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This is something I don't agree with Peter Thiel on - at least for your first startup. Elon Musk couldn't have started SpaceX and Tesla right out of school, he

This is something I don't agree with Peter Thiel on - at least for your first startup. Elon Musk couldn't have started SpaceX and Tesla right out of school, he had to build up skill, credentials, and connections first. For your first startup, make something awesome but try to fly people to Mars. A small acquisition or a business with nice revenue might be the better goal.

ovi256 14y ago
I think you meant "but don't try to fly people to Mars". I'm mostly leaf reading, but it seems to me you are recommending a lean startup / lifestyle business as a first startup. A less ambitious endeavour than say, Google or Amazon, with the primary goal of acquiring skills, small but safer revenue, a stepping stone to the next, bigger, enterprise. Very inspiring, and something young engineers should think about. BTW, I restate my request from my unsolicited email (hope you don't mind): please share some startup ideas, even if execution is everything, some of us younger, less experienced engineers find brainstorming and finding ideas harder, and would really appreciate some inspiration.
- bfe 14y ago
  Google started as an umpteenth search company on cheap machines and offered to sell out for one million, and Amazon started just by selling books from a website with buggy tech and workers kneeling on the floor to package the books. They both started at an easily accessible entry point too. But they each had a feasible path from humble to world-changing in a way that Elon maybe didn't going from online media and payments through a step function into disrupting transportation energy and yanking humanity into a spacefaring civilization. Even with, he was learning to get better at the game as he went along, and laying the foundation for SpaceX at the level of asking the rich questions, making the connections, and digging hard for elusive answers while he was still at x.com/PayPal. You probably always have to go through the foundation of exploring for the right questions to explore, to emerge with a meaningful advantage.
- gaborcselle 14y ago
  Oh yes, I did mean the negative - thanks for the correction. Responded to your email too.
varelse 14y ago
You have to take Peter Thiel as an ala carte buffet: In my own life, had I chosen the startup over grad school, I would easily be worth $100M+ right now. I had a ground floor opportunity I idiotically passed on because I was young, stupid, and too idealistic. So I see his point. That said, I shudder at the thought of hiring a programmer who struggled with calculus and nothing assures me better on that axis than straight As on math and computer science courses above and beyond requirements for their major. Individuals vary, and one of the best coders I know got a 2-year associates degree out of community college, but this is a really nice foot in the door for me when I don't know the person already.
- gaborcselle 14y ago
  "You have to take Peter Thiel as an ala carte buffet" - excellent good point. Paul Graham is a little bit more of a set meal.
- mmatants 14y ago
  I hope you don't feel too bad about passing on the startup opportunity. Hindsight is 20/20, and no startup is guaranteed to earn $100M for its founders. Maybe it's regrettable for not getting the experience you'd obtain win/lose, but the money part is a lottery.
mindcrime 14y ago
This is something I don't agree with Peter Thiel on - at least for your first startup. Elon Musk couldn't have started SpaceX and Tesla right out of school, he had to build up skill, credentials, and connections first. I agree with your point, but "your first startup" is not necessarily "right out of school." In my own case, I'm working on my first startup, after about 15 years in the IT world. And it's been those years of IT experience that has led to me (and to some extent, my co-founders, both of who are younger than I) to develop those beliefs where we feel like we believe something that everybody else doesn't. For your first startup, make something awesome but try to fly people to Mars. A small acquisition or a business with nice revenue might be the better goal. Yeah, we're thinking IPO, and eventually acquiring Microsoft. If you're going to dream, dream big, I always say. :-)
gaborcselle 14y ago
I can no longer edit my comment, but instead of: "For your first startup, make something awesome but try to fly people to Mars." I meant: "For your first startup, make something awesome but don't try to fly people to Mars."

This is something I don't agree with Peter Thiel on - at least for your first startup. Elon Musk couldn't have started SpaceX and Tesla right out of school, he had to build up skill, credentials, and connections first. For your first startup, make something awesome but try to fly people to Mars. A small acquisition or a business with nice revenue might be the better goal.

ovi256 14y ago

I think you meant "but don't try to fly people to Mars". I'm mostly leaf reading, but it seems to me you are recommending a lean startup / lifestyle business as a first startup. A less ambitious endeavour than say, Google or Amazon, with the primary goal of acquiring skills, small but safer revenue, a stepping stone to the next, bigger, enterprise. Very inspiring, and something young engineers should think about. BTW, I restate my request from my unsolicited email (hope you don't mind): please share some startup ideas, even if execution is everything, some of us younger, less experienced engineers find brainstorming and finding ideas harder, and would really appreciate some inspiration.

bfe 14y ago
Google started as an umpteenth search company on cheap machines and offered to sell out for one million, and Amazon started just by selling books from a website with buggy tech and workers kneeling on the floor to package the books. They both started at an easily accessible entry point too. But they each had a feasible path from humble to world-changing in a way that Elon maybe didn't going from online media and payments through a step function into disrupting transportation energy and yanking humanity into a spacefaring civilization. Even with, he was learning to get better at the game as he went along, and laying the foundation for SpaceX at the level of asking the rich questions, making the connections, and digging hard for elusive answers while he was still at x.com/PayPal. You probably always have to go through the foundation of exploring for the right questions to explore, to emerge with a meaningful advantage.
gaborcselle 14y ago
Oh yes, I did mean the negative - thanks for the correction. Responded to your email too.

varelse 14y ago

You have to take Peter Thiel as an ala carte buffet: In my own life, had I chosen the startup over grad school, I would easily be worth $100M+ right now. I had a ground floor opportunity I idiotically passed on because I was young, stupid, and too idealistic. So I see his point. That said, I shudder at the thought of hiring a programmer who struggled with calculus and nothing assures me better on that axis than straight As on math and computer science courses above and beyond requirements for their major. Individuals vary, and one of the best coders I know got a 2-year associates degree out of community college, but this is a really nice foot in the door for me when I don't know the person already.

gaborcselle 14y ago
"You have to take Peter Thiel as an ala carte buffet" - excellent good point. Paul Graham is a little bit more of a set meal.
mmatants 14y ago
I hope you don't feel too bad about passing on the startup opportunity. Hindsight is 20/20, and no startup is guaranteed to earn $100M for its founders. Maybe it's regrettable for not getting the experience you'd obtain win/lose, but the money part is a lottery.

mindcrime 14y ago

This is something I don't agree with Peter Thiel on - at least for your first startup. Elon Musk couldn't have started SpaceX and Tesla right out of school, he had to build up skill, credentials, and connections first. I agree with your point, but "your first startup" is not necessarily "right out of school." In my own case, I'm working on my first startup, after about 15 years in the IT world. And it's been those years of IT experience that has led to me (and to some extent, my co-founders, both of who are younger than I) to develop those beliefs where we feel like we believe something that everybody else doesn't. For your first startup, make something awesome but try to fly people to Mars. A small acquisition or a business with nice revenue might be the better goal. Yeah, we're thinking IPO, and eventually acquiring Microsoft. If you're going to dream, dream big, I always say. :-)

gaborcselle 14y ago

I can no longer edit my comment, but instead of: "For your first startup, make something awesome but try to fly people to Mars." I meant: "For your first startup, make something awesome but don't try to fly people to Mars."