6 ms·

I wonder if this is due to a fundamental shift in who commutes to work? High paid, "white collar" work is shifting to a remote/hybrid structure, or are paid en

I wonder if this is due to a fundamental shift in who commutes to work? High paid, "white collar" work is shifting to a remote/hybrid structure, or are paid enough that they can move to reduce commute. However, lower paid, service-oriented jobs require physical presence in the workplace. The increasing affordability gap for housing means these people have to live further and further away from their workplace.

aaomidi 2y ago
Which would be a problem solved by allowing more remote work, and even giving tax incentives for not living near offices. Our society had a huge opportunity to make a huge dent in vehicle usage too without waiting for public transit to catch up. We messed it up because commercial RE.
- ipython 2y ago
  How does that support a janitor? or a school teacher? or a policeman? or a retail clerk... I can go on and on... there are too many jobs where there is no possibility for "remote work" yet may not pay well enough for you to live close to the office/place of employment
  - oblio 2y ago
    It does help them indirectly. Less traffic, can even help public transport where buses don't have dedicated bus lanes.
  - aaomidi 2y ago
    It reduces both commercial RE demand in cities and less focus on everyone living inside the city. I’m living in rural NY thanks to remote work. The US is spread wide and I don’t think emulating Europe will work in the case of US.
dgfitz 2y ago
> ... or are paid enough that they can move to reduce commute My spouse and I make about 300-350k combined. Our mortgage is $1350/month. We're not moving. I don't think the quoted sentence is true anymore. Maybe a few years ago, and before covid, not anymore. People aren't moving.
- ipython 2y ago
  the difference is that you could move... I don't blame you for staying put- I would do the same in your situation! I use this phrase a lot of times: "money buys options" (not the securities kind)
- eru 2y ago
  If only you could sell your mortgage!
ryukoposting 2y ago
That's a distinct possibility, but the wealthy folks you're talking about also had the good sense and economic mobility to move when interest rates were at historic lows, and they aren't likely to be interested in giving up that rate right now. The effect you described is most certainly real, there's just other pressures to consider.
- r00fus 2y ago
  I think the atrocious housing marking is definitely to blame here. I would love to move closer to work but I'm not giving up my 2% 15y fixed and the housing market is such that I don't feel comfortable financing a 2nd purchase (and rent out the original). So we stay, I do hybrid/flex and only come in about half the time.
- ipython 2y ago
  Right, and those folks you mention are working remote so there is no commute for them. On the other hand, the rent continues to increase for lower income workers who must continue to commute to work.
giantg2 2y ago
Most of the people I know moved farther away from their job to have more property or a larger home. Or they moved from a more populated region to a less populated region, which in general also means longer distances.

aaomidi 2y ago

Which would be a problem solved by allowing more remote work, and even giving tax incentives for not living near offices. Our society had a huge opportunity to make a huge dent in vehicle usage too without waiting for public transit to catch up. We messed it up because commercial RE.

ipython 2y ago
How does that support a janitor? or a school teacher? or a policeman? or a retail clerk... I can go on and on... there are too many jobs where there is no possibility for "remote work" yet may not pay well enough for you to live close to the office/place of employment
- oblio 2y ago
  It does help them indirectly. Less traffic, can even help public transport where buses don't have dedicated bus lanes.
- aaomidi 2y ago
  It reduces both commercial RE demand in cities and less focus on everyone living inside the city. I’m living in rural NY thanks to remote work. The US is spread wide and I don’t think emulating Europe will work in the case of US.

dgfitz 2y ago

> ... or are paid enough that they can move to reduce commute My spouse and I make about 300-350k combined. Our mortgage is $1350/month. We're not moving. I don't think the quoted sentence is true anymore. Maybe a few years ago, and before covid, not anymore. People aren't moving.

ipython 2y ago
the difference is that you could move... I don't blame you for staying put- I would do the same in your situation! I use this phrase a lot of times: "money buys options" (not the securities kind)
eru 2y ago
If only you could sell your mortgage!

ryukoposting 2y ago

That's a distinct possibility, but the wealthy folks you're talking about also had the good sense and economic mobility to move when interest rates were at historic lows, and they aren't likely to be interested in giving up that rate right now. The effect you described is most certainly real, there's just other pressures to consider.

r00fus 2y ago
I think the atrocious housing marking is definitely to blame here. I would love to move closer to work but I'm not giving up my 2% 15y fixed and the housing market is such that I don't feel comfortable financing a 2nd purchase (and rent out the original). So we stay, I do hybrid/flex and only come in about half the time.
ipython 2y ago
Right, and those folks you mention are working remote so there is no commute for them. On the other hand, the rent continues to increase for lower income workers who must continue to commute to work.

giantg2 2y ago

Most of the people I know moved farther away from their job to have more property or a larger home. Or they moved from a more populated region to a less populated region, which in general also means longer distances.