8 ms·

Barack Obama Directs All Federal Agencies to Have an API

298 points by mcrider 14y ago

gregors 14y ago
It'll be interesting if they decide to use NIEM (National Information Exchange Model) as a way to transfer information to the public as well. https://www.niem.gov/Pages/default.aspx https://www.niem.gov/Pages/default.aspx
bmelton 14y ago
This will likely go down the same way the original IPV6 mandate went down, before it was postponed, and before it likely will be postponed again when nobody's met the mandate. The issue is far more complicated than the comments I see in here are giving credit for. Don't get me wrong, there's going to be delay as the PHBs get themselves wrapped around what an API even is, but they'll have the directive routed to their CIOs before that, and they will understand the requirement, and how impossible it is. The biggest issue is that the data isn't really owned by the government entities. I mean, the data is theirs, but it's locked up in their vendor provided tools, and/or their custom, built-by-vendor products. If they're using Oracle AquaLogic (or whatever it is now) to host the majority of their portal content, they're dependent on Oracle to either come in and show them how to implement the feature (which is a significant service dollar cost) or they're going to have to wait until Oracle builds the ability for API exposure into the product if it doesn't exist yet. If they've got custom-built portals, they'll need to consult with the vendors who wrote them or maintain them now and get them to add that in. That means that they'll have to modify the contract originally bid for the project, which is going to eat up a couple months of the timeline alone. Then they'll have to figure out what sort of things actually make it into the API, how to segment sensitive data reliably, get it through ISSO testing, etc. It's almost impossible for a project of any significance. On top of that, they'll have to do it with a budget they don't have, and with resources allocated elsewhere. The only way the government really gets anything done is by committing large amounts of resources to it in an uninterrupted fashion. They don't have the capacity to be agile, and to some extent, that's by design.
- intended 14y ago
  Its going to be a pretty huge undertaking. I assume that this will lead to some discussion on API standards, as multiple agencies simultaneously realize the implications.
wickedchicken 14y ago
from dod import air_force air_force.launch({"f22": 3, "b2": 4})
- mrpollo 14y ago
  hope we can apply for H-1B similarly real soon
grandalf 14y ago
As is obvious to most on HN, requiring an API (as opposed to a CSV file release schedule, etc.) is fairly meaningless, and most definitely not a presidential-caliber dictate. Some agencies' data might be far better suited to publication in a CSV and posted on a web page, for example. If a president could have a meaningful impact on this sort of thing, it would be in setting a high bar for the quality of information released by agencies. Any sort of requirement of this kind is completely absent from the announcement. So rather than being about transparency as it's being touted, the announcement is a celebration of high tech obfuscation. Soon the same sort of insulting, opaque, useless information spouted by officials in press conferences will be available via HTTP. This is at best a neutral day for democracy.
- sherwin 14y ago
  I disagree. Certainly some agencies may have data that ought to be examined holistically via CSV (at least for researchers?), but having data available via API is better than the status quo. While this might not set a "high bar for the quality of information," the President's effort shows a level of commitment to both technological streamlining of government agencies and to transparency and is, at the very least, a step in the right direction.
- mattdeboard 14y ago
  Seems like the executive mandate is an "80% now" solution instead of waiting for perfection. At least they're thinking about the dissemination of information.
  - chernevik 14y ago
    Seems like, if the President were interested in "now", they would have been working on this for going on 3.5 years, and would be actually publishing some APIs.
    - chc 14y ago
      I'm going to my apartment now. 3.5 years ago I would not have been going there. Now and 3.5 years ago are not the same thing. He's interested in doing things now, and since neither he nor I can turn back the clock, that's as good as either of us can do.
cjoh 14y ago
Wish they'd done some reasonable amount of procurement reform before this. All this means is another big payday for gov contractors
- isamuel 14y ago
  The two issues are completely orthogonal.
  - cjoh 14y ago
    Actually, no, they're not. They're tied at the waist. Governments antiquated technology acquisition schedules mean that govt cannot tie itself to Moore's law. Because currently government buys from an exclusive system rather than an inclusive one, it means the tech they do end up getting, often 18 months late, isn't very good, and is very hard to upgrade. Thus a mandate that "all agencies should do x" with tech, before reforms in the acquisition arena create severe problems down the road, and only really benefit the contractors who make them. By the time these Apis really see the light of day, we will be complaining about them.
  - astrofinch 14y ago
    I disagree. If your to-do list consists of "learn to touch type properly" and "write a better compiler for C++", you'll find some ways of prioritizing your to-do list more conducive to accomplishing your goals than others.
gresrun 14y ago
I'd be interested in the NSA's API...
- drivebyacct2 14y ago
  Exposes a single REST endpoint. POST /UploadAllUserData. Meh, they're evil, it's probably SOAP and you have to discover it. edit: Sorry guys! Didn't realize a tongue-in-cheek comment about the NSA have an API was so super-serious! It's like Oprah in here giving out downvotes anymore. "It's a free downvotes for you and you and you."
- Radzell 14y ago
  Lol it made me laugh as soon as I heard how broad the statement was. I wonder if the CIA api will have a geolocation features so I can make a foursquare mashup were people flash mob secret agents.
- ConstantineXVI 14y ago
  Just a new HTTP code for the other services to implement: 312 Pay No Attention To The Proxy
Treisfeo 14y ago
It's called a Web Service noobs!
- Radzell 14y ago
  Yeh if you work for microsoft get with the times everyone calls them apis now. Things get new meaning words change welcome to the english language.
- solnyshok 14y ago
  API is much better than nothing. I say, begin with API, then require any API to have a basic "raw_data_dump (start date, end date)". And yes, this isn't about transparency, but it is more about efficiency, and still can lead to transparency.
ColinWright 14y ago
http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=4055622 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=4055622
- mcrider 14y ago
  Weird, I searched for the URL and also thought HN would automatically detect a dupe. Didn't mean to hijack a post!
  - ColinWright 14y ago
    The URLs aren't identical, one has "index.php" at the end, the other doesn't: yada yada ... barak-obama-directs-all-federal-agencies-to-have-an-api/ yada yada ... barak-obama-directs-all-federal-agencies-to-have-an-api/index.php With regards searches, it depends on what you search for. HN_Search is not always obvious, and it doesn't index minute by minute. You may have done the search before the engine caught up.
jroseattle 14y ago
"...Within 90 days of the date of this memorandum, create a page on its website, located at www.[agency].gov/digitalstrategy, to publicly report progress in meeting the requirements of the Strategy in a machine-readable format.... ...implement the requirements of the Strategy within 12 months of the date of this memorandum and comply with the timeframes for specific actions specified therein" 3 months to get a "machine-readable" status report on implementing an API? Then, complete the implementation in 12 months? If it takes 3 months for an agency to get a status report up, how long will it take them to implement said API? Government work, sheesh....
- mrpollo 14y ago
  My best guess is that in the initial 3 months they wont be doing just the page, they will be outlining the efforts in order to comply in the next 12 months with the executive order, buy any hardware they must buy, and delegate any work to any branches they might need to
- kprobst 14y ago
  They'll simply report they haven't been able to implement the report, someone will get a slightly lower evaluation score and life.gov will go on as usual.
- dllthomas 14y ago
  They need to be sure they 1) are exposing everything they need to be exposing, 2) are hiding everything they need to be hiding, 3) are ready to handle potentially significant load, and 4) are robust against attack. Each of these is a little harder and/or a little more important in government than in a start-up (your start-up is probably less likely to get an informant killed because they posted the wrong thing than, say, DOJ), and 1 and 2 especially involve more than technical work - processes need to be set up to actually get the data where it needs to go in the first place. I'd love it if it could be faster, but I don't think 15 months is at all absurd.
  - jroseattle 14y ago
    Actually, that's just project management 101. The fact that it's government work doesn't make the steps to delivery any different than anywhere else, just the subject matter. Or, it shouldn't be any different -- though I know some claim otherwise.
Anirak 14y ago
Every government office could take a lesson in well designed interfaces. Imagine how much smoother the DMV would be if someone had actually made the process designed to be as simple of an "interface" as possible. I know I'm probably hoping for too much, but maybe designing these web APIs will teach them a thing or two about how they might improve the efficiency of their offices as a whole.
waffle_ss 14y ago
Meanwhile, just yesterday the House Committee on Appropriations voted to [indefinitely delay][1] making legislative data available in machine-readable (XML) format. It's a repeat of a move taken in 2008 to "make a plan to make a plan" that never really goes anywhere. In other words, it's not gonna happen for a long time yet. [1]: http://sunlightfoundation.com/blog/2012/06/01/bulk-access-developments-after-the-h-approps-hearing/ http://sunlightfoundation.com/blog/2012/06/01/bulk-access-de...
- lnguyen 14y ago
  Don't expect someone to do something that goes against their self-interest. Especially if they can do a song and dance and make people forget that nothing is getting done.
neuroelectronic 14y ago
"Please Hack us, Israel", offers USA.
pwg 14y ago
This seems quite relevant now: http://xkcd.com/927/ http://xkcd.com/927/ What will this bring? Well, the US govt has X agencies. The result of this decree will be that, within 12 months, all of the public will get to enjoy the thrills of having X incompatible web API's, one unique one per agency.
- pmb 14y ago
  Better than it is now, where none of that data is available except possibly through FOIA lawsuits.
  - jlarocco 14y ago
    That hasn't been true in my experience. What data are you looking for that isn't available? The only thing I can think of that's difficult to get is some law enforcement, military and "national security" related information, but APIs aren't going to change that. I don't have a ton of experience with it (mostly USGS and NOAA), but the Department of Commerce and the Department of Interior both make a ton of data available.
EricR23 14y ago
This reminds me of the push here in NYC for all of the city agencies to open their data via an API. It's gotten better over time, but when the initiative first took flight, it was terrible. Some of the APIs flat out did not work, and the ones that did often returned all sorts of malformed, non-normalized data. It was a nightmare to work with. I'm curious if the government can do better.
- josh5555 14y ago
  SPOILER ALERT No, the fed government can not do better. This announcement is just election year hype.
kjhughes 14y ago
I think this should be judged against the status quo as a positive development rather than against an abstract ideal as a flawed concept. Having seen too many clients stuck in analysis paralysis or blocked by political/turf issues while trying to develop corporate-wide standards (protocols, object models, etc), I'm just happy to see online access to public/government data advance in any way. If we had to wait for higher-level, coordinating standards first, progress might never come.
polemic 14y ago
I'm reminded of this recent post by James Fee, talking about geodata, but I think it applies to the general case: "... The question was APIs or downloads... Personally, I believe [data] is one of the best ways for citizens to keep track of their government (local to federal) ... APIs tend to deliver what their “owners” want them to do. Raw data means everyone has an opportunity to check each other’s work. Of course, raw data can be manipulated as well, but it is harder to obscure." - http://spatiallyadjusted.com/2012/04/03/sharing-data-downloads-are-the-key/ http://spatiallyadjusted.com/2012/04/03/sharing-data-downloa... I couldn't agree more. APIs are great, but are not the key to open government, for two reasons: 1. They don't provide simple and easy access for non technical individuals into raw information. APIs shouldn't exist for querying historical datasets if the dataset is not already available in a static format. Release the data, then build an API if there is demand (or the private sector doesn't do it, better, for you). 2. Historical data access is poorly served by APIs. There is no such thing as a good 'general use' API[1]. API's are appropriate for specific service based transactions that involve some level of processing. Examples: * VAT/GST number validation * Road closure notifications * Identity services 3. Bonus reason: government agencies suck at building APIs. They're not good at determining what is genuinely high value to end users, they tend to prefer visible projects that can justify budget increases, over genuinely useful, but less easily communicated ones (cf. the US national highway system and pork barrel politics), and there is an entire industry of enterprise companies heavily invested in keeping it this way. TL;DR Release the data, let users build the APIs. Everyone wins. Bootnotes: [1] I lie. That's exactly what publishing raw data at stable URLS on a website achieves.
- kjhughes 14y ago
  Hmm, not sure API vs data is productive to see as a dichotomy. Consider that an API might provide access to "raw" data directly. I'd ask not for data over APIs but for more universally useful properties such as stability, currency, consistency, etc.
  - polemic 14y ago
    > Hmm, not sure API vs data is productive to see as a dichotomy. It's not, necessarily. An API provides a [very] limited view into the data. A view selected by the publisher. That's part of the problem. > I'd ask not for data over APIs but for more universally useful properties such as stability, currency, consistency, etc. Amen. I'd add: clear license and usage conditions, simple and concise metadata, and frequent updates.
sidwyn 14y ago
The first thing that caught my eye was the misspelling of Barack in the address :)
imrehg 14y ago
Get ready for some hackathon! I'm sure there are a lot of useful and interesting ideas to build with whatever comes up.
deleted 14y ago
[deleted]
anaheim 14y ago
Bloomberg "learning to code", Obama directing agencies to have an API. All part of politicians (particularly Democrats) trying to look like they have a clue. Give up already for heavens sake and get back to managing the deficit.
jakejake 14y ago
It's hard to imagine some federal agencies being able to do much of anything within 90 days. But, I look forward to poking around with some of these APIs.
codeonfire 14y ago
This is kind of interesting because maybe it shows how far the thinking is from technology right now. I can't wait to integrate FBI files into my web app, and maybe I can bypass 'authorized e-file providers' to file my taxes. Maybe I can download daily spy satellite imagery. My point is that what is already meant to be available is probably already available. Decision makers are often excited about technology but don't really get the ground level experience. They want to do all the things...on a roadmap...with milestones. Mobile has to be involved in some way.
blubler 14y ago
Tyranny has an API...
domwood 14y ago
In rudimentary terms, I suppose at least it's a step in the right direction. It doesn't necessarily suggest the US government is going to immediately embrace openly disseminating its data, but it's still a step in the right direction. Third party services will most likely proliferate quite rapidly.
DanielBMarkham 14y ago
15 years ago I contracted with several large federal agencies. Back then, we were pushing for the same thing. It never flew. I imagine after 15 years they may have a chance at this, but I would caution those of you who have never worked in huge government IT shops to take this with a grain of salt. The situation is so bad in many places that Congress has been passing laws making it illegal for the federal systems not to behave in a certain way. And still things are broken. We passed the point of desperation many years ago. Big IT in general is broken, and government IT is the most dysfunctional of any IT on the planet. I remain hopeful that this executive order can accomplish something, but I'm not holding my breath on it. Hopeful is one thing. Excited like this guy is? Not at all. Maybe in another 15 years. Maybe.
moomin 14y ago
Has he been reading Steve Yegge's redacted post?
djKianoosh 14y ago
As a programmer/contractor for DHS, I'd love to hear what you all think would be a useful set of APIs for DHS to make public. It's all fine and dandy to say 'oh yeah we have an API' but it needs to be something useful. So what would you want to see? Financial/Budget type data? Performance metrics across the different Components within the Department? What?
- malyk 14y ago
  How about TSA budget, # of TSA employees, # of terror plots stopped, some ratios between those things, # of nail clippers confiscated per employee, etc. ;)
stcredzero 14y ago
In enterprises where departmental data has been opened up through APIs, like Wells Fargo and Amazon, there have been tremendous benefits. In the case of Amazon, this was achieved by CEO fiat, and strongly tied to employee evaluation. (To the point where employees in groups that failed to do so would have been evaluated right out of the company.) I wonder if POTUS has this kind of power over the federal bureaucracy. Also, I would wonder if this is to be done securely.
deleted 14y ago
[deleted]
CUR10US 14y ago
API's? C'mon. Bulk data. Agree with polemic.

298 points by mcrider 14y ago

It'll be interesting if they decide to use NIEM (National Information Exchange Model) as a way to transfer information to the public as well. https://www.niem.gov/Pages/default.aspx https://www.niem.gov/Pages/default.aspx

bmelton 14y ago

This will likely go down the same way the original IPV6 mandate went down, before it was postponed, and before it likely will be postponed again when nobody's met the mandate. The issue is far more complicated than the comments I see in here are giving credit for. Don't get me wrong, there's going to be delay as the PHBs get themselves wrapped around what an API even is, but they'll have the directive routed to their CIOs before that, and they will understand the requirement, and how impossible it is. The biggest issue is that the data isn't really owned by the government entities. I mean, the data is theirs, but it's locked up in their vendor provided tools, and/or their custom, built-by-vendor products. If they're using Oracle AquaLogic (or whatever it is now) to host the majority of their portal content, they're dependent on Oracle to either come in and show them how to implement the feature (which is a significant service dollar cost) or they're going to have to wait until Oracle builds the ability for API exposure into the product if it doesn't exist yet. If they've got custom-built portals, they'll need to consult with the vendors who wrote them or maintain them now and get them to add that in. That means that they'll have to modify the contract originally bid for the project, which is going to eat up a couple months of the timeline alone. Then they'll have to figure out what sort of things actually make it into the API, how to segment sensitive data reliably, get it through ISSO testing, etc. It's almost impossible for a project of any significance. On top of that, they'll have to do it with a budget they don't have, and with resources allocated elsewhere. The only way the government really gets anything done is by committing large amounts of resources to it in an uninterrupted fashion. They don't have the capacity to be agile, and to some extent, that's by design.

intended 14y ago
Its going to be a pretty huge undertaking. I assume that this will lead to some discussion on API standards, as multiple agencies simultaneously realize the implications.

wickedchicken 14y ago

from dod import air_force air_force.launch({"f22": 3, "b2": 4})

mrpollo 14y ago
hope we can apply for H-1B similarly real soon

grandalf 14y ago

As is obvious to most on HN, requiring an API (as opposed to a CSV file release schedule, etc.) is fairly meaningless, and most definitely not a presidential-caliber dictate. Some agencies' data might be far better suited to publication in a CSV and posted on a web page, for example. If a president could have a meaningful impact on this sort of thing, it would be in setting a high bar for the quality of information released by agencies. Any sort of requirement of this kind is completely absent from the announcement. So rather than being about transparency as it's being touted, the announcement is a celebration of high tech obfuscation. Soon the same sort of insulting, opaque, useless information spouted by officials in press conferences will be available via HTTP. This is at best a neutral day for democracy.

sherwin 14y ago
I disagree. Certainly some agencies may have data that ought to be examined holistically via CSV (at least for researchers?), but having data available via API is better than the status quo. While this might not set a "high bar for the quality of information," the President's effort shows a level of commitment to both technological streamlining of government agencies and to transparency and is, at the very least, a step in the right direction.
mattdeboard 14y ago
Seems like the executive mandate is an "80% now" solution instead of waiting for perfection. At least they're thinking about the dissemination of information.
- chernevik 14y ago
  Seems like, if the President were interested in "now", they would have been working on this for going on 3.5 years, and would be actually publishing some APIs.
  - chc 14y ago
    I'm going to my apartment now. 3.5 years ago I would not have been going there. Now and 3.5 years ago are not the same thing. He's interested in doing things now, and since neither he nor I can turn back the clock, that's as good as either of us can do.

cjoh 14y ago

Wish they'd done some reasonable amount of procurement reform before this. All this means is another big payday for gov contractors

isamuel 14y ago
The two issues are completely orthogonal.
- cjoh 14y ago
  Actually, no, they're not. They're tied at the waist. Governments antiquated technology acquisition schedules mean that govt cannot tie itself to Moore's law. Because currently government buys from an exclusive system rather than an inclusive one, it means the tech they do end up getting, often 18 months late, isn't very good, and is very hard to upgrade. Thus a mandate that "all agencies should do x" with tech, before reforms in the acquisition arena create severe problems down the road, and only really benefit the contractors who make them. By the time these Apis really see the light of day, we will be complaining about them.
- astrofinch 14y ago
  I disagree. If your to-do list consists of "learn to touch type properly" and "write a better compiler for C++", you'll find some ways of prioritizing your to-do list more conducive to accomplishing your goals than others.

gresrun 14y ago

I'd be interested in the NSA's API...

drivebyacct2 14y ago
Exposes a single REST endpoint. POST /UploadAllUserData. Meh, they're evil, it's probably SOAP and you have to discover it. edit: Sorry guys! Didn't realize a tongue-in-cheek comment about the NSA have an API was so super-serious! It's like Oprah in here giving out downvotes anymore. "It's a free downvotes for you and you and you."
Radzell 14y ago
Lol it made me laugh as soon as I heard how broad the statement was. I wonder if the CIA api will have a geolocation features so I can make a foursquare mashup were people flash mob secret agents.
ConstantineXVI 14y ago
Just a new HTTP code for the other services to implement: 312 Pay No Attention To The Proxy

Treisfeo 14y ago

It's called a Web Service noobs!

Radzell 14y ago
Yeh if you work for microsoft get with the times everyone calls them apis now. Things get new meaning words change welcome to the english language.
solnyshok 14y ago
API is much better than nothing. I say, begin with API, then require any API to have a basic "raw_data_dump (start date, end date)". And yes, this isn't about transparency, but it is more about efficiency, and still can lead to transparency.

ColinWright 14y ago

http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=4055622 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=4055622

mcrider 14y ago
Weird, I searched for the URL and also thought HN would automatically detect a dupe. Didn't mean to hijack a post!
- ColinWright 14y ago
  The URLs aren't identical, one has "index.php" at the end, the other doesn't: yada yada ... barak-obama-directs-all-federal-agencies-to-have-an-api/ yada yada ... barak-obama-directs-all-federal-agencies-to-have-an-api/index.php With regards searches, it depends on what you search for. HN_Search is not always obvious, and it doesn't index minute by minute. You may have done the search before the engine caught up.

jroseattle 14y ago

"...Within 90 days of the date of this memorandum, create a page on its website, located at www.[agency].gov/digitalstrategy, to publicly report progress in meeting the requirements of the Strategy in a machine-readable format.... ...implement the requirements of the Strategy within 12 months of the date of this memorandum and comply with the timeframes for specific actions specified therein" 3 months to get a "machine-readable" status report on implementing an API? Then, complete the implementation in 12 months? If it takes 3 months for an agency to get a status report up, how long will it take them to implement said API? Government work, sheesh....

mrpollo 14y ago
My best guess is that in the initial 3 months they wont be doing just the page, they will be outlining the efforts in order to comply in the next 12 months with the executive order, buy any hardware they must buy, and delegate any work to any branches they might need to
kprobst 14y ago
They'll simply report they haven't been able to implement the report, someone will get a slightly lower evaluation score and life.gov will go on as usual.
dllthomas 14y ago
They need to be sure they 1) are exposing everything they need to be exposing, 2) are hiding everything they need to be hiding, 3) are ready to handle potentially significant load, and 4) are robust against attack. Each of these is a little harder and/or a little more important in government than in a start-up (your start-up is probably less likely to get an informant killed because they posted the wrong thing than, say, DOJ), and 1 and 2 especially involve more than technical work - processes need to be set up to actually get the data where it needs to go in the first place. I'd love it if it could be faster, but I don't think 15 months is at all absurd.
- jroseattle 14y ago
  Actually, that's just project management 101. The fact that it's government work doesn't make the steps to delivery any different than anywhere else, just the subject matter. Or, it shouldn't be any different -- though I know some claim otherwise.

Anirak 14y ago

Every government office could take a lesson in well designed interfaces. Imagine how much smoother the DMV would be if someone had actually made the process designed to be as simple of an "interface" as possible. I know I'm probably hoping for too much, but maybe designing these web APIs will teach them a thing or two about how they might improve the efficiency of their offices as a whole.

waffle_ss 14y ago

Meanwhile, just yesterday the House Committee on Appropriations voted to [indefinitely delay][1] making legislative data available in machine-readable (XML) format. It's a repeat of a move taken in 2008 to "make a plan to make a plan" that never really goes anywhere. In other words, it's not gonna happen for a long time yet. [1]: http://sunlightfoundation.com/blog/2012/06/01/bulk-access-developments-after-the-h-approps-hearing/ http://sunlightfoundation.com/blog/2012/06/01/bulk-access-de...

lnguyen 14y ago
Don't expect someone to do something that goes against their self-interest. Especially if they can do a song and dance and make people forget that nothing is getting done.

neuroelectronic 14y ago

"Please Hack us, Israel", offers USA.

pwg 14y ago

This seems quite relevant now: http://xkcd.com/927/ http://xkcd.com/927/ What will this bring? Well, the US govt has X agencies. The result of this decree will be that, within 12 months, all of the public will get to enjoy the thrills of having X incompatible web API's, one unique one per agency.

pmb 14y ago
Better than it is now, where none of that data is available except possibly through FOIA lawsuits.
- jlarocco 14y ago
  That hasn't been true in my experience. What data are you looking for that isn't available? The only thing I can think of that's difficult to get is some law enforcement, military and "national security" related information, but APIs aren't going to change that. I don't have a ton of experience with it (mostly USGS and NOAA), but the Department of Commerce and the Department of Interior both make a ton of data available.

EricR23 14y ago

This reminds me of the push here in NYC for all of the city agencies to open their data via an API. It's gotten better over time, but when the initiative first took flight, it was terrible. Some of the APIs flat out did not work, and the ones that did often returned all sorts of malformed, non-normalized data. It was a nightmare to work with. I'm curious if the government can do better.

josh5555 14y ago
SPOILER ALERT No, the fed government can not do better. This announcement is just election year hype.

kjhughes 14y ago

I think this should be judged against the status quo as a positive development rather than against an abstract ideal as a flawed concept. Having seen too many clients stuck in analysis paralysis or blocked by political/turf issues while trying to develop corporate-wide standards (protocols, object models, etc), I'm just happy to see online access to public/government data advance in any way. If we had to wait for higher-level, coordinating standards first, progress might never come.

polemic 14y ago

I'm reminded of this recent post by James Fee, talking about geodata, but I think it applies to the general case: "... The question was APIs or downloads... Personally, I believe [data] is one of the best ways for citizens to keep track of their government (local to federal) ... APIs tend to deliver what their “owners” want them to do. Raw data means everyone has an opportunity to check each other’s work. Of course, raw data can be manipulated as well, but it is harder to obscure." - http://spatiallyadjusted.com/2012/04/03/sharing-data-downloads-are-the-key/ http://spatiallyadjusted.com/2012/04/03/sharing-data-downloa... I couldn't agree more. APIs are great, but are not the key to open government, for two reasons: 1. They don't provide simple and easy access for non technical individuals into raw information. APIs shouldn't exist for querying historical datasets if the dataset is not already available in a static format. Release the data, then build an API if there is demand (or the private sector doesn't do it, better, for you). 2. Historical data access is poorly served by APIs. There is no such thing as a good 'general use' API[1]. API's are appropriate for specific service based transactions that involve some level of processing. Examples: * VAT/GST number validation * Road closure notifications * Identity services 3. Bonus reason: government agencies suck at building APIs. They're not good at determining what is genuinely high value to end users, they tend to prefer visible projects that can justify budget increases, over genuinely useful, but less easily communicated ones (cf. the US national highway system and pork barrel politics), and there is an entire industry of enterprise companies heavily invested in keeping it this way. TL;DR Release the data, let users build the APIs. Everyone wins. Bootnotes: [1] I lie. That's exactly what publishing raw data at stable URLS on a website achieves.

kjhughes 14y ago
Hmm, not sure API vs data is productive to see as a dichotomy. Consider that an API might provide access to "raw" data directly. I'd ask not for data over APIs but for more universally useful properties such as stability, currency, consistency, etc.
- polemic 14y ago
  > Hmm, not sure API vs data is productive to see as a dichotomy. It's not, necessarily. An API provides a [very] limited view into the data. A view selected by the publisher. That's part of the problem. > I'd ask not for data over APIs but for more universally useful properties such as stability, currency, consistency, etc. Amen. I'd add: clear license and usage conditions, simple and concise metadata, and frequent updates.

sidwyn 14y ago

The first thing that caught my eye was the misspelling of Barack in the address :)

imrehg 14y ago

Get ready for some hackathon! I'm sure there are a lot of useful and interesting ideas to build with whatever comes up.

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anaheim 14y ago

Bloomberg "learning to code", Obama directing agencies to have an API. All part of politicians (particularly Democrats) trying to look like they have a clue. Give up already for heavens sake and get back to managing the deficit.

jakejake 14y ago

It's hard to imagine some federal agencies being able to do much of anything within 90 days. But, I look forward to poking around with some of these APIs.

codeonfire 14y ago

This is kind of interesting because maybe it shows how far the thinking is from technology right now. I can't wait to integrate FBI files into my web app, and maybe I can bypass 'authorized e-file providers' to file my taxes. Maybe I can download daily spy satellite imagery. My point is that what is already meant to be available is probably already available. Decision makers are often excited about technology but don't really get the ground level experience. They want to do all the things...on a roadmap...with milestones. Mobile has to be involved in some way.

blubler 14y ago

Tyranny has an API...

domwood 14y ago

In rudimentary terms, I suppose at least it's a step in the right direction. It doesn't necessarily suggest the US government is going to immediately embrace openly disseminating its data, but it's still a step in the right direction. Third party services will most likely proliferate quite rapidly.

DanielBMarkham 14y ago

15 years ago I contracted with several large federal agencies. Back then, we were pushing for the same thing. It never flew. I imagine after 15 years they may have a chance at this, but I would caution those of you who have never worked in huge government IT shops to take this with a grain of salt. The situation is so bad in many places that Congress has been passing laws making it illegal for the federal systems not to behave in a certain way. And still things are broken. We passed the point of desperation many years ago. Big IT in general is broken, and government IT is the most dysfunctional of any IT on the planet. I remain hopeful that this executive order can accomplish something, but I'm not holding my breath on it. Hopeful is one thing. Excited like this guy is? Not at all. Maybe in another 15 years. Maybe.

moomin 14y ago

Has he been reading Steve Yegge's redacted post?

djKianoosh 14y ago

As a programmer/contractor for DHS, I'd love to hear what you all think would be a useful set of APIs for DHS to make public. It's all fine and dandy to say 'oh yeah we have an API' but it needs to be something useful. So what would you want to see? Financial/Budget type data? Performance metrics across the different Components within the Department? What?

malyk 14y ago
How about TSA budget, # of TSA employees, # of terror plots stopped, some ratios between those things, # of nail clippers confiscated per employee, etc. ;)

stcredzero 14y ago

In enterprises where departmental data has been opened up through APIs, like Wells Fargo and Amazon, there have been tremendous benefits. In the case of Amazon, this was achieved by CEO fiat, and strongly tied to employee evaluation. (To the point where employees in groups that failed to do so would have been evaluated right out of the company.) I wonder if POTUS has this kind of power over the federal bureaucracy. Also, I would wonder if this is to be done securely.

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CUR10US 14y ago

API's? C'mon. Bulk data. Agree with polemic.