6 ms·

I have family who let out property in Spain. They, along with other people in a similar position to them, have all suddenly become experts in smart home tech.

I have family who let out property in Spain. They, along with other people in a similar position to them, have all suddenly become experts in smart home tech. They have video doorbells, motion sensors, door sensors, etc. All so that they can be alerted to any activity immediately, allowing them to act within the exceptionally short eviction window. The reality on the ground is that these ridiculous policies are widely exploited.

sgfgross 2y ago
I couldn't agree more. My parents have an "okupa" and they can't even go talk to her or she can sue them. They also have to pay for her electricity or water, otherwise, she has the right to sue them for "endangerment". And she wasn't even a tenant. She has been there for 4 months now, and the judicial system simply works against home owners, it's crazy!
chous 2y ago
I don't agree. It's a non-existing problem that the media insists us to convince otherwise, just to force us to pay for useless and absurdly expensive monthly services. Poor people being afraid of other poor people, a classic.
- nerdawson 2y ago
  I don't doubt the media are prepared to jump on and inflate any problem if it'll drive engagement. That doesn't mean the underlying issue isn't real. I could offer some anecdotal evidence but that seems pointless. Especially when the stats speak for themselves. It's not just media hype.
- miguelxt 2y ago
  It may be overblown by media, sure, let's say we agree on that, but I know of at least 3 cases of very close people that have suffered the issue in the last 3 years alone. It may be my social bubble, but I don't think it's a completely fabricated matter.
  - diggan 2y ago
    > It may be overblown by media, sure, let's say we agree on that, but I know of at least 3 cases of very close people that have suffered the issue in the last 3 years alone. For curiosity's sake, were the affected people owners of multiple properties or was this issue considering their primary residential homes that they were actively living in?
  - taopai 2y ago
    I know no one who had his first home or summer house squatted. No one. I've lived here all my life. I know at least 15 okupas who lived +4 years in properties of banks, unused and not finished, which, after eviction, are still unused and unmaintained. What harm did this okupas do? They didn't contributed to rent inflation, so they did some good. Having property unused and don't having an eye on it is madness. I wouldn't do it. That's common sense. People think that money buy things. Ok, buy a Ferrari and park it outside of a big city and leave it there during a month. This law is here to protect the right of housing. Some mafias use it? Could be, but this law works to protect real families and the benefits are much greater than the harm that opportunists do abusing it, this organizations doesn't have anything to do with the okupa movement.
zrn900 2y ago
Yep. Those policies that force the real estate owners to use their properties instead of letting them sit empty and appreciate for profit like in the US are ridiculous. The not-ridiculous policy is allowing them to cripple the entire society for profit by doing the opposite. It works very well. https://www.cbsnews.com/news/homes-for-sale-affordable-housing-prices/ https://www.cbsnews.com/news/homes-for-sale-affordable-housi...
- nerdawson 2y ago
  Perhaps that's the intent of the policy. The actual outcome on the other hand harms people who are using their properties. - Holidays lets - Standard lets where there's a changeover - Properties for sale - Your own home when you're on holiday Your comment is completely disconnected from the reality of the situation facing ordinary middle-class people. Maybe you could argue that squatters need support but subsidising them is the role of the state, not a job for individual citizens.
  - zrn900 2y ago
    > The actual outcome The actual outcome is that the policy does force people to use their houses and increase the available rental houses. > ordinary middle-class people. You seem to have meant 'working-class'. Outside the US nobody calls them 'middle class'. Middle class people in Spain would be white collar professionals who own more than one house. You people are literally making up things about a country that you don't know about. No. It does not cause issues for the 'working class'. Okupas don't target single home owner working class people. They target at least white collar professionals, and actually much richer aristocrats and investment funds. > subsidising them is the role of the state, not a job for individual citizens. That's what you think. Your culture thinks. This is a different society. They think differently.
    - nerdawson 2y ago
      > You people are literally making up things about a country that you don't know about. I’m not from the US. I spent 2 years living in Spain. Are you claiming that the average Spanish citizen believes that a typical person should be responsible for freeloaders rather than the government?

sgfgross 2y ago

I couldn't agree more. My parents have an "okupa" and they can't even go talk to her or she can sue them. They also have to pay for her electricity or water, otherwise, she has the right to sue them for "endangerment". And she wasn't even a tenant. She has been there for 4 months now, and the judicial system simply works against home owners, it's crazy!

chous 2y ago

I don't agree. It's a non-existing problem that the media insists us to convince otherwise, just to force us to pay for useless and absurdly expensive monthly services. Poor people being afraid of other poor people, a classic.

nerdawson 2y ago
I don't doubt the media are prepared to jump on and inflate any problem if it'll drive engagement. That doesn't mean the underlying issue isn't real. I could offer some anecdotal evidence but that seems pointless. Especially when the stats speak for themselves. It's not just media hype.
miguelxt 2y ago
It may be overblown by media, sure, let's say we agree on that, but I know of at least 3 cases of very close people that have suffered the issue in the last 3 years alone. It may be my social bubble, but I don't think it's a completely fabricated matter.
- diggan 2y ago
  > It may be overblown by media, sure, let's say we agree on that, but I know of at least 3 cases of very close people that have suffered the issue in the last 3 years alone. For curiosity's sake, were the affected people owners of multiple properties or was this issue considering their primary residential homes that they were actively living in?
- taopai 2y ago
  I know no one who had his first home or summer house squatted. No one. I've lived here all my life. I know at least 15 okupas who lived +4 years in properties of banks, unused and not finished, which, after eviction, are still unused and unmaintained. What harm did this okupas do? They didn't contributed to rent inflation, so they did some good. Having property unused and don't having an eye on it is madness. I wouldn't do it. That's common sense. People think that money buy things. Ok, buy a Ferrari and park it outside of a big city and leave it there during a month. This law is here to protect the right of housing. Some mafias use it? Could be, but this law works to protect real families and the benefits are much greater than the harm that opportunists do abusing it, this organizations doesn't have anything to do with the okupa movement.

zrn900 2y ago

Yep. Those policies that force the real estate owners to use their properties instead of letting them sit empty and appreciate for profit like in the US are ridiculous. The not-ridiculous policy is allowing them to cripple the entire society for profit by doing the opposite. It works very well. https://www.cbsnews.com/news/homes-for-sale-affordable-housing-prices/ https://www.cbsnews.com/news/homes-for-sale-affordable-housi...

nerdawson 2y ago
Perhaps that's the intent of the policy. The actual outcome on the other hand harms people who are using their properties. - Holidays lets - Standard lets where there's a changeover - Properties for sale - Your own home when you're on holiday Your comment is completely disconnected from the reality of the situation facing ordinary middle-class people. Maybe you could argue that squatters need support but subsidising them is the role of the state, not a job for individual citizens.
- zrn900 2y ago
  > The actual outcome The actual outcome is that the policy does force people to use their houses and increase the available rental houses. > ordinary middle-class people. You seem to have meant 'working-class'. Outside the US nobody calls them 'middle class'. Middle class people in Spain would be white collar professionals who own more than one house. You people are literally making up things about a country that you don't know about. No. It does not cause issues for the 'working class'. Okupas don't target single home owner working class people. They target at least white collar professionals, and actually much richer aristocrats and investment funds. > subsidising them is the role of the state, not a job for individual citizens. That's what you think. Your culture thinks. This is a different society. They think differently.
  - nerdawson 2y ago
    > You people are literally making up things about a country that you don't know about. I’m not from the US. I spent 2 years living in Spain. Are you claiming that the average Spanish citizen believes that a typical person should be responsible for freeloaders rather than the government?