3 ms·

I know, but why make a Direct3D wrapper on Vulkan when in the end you are going to run only Direct3D games anyway.

babypuncher 2y ago
Because DXVK already exists, and you do still want to run Vulkan anyways. There are AAA games out there using it instead of Direct3D. Natively re-implementing Direct3D APIs would be a tremendous amount of work for little or no real benefit.
kbolino 2y ago
Direct3D means only Windows and Xbox. Vulkan means everything non-Apple except Xbox and PlayStation. It's not everything, but it's a larger base.
- galad87 2y ago
  What's larger than Windows + Xbox + Playstation for AAA games?
  - deleted 2y ago
    [deleted]
  - kbolino 2y ago
    No single 3D API is capable of supporting all 3 of those platforms. However, if those are the only 3 you're concerned with, then Direct3D gets you farther (Windows+Xbox) than Vulkan (Windows only). You're still going to have to write/use something different for PlayStation (which has its own custom API). The two major platforms that favor Vulkan are Android and Switch, but the former is in the "mobile" category rather than the "desktop/console" category and few games overlap both categories. But really, Asahi Linux on M1 Mac is about as niche as you can get, so broad hardware support for native APIs isn't really relevant, and I don't think AAA games are necessarily what's meant to be supported either, since they generally won't work for other reasons (can't install x86-64 Windows kernel driver DRM/anticheat on an ARM Linux machine).
    - rowanG077 2y ago
      AAA gaming is THE driving factor for getting Vulkan on Asahi. There really are only a tiny subset of games that require a kernel anti cheat. Let alone the wealth of single player games.
      - kbolino 2y ago
        I'd love to hear about all these DRM-free single-player AAA games. If you're talking about older games, then maybe we're just talking past each other; I assumed we were talking about recent AAA games.
        rowanG077 2y ago
        They don't have to be DRM-free.Here you can play all of these on linux: https://www.protondb.com/explore https://www.protondb.com/explore Highlights include Elden Ring, Baldurs Gate 3 and God of War.
        kbolino 2y ago
        I upvoted for the link, which is useful to me, but I'm not sure this means Steam and all of those games will be able to run on Asahi/M1.
        rowanG077 2y ago
        No one can look into the future. But Fex + Vulkan definitely have the goal of being able to run those games.
        deleted 2y ago
        [deleted]
        babypuncher 2y ago
        Recent AAA games absolutely run on Linux using Proton. DRM isn't really a concern. The biggest and most successful DRM vendor, Denuvo, even goes out of their way to make sure their product does not interfere with Proton compatibility. It's pretty rare for a new game to come out and not be playable on the Steam Deck within a week if not on day 1. And when that does happen, it's usually a PvP multiplayer game with kernel-level anticheat.

Because DXVK already exists, and you do still want to run Vulkan anyways. There are AAA games out there using it instead of Direct3D. Natively re-implementing Direct3D APIs would be a tremendous amount of work for little or no real benefit.

kbolino 2y ago

Direct3D means only Windows and Xbox. Vulkan means everything non-Apple except Xbox and PlayStation. It's not everything, but it's a larger base.

galad87 2y ago
What's larger than Windows + Xbox + Playstation for AAA games?
- deleted 2y ago
  [deleted]
- kbolino 2y ago
  No single 3D API is capable of supporting all 3 of those platforms. However, if those are the only 3 you're concerned with, then Direct3D gets you farther (Windows+Xbox) than Vulkan (Windows only). You're still going to have to write/use something different for PlayStation (which has its own custom API). The two major platforms that favor Vulkan are Android and Switch, but the former is in the "mobile" category rather than the "desktop/console" category and few games overlap both categories. But really, Asahi Linux on M1 Mac is about as niche as you can get, so broad hardware support for native APIs isn't really relevant, and I don't think AAA games are necessarily what's meant to be supported either, since they generally won't work for other reasons (can't install x86-64 Windows kernel driver DRM/anticheat on an ARM Linux machine).
  - rowanG077 2y ago
    AAA gaming is THE driving factor for getting Vulkan on Asahi. There really are only a tiny subset of games that require a kernel anti cheat. Let alone the wealth of single player games.
    - kbolino 2y ago
      I'd love to hear about all these DRM-free single-player AAA games. If you're talking about older games, then maybe we're just talking past each other; I assumed we were talking about recent AAA games.
      - rowanG077 2y ago
        They don't have to be DRM-free.Here you can play all of these on linux: https://www.protondb.com/explore https://www.protondb.com/explore Highlights include Elden Ring, Baldurs Gate 3 and God of War.
        kbolino 2y ago
        I upvoted for the link, which is useful to me, but I'm not sure this means Steam and all of those games will be able to run on Asahi/M1.
        rowanG077 2y ago
        No one can look into the future. But Fex + Vulkan definitely have the goal of being able to run those games.
      - deleted 2y ago
        [deleted]
      - babypuncher 2y ago
        Recent AAA games absolutely run on Linux using Proton. DRM isn't really a concern. The biggest and most successful DRM vendor, Denuvo, even goes out of their way to make sure their product does not interfere with Proton compatibility. It's pretty rare for a new game to come out and not be playable on the Steam Deck within a week if not on day 1. And when that does happen, it's usually a PvP multiplayer game with kernel-level anticheat.