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A friend of mine acquired an investment property in Spain and after a while okupas moved in, lock changed etc. A woman with two children. They were clearly help

A friend of mine acquired an investment property in Spain and after a while okupas moved in, lock changed etc. A woman with two children. They were clearly helped with an organized team to get into that place. The sad resolution after lots of headache and thinking was to pay the invaders the 5000EUR they demanded to move out. There was some followup information about what happened after this. She was picked up by a car and taken to the next place to occupy.

diggan 2y ago
On the other hand of issues like this, is the people forced to move away from their neighborhoods because outsiders keep acquiring "investment properties" and price out the current tenants. We're finally getting more protections from this, but there been a lot of hurt because of this already. Entire neighborhoods in Barcelona (like Barceloneta) had generational families being forced away because of issues like this. So on hand, it sucks for your wealthy friend that their investment only made X% amount instead of XX% amount. But on the other hand, I feel for the people who are being forced away from their home as well, because there still isn't enough protections for the people who actually live and work here.
- tiborsaas 2y ago
  This is a complex problem, I understand that rent is a sensitive issue. But sustaining a system that criminals actively exploit is probably resulting in the worst possible outcome for everyone. He did not rent the place out, but preferred to keep it to themselves as a pleasant place to spend a few weeks to months as they are getting old now. But after this incident he sold it quickly.
  - diggan 2y ago
    > He did not rent the place out, but preferred to keep it to themselves as a pleasant place to spend a few weeks to months as they are getting old now. But after this incident he sold it quickly. If it's their primary residence, then it's not considered "occupation" but rather "breaking and entering", and contacting the local police would get the criminals removed quickly, without much fuss. It sounds more like it was a vacation house, and potentially for people who don't actually live in the country. In that case, it gets harder to claim they're in a morally superior position, especially considering the housing crisis we face here, that gets worse and worse every day.
    - Wytwwww 2y ago
      I'm just curious because I have a only very limited understanding of the situation there but surely it must have been considerably worse back in 2007-2008 compared to now? Since housing prices seem to still be ~30% lower inflation adjusted currently than they were before the GFC.
      - taopai 2y ago
        In 2007 you could rent a flat in Barcelona for ~500 euros. Know a two room ugly old flat will cost you at least 1000 euros. And still raising. A normal flat will cost you 1500 euros, which is the average monthly net salary there.
      - e40 2y ago
        I don’t think immigration issues were as bad then.
  - Vegenoid 2y ago
    Without making judgement myself, this is exactly what squatters, and those who support them, would consider a success story: 1. The house has wealthy owners who treat it as an investment 2. The house remains empty almost all of the time 3. Squatters occupy the residence and get more utility out of it than the owners 4. As a result, the owners sell the residence, maybe to someone who will live in it or rent it (but maybe not). The lives of the previous owners are largely unchanged. I'm not exactly pro-squatting, but this isn't a very sympathetic story.
    - tiborsaas 2y ago
      I did not dot share this story to gain sympathy, this is simply what happened. I'd be caution against shifting over to victim blaming, like he asked for it. Rings a bell?
      - Vegenoid 2y ago
        Frankly, I think jumping straight to comparing me to rape apologists is a terrible way to respond to this. Don't do that if you want to have constructive discussions.
- atlantic 2y ago
  That's true. The buyers of real estate on a large scale are often transnational investment funds. And they sometimes sit on empty properties for decades, waiting for them to accrue value. Some kind of regulation is certainly required. Or higher taxation of second homes. But squatting contributes nothing to solving this problem. It just promotes anarchy.
  - orthecreedence 2y ago
    > But squatting contributes nothing to solving this problem. Hang on, it actually does solve the housing problem by one important metric: an empty house has someone living in it now. I understand there are other metrics (cost to the owner) but it does do something to solve part of the problem, and I'd argue that the more a property is used as an invesment vehicle (sitting there collecting dust) the more it solves the problem. If someone is buying a house to fix it up and live in it as a primary residence, then squatters can fuck right off. But if I bought my sixth home and make my yearly visit to it and notice it has occupants, they aren't the assholes here. I am.
    - atlantic 2y ago
      Your metrics are wrong. The measure is not so much how many houses are occupied, as how many houses are occupied by local working people (as opposed to tourists / hippies / anarchists).
      - orthecreedence 2y ago
        My metrics aren't wrong. You just don't agree with them. That's fine.
  - madaxe_again 2y ago
    For every buyer there is a seller. Are we to understand that the sellers are being forced to sell, and aren’t being paid? Because otherwise it sounds awfully like foreign capital is flowing into the economy, which is hard to describe as a disaster.
zrn900 2y ago
[flagged]
_jplc 2y ago
[flagged]
passwordle 2y ago
> There was some followup information about what happened after this. She was picked up by a car and taken to the next place to occupy. I'm so sorry to hear that your friend eventually had to sell his vacation home. Fuck that poor woman and her two kids, if they're so poor they should live on the streets in the dirt where they belong !
- tiborsaas 2y ago
  She had a job though.
- emptyfile 2y ago
  [dead]

diggan 2y ago

On the other hand of issues like this, is the people forced to move away from their neighborhoods because outsiders keep acquiring "investment properties" and price out the current tenants. We're finally getting more protections from this, but there been a lot of hurt because of this already. Entire neighborhoods in Barcelona (like Barceloneta) had generational families being forced away because of issues like this. So on hand, it sucks for your wealthy friend that their investment only made X% amount instead of XX% amount. But on the other hand, I feel for the people who are being forced away from their home as well, because there still isn't enough protections for the people who actually live and work here.

tiborsaas 2y ago
This is a complex problem, I understand that rent is a sensitive issue. But sustaining a system that criminals actively exploit is probably resulting in the worst possible outcome for everyone. He did not rent the place out, but preferred to keep it to themselves as a pleasant place to spend a few weeks to months as they are getting old now. But after this incident he sold it quickly.
- diggan 2y ago
  > He did not rent the place out, but preferred to keep it to themselves as a pleasant place to spend a few weeks to months as they are getting old now. But after this incident he sold it quickly. If it's their primary residence, then it's not considered "occupation" but rather "breaking and entering", and contacting the local police would get the criminals removed quickly, without much fuss. It sounds more like it was a vacation house, and potentially for people who don't actually live in the country. In that case, it gets harder to claim they're in a morally superior position, especially considering the housing crisis we face here, that gets worse and worse every day.
  - Wytwwww 2y ago
    I'm just curious because I have a only very limited understanding of the situation there but surely it must have been considerably worse back in 2007-2008 compared to now? Since housing prices seem to still be ~30% lower inflation adjusted currently than they were before the GFC.
    - taopai 2y ago
      In 2007 you could rent a flat in Barcelona for ~500 euros. Know a two room ugly old flat will cost you at least 1000 euros. And still raising. A normal flat will cost you 1500 euros, which is the average monthly net salary there.
    - e40 2y ago
      I don’t think immigration issues were as bad then.
- Vegenoid 2y ago
  Without making judgement myself, this is exactly what squatters, and those who support them, would consider a success story: 1. The house has wealthy owners who treat it as an investment 2. The house remains empty almost all of the time 3. Squatters occupy the residence and get more utility out of it than the owners 4. As a result, the owners sell the residence, maybe to someone who will live in it or rent it (but maybe not). The lives of the previous owners are largely unchanged. I'm not exactly pro-squatting, but this isn't a very sympathetic story.
  - tiborsaas 2y ago
    I did not dot share this story to gain sympathy, this is simply what happened. I'd be caution against shifting over to victim blaming, like he asked for it. Rings a bell?
    - Vegenoid 2y ago
      Frankly, I think jumping straight to comparing me to rape apologists is a terrible way to respond to this. Don't do that if you want to have constructive discussions.
atlantic 2y ago
That's true. The buyers of real estate on a large scale are often transnational investment funds. And they sometimes sit on empty properties for decades, waiting for them to accrue value. Some kind of regulation is certainly required. Or higher taxation of second homes. But squatting contributes nothing to solving this problem. It just promotes anarchy.
- orthecreedence 2y ago
  > But squatting contributes nothing to solving this problem. Hang on, it actually does solve the housing problem by one important metric: an empty house has someone living in it now. I understand there are other metrics (cost to the owner) but it does do something to solve part of the problem, and I'd argue that the more a property is used as an invesment vehicle (sitting there collecting dust) the more it solves the problem. If someone is buying a house to fix it up and live in it as a primary residence, then squatters can fuck right off. But if I bought my sixth home and make my yearly visit to it and notice it has occupants, they aren't the assholes here. I am.
  - atlantic 2y ago
    Your metrics are wrong. The measure is not so much how many houses are occupied, as how many houses are occupied by local working people (as opposed to tourists / hippies / anarchists).
    - orthecreedence 2y ago
      My metrics aren't wrong. You just don't agree with them. That's fine.
- madaxe_again 2y ago
  For every buyer there is a seller. Are we to understand that the sellers are being forced to sell, and aren’t being paid? Because otherwise it sounds awfully like foreign capital is flowing into the economy, which is hard to describe as a disaster.

zrn900 2y ago

[flagged]

_jplc 2y ago

[flagged]

passwordle 2y ago

> There was some followup information about what happened after this. She was picked up by a car and taken to the next place to occupy. I'm so sorry to hear that your friend eventually had to sell his vacation home. Fuck that poor woman and her two kids, if they're so poor they should live on the streets in the dirt where they belong !

tiborsaas 2y ago
She had a job though.
emptyfile 2y ago
[dead]