liked window snapping, but instead we have 1/2 baked split screen virtual desktops. There’s at least non-fullscreen tiling available now if you hold down Option/Alt when hovering over the green traffic light (which also changes the corresponding Window menu items to “Move Window to (Left|Right) Side of Screen). There should probably be a toggle somewhere that makes this the default. > I simply don't understand why people use them for development environments, the "Unix underneath" doesn't help enough in enough scenarios when it's hostile in so many others. A lot of it is that the hardware is well-rounded and not as riddled with gambles/compromises as most other laptops are. Usually non-Apple laptops have at least one or two things that suck about them, with the most frequent being battery life, fan noise, and poor thermal design but include mediocre screen, bad keyboard, bad trackpad, bad power management, bad unplugged performance, bad port placement, and chintzy build among other things. Some percentage of users also just like macOS as it is, though.
- positus 2y ago
  I buy computers that run macOS for a couple reasons: - it’s generally smooth and stable from a UI standpoint - it has mostly sane defaults - it has great font rendering - the video and audio subsystems are rock solid - it has access to every development tool I need daily via homebrew It seems like there are generally two perspectives: - “I shouldn’t have to change the way I want to do things” - “I don’t mind changing to another way of doing things” The first group I think has a harder time with macOS. A while back I decided to experiment with only using the default first-party apps for macOS for everything, and it greatly changed the amount of OS customization I did from that point on. I still live in iTerm for most of the day, but I don’t really feel hindered by the OS in any way anymore. From my experience Windows actively attempts to subvert my clear, authoritative commands, second guesses every admin instruction, interrupts me with focus changes and dialog boxes instead of giving the active window absolute priority (this happens sometimes with macOS, too), and comes with bloat right out of the box. When this developer thinks about a hostile OS, Windows 11 is rhe first thing that comes to mind.
  - happymellon 2y ago
    > When this developer thinks about a hostile OS, Windows 11 is rhe first thing that comes to mind. Why bring up whataboutism? I honestly don't care that Windows is also hostile. It also has the worst implementation of virtual desktops. What has that got to do with MacOS also being generally terrible. The rest of your comment adds nothing, as it just repeats what I said.
  - gray_-_wolf 2y ago
    The problems is that I will still use linux for all my spare-time computing, so obviously I would like the experience to be as same as possible.
vidarh 2y ago
Fully agree with this. Used Yabai at first last time I was forced to use a Mac. Hated it with a passion. It was "close", but not close enough, and so I felt I was fighting it all the time. Ended up running most applications full-screen instead, and relying on tiling in iTerm2 or the applications most of the time instead. It helped that I was connected to a second monitor most of the time.
darkteflon 2y ago
Generally agree with this - have had lots of buggy experiences with Amethyst, Yabai, Hammerspoon, etc. That said, Rectangle works - in my experience - flawlessly and is an essential addition to Mac window management. It’s not as ambitious as a full TWM, but what it does provide (snapping, hotkeys, etc) is essential.

wizhi 2y ago

I've been there, being forced to use it for work.. I tried both Yabai and Amethyst and, frankly, neither provide a clean experience. Yabai requires disabling some OS security feature iirc, which may or may not be an issue for you. I seem to recall having issues with it, and switching to Amethyst pretty soon after. It might also only support BSP layout, which I dislike - stacks all the way. Amethyst feels a little half baked. It works well enough, but configuration is through a GUI and saved in some non text format, making it not difficult friendly. It also doesn't support things like moving windows between workspaces, meaning you need to have additional bindings for that through the MacOS command center or whatever it's called. Overall, I managed with Amethyst for close to 2 years, so that's the one I'd recommend of the two. Luckily I'm back on a Linux machine and can use river now. :) Good luck!

happymellon 2y ago
> It also doesn't support things like moving windows between workspaces It's been a while since I used Amethyst as the Mac is now on complete corporate lockdown, but I remember that being the biggest feature I used on Amethyst. MacOS doesn't support it, but Amethyst did.
- tanelso217 2y ago
  I lost my Amethyst due to corporate lockdown rebuild a few weeks ago. MacOS window management is obnoxious without it and I'm much less productive due to losing my tools.
- wizhi 2y ago
  I am likely misremembering, and mixing it was something else! There definitely was something vital I wasn't able to do through just Amethyst though.

namdnay 2y ago

I'm not an expert, but isn't Rectangle the simplest and easiest way to manage this? I love it

vundercind 2y ago
Hell, I’m still on Spectacle. I’ll look at switching to something else as soon as it gives me even a single problem. Zero in years and years, including several years of no longer being updated.
__MatrixMan__ 2y ago
I've spent some time evaluating MacOS tiling apps. Rectangle is one of them. I've so far given up on all of them because they lack the ability to directionally reassign focus. So like if I have windows in four corners, and focus is in the bottom left, I want something like ?-k ?-l to move focus up and then right. Now focus should be in the upper right window. Have I missed it? Does rectangle make this possible? Amethyst (xmonad inspired) gets close, but I want directionality, not cycles within cycles. So far my solution is to just use i3 on my desktop and have a bunch of ssh sessions into my macbook, which is fine until I do a clipboard-yank through the ssh session and wonder why I can't paste the contents into the browser on the linux side.

torstenvl 2y ago

It isn't i3-like, more window snapping than fractal tiling, but I really like Rectangle. I used Magnet previously and also liked it.

Cu3PO42 2y ago

Out of all of these, I've only tried Yabai. It's fine. Things mostly work like I expect them to and I rarely encounter a situation that isn't fixed by restarting Yabai. That said, I'm hardly a power user. I have not disabled SIP and instead simulate features that would require it as best as possible through other means. E.g. workspaces can be switched by dispatching a key combination that is handled by macOS natively. You can check out my configs here [0] if you are so inclined, but it's not super polished. [0] https://github.com/Cu3PO42/gleaming-glacier/tree/next https://github.com/Cu3PO42/gleaming-glacier/tree/next