3 ms·

Just wondering, in light of the downsides including this, are there benefits to these devices, like apple TV, fire tv, etc. over a mini pc, like a beelink s12 p

by dfxm12 2y ago

Just wondering, in light of the downsides including this, are there benefits to these devices, like apple TV, fire tv, etc. over a mini pc, like a beelink s12 pro? I understand that most consumers aren't aware of the alternatives or think they might be more convenient, but I'm looking to get personal perspectives from "hackers".

yjftsjthsd-h 2y ago
Are they not actually more convenient, or at least easier, especially from the couch? If I buy one of these appliances, I can buy it, plug it into power and the TV, sit on the couch with a remote, and watch TV. If I start with a PC, I can just watch stuff in a browser, but it needs a mouse+keyboard by default.
- dfxm12 2y ago
  Apps arbitrarily getting "killed off" is not my idea of convenient. Using a mini keyboard (on my couch) is not my idea of inconvenient. Does it really matter if you're watching in a browser vs an app?
  - yjftsjthsd-h 2y ago
    > Apps arbitrarily getting "killed off" is not my idea of convenient. For a TV, I don't see the problem with background apps dying. > Using a mini keyboard (on my couch) is not my idea of inconvenient. Okay, then that's a significant difference in our perspectives. If you don't mind needing a mouse/keyboard then I agree that the PC is a winner. > Does it really matter if you're watching in a browser vs an app? No, browser can be fine, but I think it's harder to control in practice.
    - dfxm12 2y ago
      For a TV, I don't see the problem with background apps dying. What does this mean? I wouldn't describe a streaming service, like Netflix, as a "background app" in the context of a HTPC/set top box. It's almost always a problem when devices, especially mono-purpose devices, slowly become bricks. No, browser can be fine, but I think it's harder to control in practice. Can you elaborate on this, too? If I don't like my browser anymore, I can switch browsers. Every browser I'm aware of has plug ins and and settings that give me control and the ability to extend functionality and to some extent, turn off some things I don't want. With apps, you're at the mercy of their developer. If the app sucks (or, again, gets killed off), you can do nothing but deal with it. I don't see what control one has there...
      - yjftsjthsd-h 2y ago
        > What does this mean? I wouldn't describe a streaming service, like Netflix, as a "background app" in the context of a HTPC/set top box. It's almost always a problem when devices, especially mono-purpose devices, slowly become bricks. Oh, I thought you were talking about the OS killing background apps because these boxes don't have enough RAM. If you mean that it's a problem that services declare the system EOL and stop giving you access from it, then yes we agree. > Can you elaborate on this, too? If I don't like my browser anymore, I can switch browsers. Every browser I'm aware of has plug ins and and settings that give me control and the ability to extend functionality and to some extent, turn off some things I don't want. With apps, you're at the mercy of their developer. If the app sucks (or, again, gets killed off), you can do nothing but deal with it. I don't see what control one has there... Similarly talking past each other; I meant in a UX way. Yes, a browser is more flexible and gives you far more control, but native TV apps reliably work with nothing more than the buttons on a TV remote, which I don't trust web apps to do.
  - musicale 2y ago
    > Apps arbitrarily getting "killed off" is not my idea of convenient It's a common problem with devices that depend on cloud services, unfortunately. But not a bad run for a $99 device from 2012. And AirPlay still works, so you can stream from your phone, etc.
dagmx 2y ago
There’s several benefits for an Apple TV to me: 1. Has the vast majority of streaming services first. Many streamers deprioritize web and other platforms. 2. Really solid accessibility options that aren’t available on other platforms. I use these quite frequently. 3. I am in a few film guilds and the screeners apps until recently required an iOS or tvOS device, or a clunky website. The tvOS experience for voting screeners is significantly better. 4. Lag. Pretty much every other streaming box has lag when navigating a UI. The Apple TV isn’t perfect but it’s night and day for me. 5. HomeKit + Thread makes for it being a decent (but not great) smart home management system And I know you’re dismissing convenience, but it’s a huge factor too. TV time is about no-fuss and unwinding. With the Apple TV, I can use my phone for text entry and password management. I can use it to synchronize playback with friends and family. Those are all possible on other devices, but convenience is a massive factor.
- dfxm12 2y ago
  Many streamers deprioritize web and other platforms... Really solid accessibility options that aren’t available on other platforms. Which streamers/accessibility features are you referring to? I'd be very surprised to learn that streaming services like Netflix deprioritize the web experience & I can't find any reference to this online. TV time is about no-fuss and unwinding. I'm really trying to understand this sentiment. What do you find so fussy about the experience of desktop apps or web sites compared to apple tv/other set top box apps? I don't have much experience with different set top boxes. I just know I'd be pretty wound up if my set top box killed off my favorite app... I can use it to synchronize playback with friends and family. Are your friends and family required to have apple devices & the media for this or does it let you set up a server and you can stream it to anyone, regardless of device (kinda like cytube)?
  - dagmx 2y ago
    HBO Max for example had a very platform limited rollout at launch. It was only on certain devices. And of course all browser players depend on adequate DRM (which not all browsers/platforms provide) and often restrict functionality like Atmos etc. In terms of no-fuss, it’s not just about navigating to the site. It’s about having a consistent interaction paradigm (how are you triggering those tiny web based buttons from your couch?) , how are you handling CEC inputs, separable volumes, text input and voice input etc… there’s a lot of things that people take for granted that make for a more laid back experience. Regarding synchronized playback, it depends on the streamer. But with SharePlay, yes they need to be on Apple devices but any app can support it. Obviously the ubiquity will differ in different households, but my wife and I are both Apple users. We can watch stuff together when we’re on business trips with a button press. When she pauses or I scrub the timeline, it stays in sync. There’s something truly fantastic about that level of telepresence.

by dfxm12 2y ago

yjftsjthsd-h 2y ago

Are they not actually more convenient, or at least easier, especially from the couch? If I buy one of these appliances, I can buy it, plug it into power and the TV, sit on the couch with a remote, and watch TV. If I start with a PC, I can just watch stuff in a browser, but it needs a mouse+keyboard by default.

dfxm12 2y ago
Apps arbitrarily getting "killed off" is not my idea of convenient. Using a mini keyboard (on my couch) is not my idea of inconvenient. Does it really matter if you're watching in a browser vs an app?
- yjftsjthsd-h 2y ago
  > Apps arbitrarily getting "killed off" is not my idea of convenient. For a TV, I don't see the problem with background apps dying. > Using a mini keyboard (on my couch) is not my idea of inconvenient. Okay, then that's a significant difference in our perspectives. If you don't mind needing a mouse/keyboard then I agree that the PC is a winner. > Does it really matter if you're watching in a browser vs an app? No, browser can be fine, but I think it's harder to control in practice.
  - dfxm12 2y ago
    For a TV, I don't see the problem with background apps dying. What does this mean? I wouldn't describe a streaming service, like Netflix, as a "background app" in the context of a HTPC/set top box. It's almost always a problem when devices, especially mono-purpose devices, slowly become bricks. No, browser can be fine, but I think it's harder to control in practice. Can you elaborate on this, too? If I don't like my browser anymore, I can switch browsers. Every browser I'm aware of has plug ins and and settings that give me control and the ability to extend functionality and to some extent, turn off some things I don't want. With apps, you're at the mercy of their developer. If the app sucks (or, again, gets killed off), you can do nothing but deal with it. I don't see what control one has there...
    - yjftsjthsd-h 2y ago
      > What does this mean? I wouldn't describe a streaming service, like Netflix, as a "background app" in the context of a HTPC/set top box. It's almost always a problem when devices, especially mono-purpose devices, slowly become bricks. Oh, I thought you were talking about the OS killing background apps because these boxes don't have enough RAM. If you mean that it's a problem that services declare the system EOL and stop giving you access from it, then yes we agree. > Can you elaborate on this, too? If I don't like my browser anymore, I can switch browsers. Every browser I'm aware of has plug ins and and settings that give me control and the ability to extend functionality and to some extent, turn off some things I don't want. With apps, you're at the mercy of their developer. If the app sucks (or, again, gets killed off), you can do nothing but deal with it. I don't see what control one has there... Similarly talking past each other; I meant in a UX way. Yes, a browser is more flexible and gives you far more control, but native TV apps reliably work with nothing more than the buttons on a TV remote, which I don't trust web apps to do.
- musicale 2y ago
  > Apps arbitrarily getting "killed off" is not my idea of convenient It's a common problem with devices that depend on cloud services, unfortunately. But not a bad run for a $99 device from 2012. And AirPlay still works, so you can stream from your phone, etc.

dagmx 2y ago

There’s several benefits for an Apple TV to me: 1. Has the vast majority of streaming services first. Many streamers deprioritize web and other platforms. 2. Really solid accessibility options that aren’t available on other platforms. I use these quite frequently. 3. I am in a few film guilds and the screeners apps until recently required an iOS or tvOS device, or a clunky website. The tvOS experience for voting screeners is significantly better. 4. Lag. Pretty much every other streaming box has lag when navigating a UI. The Apple TV isn’t perfect but it’s night and day for me. 5. HomeKit + Thread makes for it being a decent (but not great) smart home management system And I know you’re dismissing convenience, but it’s a huge factor too. TV time is about no-fuss and unwinding. With the Apple TV, I can use my phone for text entry and password management. I can use it to synchronize playback with friends and family. Those are all possible on other devices, but convenience is a massive factor.

dfxm12 2y ago
Many streamers deprioritize web and other platforms... Really solid accessibility options that aren’t available on other platforms. Which streamers/accessibility features are you referring to? I'd be very surprised to learn that streaming services like Netflix deprioritize the web experience & I can't find any reference to this online. TV time is about no-fuss and unwinding. I'm really trying to understand this sentiment. What do you find so fussy about the experience of desktop apps or web sites compared to apple tv/other set top box apps? I don't have much experience with different set top boxes. I just know I'd be pretty wound up if my set top box killed off my favorite app... I can use it to synchronize playback with friends and family. Are your friends and family required to have apple devices & the media for this or does it let you set up a server and you can stream it to anyone, regardless of device (kinda like cytube)?
- dagmx 2y ago
  HBO Max for example had a very platform limited rollout at launch. It was only on certain devices. And of course all browser players depend on adequate DRM (which not all browsers/platforms provide) and often restrict functionality like Atmos etc. In terms of no-fuss, it’s not just about navigating to the site. It’s about having a consistent interaction paradigm (how are you triggering those tiny web based buttons from your couch?) , how are you handling CEC inputs, separable volumes, text input and voice input etc… there’s a lot of things that people take for granted that make for a more laid back experience. Regarding synchronized playback, it depends on the streamer. But with SharePlay, yes they need to be on Apple devices but any app can support it. Obviously the ubiquity will differ in different households, but my wife and I are both Apple users. We can watch stuff together when we’re on business trips with a button press. When she pauses or I scrub the timeline, it stays in sync. There’s something truly fantastic about that level of telepresence.