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Why is it that modern commentators don't read history? If the Stalingrad disaster (for both the Wehrmacht and the Soviets) teaches us anything, it's that urban

Why is it that modern commentators don't read history? If the Stalingrad disaster (for both the Wehrmacht and the Soviets) teaches us anything, it's that urban warfare is a no-win campaign. The main lessons of that Stalingrad battle are twofold: a) Urban warfare is very high-cost in terms of forces required and is extremely attritional. b) NEVER bomb a city that you plan on capturing. It only gives the defenders lots of cover and you can't move your armour around easily. Note that the Russians have only used small forces in the Kharkiv 'battle' so far. That signifies that they do not intend to take Kharkiv because they can't take Kharkiv with forces as small as that. So the 'strategic failure' is a non-starter. On the other hand, those smaller forces can definitely pin down Ukrainian forces that could be more useful on the front-lines elsewhwere. And that's a 'tactical win' for the Russians. Not in the Ukraine, but lesson (b) above shows that Israeli/Western armies haven't been paying attention. The Israelis have bombed Gaza to rubble and then sent in the men on the ground. So the Hamas men repeated what happened in Stalingrad, they let the Israeli men and tanks in, then ambush them from damaged buildings. The bomb-rubble means the Israeli tanks are forced into narrow 'killing zones' where they get picked off by Hamas men firing from behind broken walls. Countless Hamas videos show this in a grim repeat of the Soviets ambushing Wehrmacht tanks.

rasz 2y ago
>then ambush them from damaged buildings. so who controls Gaza now? >videos show this how many tanks destroyed? other that one Merkava on the 7th? Bombing target before advancing works. There isnt much left of the target afterwards, but you move forward. This is how ru took Popasna, Mariupol, Avdiivka, Bakhmut, and will take Chasiv Yar and Vovchansk soon enough :(
- racional 2y ago
  So you're cheering for both the IDF and Russia, apparently. Makes a certain kind of sense, actually.
  - rasz 2y ago
    Does observing what works automatically make one a fan?
    - racional 2y ago
      I may have misread you; if so, all apologies. I don't think the Russian offensive is working, overall (given the very modest amount of ink they've gained on the map, during the course of the US spending freeze). The Gaza situation is less clear -- but also gets into topics far from the original discussion.
- simonblack 2y ago
  so who controls Gaza now? According to the maps I've seen, Hamas controls about 80% of the ground. the IDF about 20%. And that's after 7-8 months of war. https://southfront.press/military-situation-in-palestine-on-june-1-2024-map-update/ https://southfront.press/military-situation-in-palestine-on-... I've seen a good dozen or more Hamas videos where they attack both tanks and other armoured vehicles. You should get out more, the videos are out on the Web for you to find. And the most salient point is that you can see that those ambushes are coming from semi-destroyed buildings. As in point (b) above.
  - r721 2y ago
    >The 2022 US Treasury report alleged that SouthFront was sanctioned in part for being "owned or controlled by, or for having acted or purported to act for or on behalf of, directly or indirectly, the FSB" https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SouthFront https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SouthFront
    - simonblack 2y ago
      Something like RFERL then? Or the BBC? Etc. LOL.
  - rasz 2y ago
    You have seen videos of terrorists shooting at tanks triggering Trophy explosion. Im asking how many tanks destroyed? You know, turret toss / burned out husk / everybody dead. Would you rather sneak in ruins taking ineffective potshots at armor and immediately get counter fired and pulverized, or roll inside the armor?
- racional 2y ago
  So who controls Gaza now? Let's see what the Occupation forces have to say about the subject: “We do have to remember there are more Hamas armed people in the north of Gaza in the places that the IDF has already moved out of than … in Rafah … Those are the IDF’s numbers. This is why the IDF had to go back into Jabaliya and … Zeitoun [a nearby town]. Hamas is controlling all those areas,” Eyal Hulata, the head of Israel’s national security council from 2021 to last year, told reporters last month. https://www.theguardian.com/world/article/2024/jun/03/hamas-still-strong-in-areas-cleared-by-israel-in-northern-gaza-say-experts https://www.theguardian.com/world/article/2024/jun/03/hamas-...

rasz 2y ago

>then ambush them from damaged buildings. so who controls Gaza now? >videos show this how many tanks destroyed? other that one Merkava on the 7th? Bombing target before advancing works. There isnt much left of the target afterwards, but you move forward. This is how ru took Popasna, Mariupol, Avdiivka, Bakhmut, and will take Chasiv Yar and Vovchansk soon enough :(

racional 2y ago
So you're cheering for both the IDF and Russia, apparently. Makes a certain kind of sense, actually.
- rasz 2y ago
  Does observing what works automatically make one a fan?
  - racional 2y ago
    I may have misread you; if so, all apologies. I don't think the Russian offensive is working, overall (given the very modest amount of ink they've gained on the map, during the course of the US spending freeze). The Gaza situation is less clear -- but also gets into topics far from the original discussion.
simonblack 2y ago
so who controls Gaza now? According to the maps I've seen, Hamas controls about 80% of the ground. the IDF about 20%. And that's after 7-8 months of war. https://southfront.press/military-situation-in-palestine-on-june-1-2024-map-update/ https://southfront.press/military-situation-in-palestine-on-... I've seen a good dozen or more Hamas videos where they attack both tanks and other armoured vehicles. You should get out more, the videos are out on the Web for you to find. And the most salient point is that you can see that those ambushes are coming from semi-destroyed buildings. As in point (b) above.
- r721 2y ago
  >The 2022 US Treasury report alleged that SouthFront was sanctioned in part for being "owned or controlled by, or for having acted or purported to act for or on behalf of, directly or indirectly, the FSB" https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SouthFront https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SouthFront
  - simonblack 2y ago
    Something like RFERL then? Or the BBC? Etc. LOL.
- rasz 2y ago
  You have seen videos of terrorists shooting at tanks triggering Trophy explosion. Im asking how many tanks destroyed? You know, turret toss / burned out husk / everybody dead. Would you rather sneak in ruins taking ineffective potshots at armor and immediately get counter fired and pulverized, or roll inside the armor?
racional 2y ago
So who controls Gaza now? Let's see what the Occupation forces have to say about the subject: “We do have to remember there are more Hamas armed people in the north of Gaza in the places that the IDF has already moved out of than … in Rafah … Those are the IDF’s numbers. This is why the IDF had to go back into Jabaliya and … Zeitoun [a nearby town]. Hamas is controlling all those areas,” Eyal Hulata, the head of Israel’s national security council from 2021 to last year, told reporters last month. https://www.theguardian.com/world/article/2024/jun/03/hamas-still-strong-in-areas-cleared-by-israel-in-northern-gaza-say-experts https://www.theguardian.com/world/article/2024/jun/03/hamas-...