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The 1% worst human drivers are really quite unpredictable. You're never certain with any human driver whether they're going to drive like a maniac, but you do k

The 1% worst human drivers are really quite unpredictable. You're never certain with any human driver whether they're going to drive like a maniac, but you do know you're not getting that with a Waymo.

ok_dad 2y ago
With a human I can look at their face to see that they see me. How do I know a robot sees me? Do they have indications that say “I see you and won’t drive” like a driver looking at you in the face and waving?
- xvedejas 2y ago
  As a cyclist/pedestrian I'm used to drivers ignoring me anyway, YMMV
- int0x29 2y ago
  With tinted windows and glare I already can't see like 75% of drivers. At least driverless cars reliably signal so I don't have to do pose estimation with the front wheels to cross the street. Also they aren't on their phones.
  - fragmede 2y ago
    Streaming live video non-stop to the Internet, arguably Waymos are "on the phone" more than humans :p
  - ok_dad 2y ago
    So answer my question, how do I know the Waymo sees me? With a human I can tell 90% of the time where I live (we have tint laws and stuff). I can’t see trusting that a robot sees me, otherwise I guess I’m just giving deference to them now? At least with humans I can see if they are distracted, I can yell at them to get attention, perhaps others. With a robot taxi, I can’t tell anything about it, and I’m a software dev so I absolutely don’t trust anything running software made by a corporation in search of profits, or any other software really, to operate a car in open roads. Not yet at least, maybe in a few decades.
    - gretch 2y ago
      That’s not all of the possible cases. “In 2022, 13,524 people died in alcohol-impaired driving traffic deaths.” Source nhtsa.gov You’re gonna briefly glimpse a passed out drunk driver before it plows through you at 40 mph
      - ok_dad 2y ago
        You still didn’t answer my question about robot taxis, you just did another “what about x“.
- bagels 2y ago
  Drivers can stare right at you as they run you over. Believing you have eye contact does not prevent you from being run over.
  - ok_dad 2y ago
    > like a driver looking at you in the face and waving your reading comprehension sucks
    - bagels 2y ago
      Maybe sometimes, but not this time. "With a human I can look at their face to see that they see me."
      - ok_dad 2y ago
        Did you read the whole thing buddy? Guess not! I guess reading isn’t your thing.
  - pmg101 2y ago
    Anything "can" happen. But having driven and cycled many thousands of miles I'm convinced the probability of being run down/driven into by someone who has made eye contact is a lot lower than by someone who has not, so eye contact is a useful signal. Like GP I'd be happier if robotaxis could not only sense me but also send me a signal to inform me they had (beyond just changing their driving behaviour, although that is in itself a useful signal too of course.)

ok_dad 2y ago

With a human I can look at their face to see that they see me. How do I know a robot sees me? Do they have indications that say “I see you and won’t drive” like a driver looking at you in the face and waving?

xvedejas 2y ago
As a cyclist/pedestrian I'm used to drivers ignoring me anyway, YMMV
int0x29 2y ago
With tinted windows and glare I already can't see like 75% of drivers. At least driverless cars reliably signal so I don't have to do pose estimation with the front wheels to cross the street. Also they aren't on their phones.
- fragmede 2y ago
  Streaming live video non-stop to the Internet, arguably Waymos are "on the phone" more than humans :p
- ok_dad 2y ago
  So answer my question, how do I know the Waymo sees me? With a human I can tell 90% of the time where I live (we have tint laws and stuff). I can’t see trusting that a robot sees me, otherwise I guess I’m just giving deference to them now? At least with humans I can see if they are distracted, I can yell at them to get attention, perhaps others. With a robot taxi, I can’t tell anything about it, and I’m a software dev so I absolutely don’t trust anything running software made by a corporation in search of profits, or any other software really, to operate a car in open roads. Not yet at least, maybe in a few decades.
  - gretch 2y ago
    That’s not all of the possible cases. “In 2022, 13,524 people died in alcohol-impaired driving traffic deaths.” Source nhtsa.gov You’re gonna briefly glimpse a passed out drunk driver before it plows through you at 40 mph
    - ok_dad 2y ago
      You still didn’t answer my question about robot taxis, you just did another “what about x“.
bagels 2y ago
Drivers can stare right at you as they run you over. Believing you have eye contact does not prevent you from being run over.
- ok_dad 2y ago
  > like a driver looking at you in the face and waving your reading comprehension sucks
  - bagels 2y ago
    Maybe sometimes, but not this time. "With a human I can look at their face to see that they see me."
    - ok_dad 2y ago
      Did you read the whole thing buddy? Guess not! I guess reading isn’t your thing.
- pmg101 2y ago
  Anything "can" happen. But having driven and cycled many thousands of miles I'm convinced the probability of being run down/driven into by someone who has made eye contact is a lot lower than by someone who has not, so eye contact is a useful signal. Like GP I'd be happier if robotaxis could not only sense me but also send me a signal to inform me they had (beyond just changing their driving behaviour, although that is in itself a useful signal too of course.)