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Microsoft has gone radio silent on Windows Recall
- ramesh31 2y agoI'm no fanboy, but I will literally never touch Windows again with a ten foot pole as long as I live if this feature goes through as planned.
- fossr 2y agoWe've made an open source alternative OpenRecall to address some of the concerns https://github.com/openrecall/openrecall https://github.com/openrecall/openrecall We want to make it fully auditable, privacy focused and aim to have a better security model. Everything runs and is stored locally and only analyzed using open source models.
- hesdeadjim 2y agoNot sure how this addresses some of the real concerns behind Recall, an example being if my password manager is open and showing data I don't want saved anywhere else.
- joshstrange 2y agoOn macOS (I assume a similar feature is on Windows) I believe an app/window can specify that it has secrets or is "private". I think is this what rewind.ai uses to skip capture, or maybe it's that the screen capture API's in macOS already filter out those private windows.
- fossr 2y agoYeah you're right. We have it on our roadmap to allow the user to blacklist apps. A default list of apps will be included such as password manager.
- hesdeadjim 2y agoIf you care about privacy and security it should be a whitelist, not blacklist.
- TiredOfLife 2y agoYou can exclude arbitrary apps. https://support.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/retrace-your-steps-with-recall-aa03f8a0-a78b-4b3e-b0a1-2eb8ac48701c#:~:text=To%20exclude%20an%20app https://support.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/retrace-your-ste...: Of course reading documentation or investigating is not necessary for writing clickbait.
- deleted 2y ago[deleted]
- wrs 2y agoRecall has local storage too, and lack of auditing or open source models are not the primary complaints. It’s the existence of this data store at all. If you can find a way to let the user see it without letting Infostealer (or the user’s boss, or the user’s abusive spouse) see it, you’re getting somewhere. Recall is kind of the same expectation violation as when Snapchat users figured out you could take screenshots.
- giancarlostoro 2y agoNice, I might check this out since it works on Linux and is coded in Python. Honestly, if Microsoft came out tomorrow and just said "Look, here's the source code to Recall, we will not diverge it from this codebase in any way, and you should be able to create builds that match what's on your machine" that would be fine. Microsoft, STOP FORCING GARBAGE MARKETING AND NEW FEATURES ON USERS. You have a high quality product you're trashing up. I've sworn off Windows since Windows 10/11. I am a daily Linux user thanks to all the nonsense. The only time you see me on Windows is my employer pays for it, but given a choice, I'd just ask for a Mac or Linux device instead. I'm done. When you make an OS that's just that, an OS. Come talk to me. I would gladly pay money out of my own pocket for "Windows Core OS" and its just stripped down, and NEVER forces to advertise Office, or OneDrive, or Cortana or any of the things we never asked for.
- binkHN 2y ago> I am a daily Linux user thanks to all the nonsense. Microsoft's misbehavior is a blessing in disguise.
- giancarlostoro 2y agoBeen a Linux user on and off, but mainly used Windows for gaming. Linux has gotten good enough, especially Ubuntu and POP OS, its just a breeze to use.
- jareklupinski 2y ago> I would gladly pay money out of my own pocket for "Windows Core OS" and its just stripped down, and NEVER forces to advertise Office, or OneDrive, or Cortana or any of the things we never asked for. i'm only going from win10 LTSC to either a similar version of 11, or debian for me it was the purposely depressing news articles just showing up all over the start menu :(
- nerdjon 2y agoWindows 10 LTSC really is amazing and I am anxiously (and slightly nervously that Microsoft is going to screw it up somehow) waiting for 11 LTSC. Particularly for gaming, takes care of all the compatibility problems with none of the crap thrown in. Even performs better as a bonus.
- jzemeocala 2y agoFormer Windows user and long time Linux user here. I just wanted to take this moment to say: Hahahahahahaha
- gscott 2y agoThey have given up on having a real operating system.... the OS is an extension of marketing.
- nerdjon 2y agoI kinda hate the need for a quick response, especially when the feature isn’t officially available yet. 2 days is “radio silent” is a bit much. They may just need time. If this was live and running on a bunch of systems, sure. But let’s not jump to additional clickbait for no reason. Criticize the feature. Call out its problems. Keep reporting on that. But let’s be realistic about communication.
- dudus 2y agoThey brought this to themselves when they set the launch date to June 18th for this monstrosity.
- nerdjon 2y agoI disagree, the fact is that is not today. It isn't tomorrow, it isn't this week, or even next week. This is a feature that is still in preview. I fully agree that the feature is poorly conceived and we need a response. But "radio silent" is severe over-exaggeration for a feature that the general population does not have access too. If we don't get a response by mid next week, even a simple "we are delaying the release and will have more information soon", than I would agree. But this is not an actively exploited thing running on un-expecting users.
- ksec 2y agoUnfortunately we live in a world where no response by email, SMS or WhatsApp within a few hours is called radio silent. And let's not forget, had this been Apple media would have been very different towards it.
- nerdjon 2y agoI still wouldn't use the term radio silent, but the expectation of a response has to be tied to the urgency of the problem. Given this is pre-release, the urgency of the problem is basically non-existent at this point in time, except for the media that really wants to capitalize on this news. As we get closer to release, sure it becomes more urgent. That doesn't mean it isn't important.
- chirau 2y agoWhy should they respond to anyone and everyone regarding a feature that is not even on final build and has not been made officially available?
- JohnFen 2y agoFor the same reason that they announced a feature that isn't officially available? They opened the conversation.
- anthk 2y agoRecoll > Recall.
- hbn 2y agoI'm not one to defend Microsoft or Windows but I'm not really surprised they couldn't get the necessary info gathered (gathering engineering details, security inspection, possibly discussing changes to internal plans or engineering details, figuring out which parts they're ready to be public about, translated across departments to the PR team who then has to translate the details into a PR statement, more cross-checking to make sure nothing inaccurate is said, etc) before the articles were published. I wouldn't really call it "radio silence," that's just the speed something like this moves at. And it's not regarding a feature already live or anything so... it's fine if they take their time?
- x0x0 2y ago> it's fine if they take their time? Sure feels like a symptom of them not thinking through the trivially obvious and enormous security problems they created. Competent people would have thought through things like eg wow, it would be super, super bad if someone exfiltrated this before announcing features.
- Hikikomori 2y agoThey should have put the recall database in Azure so it's secure.
- nicce 2y agoWould it be secure? The machine still needs some API key to utilize it so that user can get the most of it. That key must be in machine in order that database could be accessed. Whoever exploits that machine, is still able to get the same data as the user of that machine.
- wmf 2y agoIt's a joke. Azure is the least secure cloud.
- jrhey 2y agoWill it affect gaming performance? I’m assuming it won’t be possible to disable Recall?
- JohnFen 2y agoMicrosoft's plan is to make it opt-out, so you should be able to disable it. And you can avoid it entirely by not using an NPU-equipped machine. Opt-out is a terrible idea for this sort of thing -- something as intrusive and dangerous as this should absolutely be opt-in -- but at least they're planning on giving that much.
- wmf 2y agoIt is possible to disable it. The point of the NPU is to not disrupt the CPU/GPU but we'll see.
- HideousKojima 2y agoIt will be possible, but enabled by default. And given how a lot of other features in Windows 10 and 11 have magically re-enabled themselves after updates it's likely the same will happen with this.
- xacky 2y agoThe revelations of the security problems with recall finally made me go all Linux. Whatever problems you can think of with Linux it pales in comparison with having CCTV in your OS.
- jmkni 2y agoWindows Recall feels like having £100million worth of gold in your roofspace and telling everybody about it. Sooner or later, somebody is going to figure out how to steal it. Also, it just struck me, it used to be normal to install anti-virus on Windows, because it didn't have it's own one. Anti-virus would find software like this (spyware) and block it from running. Then, Microsoft introduced their own, built in, anti-virus, and it was really good, so we basically stopped installing our own. Now they have added literal spyware right into their OS, that their anti-virus will be totally cool with. I've always liked and defended MS, but I dunno anymore...
- LordKeren 2y agoI mean, when you get down to it, if you do not trust the maker of your OS, you’re kind of already in a really bad spot. If you don’t trust Microsoft/Windows, you need to not be using it. I’m not sure this feature changes any real facts about this, only the optics
- Kye 2y agoWindows is an amalgam of interests and capabilities within Microsoft. I trust different parts different ways because different motivations drive them. I think it's reasonable to assume this is well-intentioned but not trust that they've given enough thought to the threat models surrounding it. It's also reasonable to assume the AV team will add an exception to it with all the best intentions. No malice or evil is needed, just good but misguided intentions.
- deleted 2y ago[deleted]
- lenerdenator 2y agoThat had better be something that I have to opt-in on. If it's not, I'm done with Windows after 10's mainline support gives up the ghost in 2025. I only use it for ham radio stuff at this point, and Mac/Linux gaming is now officially Good Enough™.
- 29athrowaway 2y agoNow they appreciate privacy it seems. But their own, not their customers'.
- Fire-Dragon-DoL 2y agoRecall Windows Recall?