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100%. My kid is not getting a smartphone until he's ~16 but we're looking at a restricted smart watch right now (a flip phone would also be acceptable but a wa

100%. My kid is not getting a smartphone until he's ~16 but we're looking at a restricted smart watch right now (a flip phone would also be acceptable but a watch is physically attached which is ideal for 7 year old).

ZiiS 2y ago
Not getting a phone you know about!
- philomath_mn 2y ago
  A minor is going to get a phone plan w/o a guardian signing for it? And use it in my house without me knowing? There is a lot my kid is going to do under my nose, getting a smartphone doesn't seem too likely (esp. if he has alternatives like a desktop).
  - gnicholas 2y ago
    This is absolutely what I worry about for my kids, down the line. A boyfriend could easily pass her an inherited iPhone with a prepaid SIM card so they could keep in touch away from parental prying eyes. Most families around here (SV) have old devices lying around, and $20/mo for a cellular plan is nothing for many teenagers.
    - philomath_mn 2y ago
      Fair enough! Something to watch for I suppose.
      - LordDragonfang 2y ago
        I think you've sort of missed the forest for the trees, here. If you've gotten to the point where the kid is hiding a phone from you, you're already in an adversarial relationship with a young adult who has lost trust in your ability to be a reasonable authority figure.
        gnicholas 2y ago
        You seem to think that there aren't any kids that, under pretty much any circumstances, would want to have a private device. Speaking from experience (having been a kid myself) I can assure you that these kids exist.
        SoftTalker 2y ago
        Pretty much all teens have stuff they are hiding from their parents. Some of it is trivial, some might be pretty serious. For example I'd guess it's not very common for your kid to come home and announce he's started having sex (though one of mine did).
        sersi 2y ago
        Ha! my dad celebrated my announcement by inviting me to a good restaurant. I would never have thought about hiding that from my parents and I had their full support to bring my girlfriend back to my room (and later for the night)
        philomath_mn 2y ago
        Agreed -- best course of action is to develop a healthy relationship with the kid to avoid this situation all-together. Besides, I am pro dumbphone and don't plan on reading my kids' texts so I don't think these scenarios are applicable.
  - Someone1234 2y ago
    > A minor is going to get a phone plan w/o a guardian signing for it? In the US at least, it is trivial to get a phone plan without being 18 or having an adult sign for it. There is no credit check nor identity check. Just walk into any Walmart and pick up any one of a dozen prepaid kits. These plans require you to bring your own devices, but you can get a used/unbranded smartphone for under $100 and a plan with data for under $10/month. It has been this way for at least 10-15 years, if anything post-pay/credit line plans are quite an outdated concept, and mostly used by older generations who are overpaying. Plus T-Mobile specifically have had three data breaches leaking all of their customer's personal information (which they wouldn't even have with a prepaid plan).
    - philomath_mn 2y ago
      The more you know, I guess :+1:
    - reaperducer 2y ago
      you can get a used/unbranded smartphone for under $100 I got one at the bodega on the corner for $20. The owner wanted $35, but when I told him I'd pay cash, he took the twenty. It was in packaging from some carrier in Mexico, but wasn't SIM locked. No problems for the last year.
      - yoyogogo69 2y ago
        lol kind of funny something like 35 can be bargained down with cash. if im selling a used phone for 35 im for sure expecting to deal with cash but of course accept other payments as well since its at my store. i guess its even hard to pay for drugs in cash these days huh. i do know in korea cash is not even a thing anymore. either are plastic cards its just all through phones
    - windowsrookie 2y ago
      Exactly, and the MVNO's often have iPhone SE's and Galaxy A series phones brand new for under $100.
  - TheNewsIsHere 2y ago
    The trick is whether or not he’s a true believer in the rules you promulgate. If he’s not, he may find ways around them, and you probably don’t want to foster a game of cat and mouse with your child lest they end up resenting you. Not YOU, specifically. I’m speaking in general terms, and somewhat from experience. When I was in high school we barely had smartphones. A friend of mine had a Windows Mobile 6 device, some kids had Blackberry devices. The iPhone had just come out. Devices were somewhat less personal back then so my experiences may not be practically replicable today, but back in the day I would lend my phone to my friends at the end of the school day if they had been grounded and their phone taken away. Again, that was almost 20 years ago (dear god), but there’s something to be said for the unchecked determination of a teenager in search of a gadget. I don’t necessarily disagree with your stance, nor am I criticizing you. For every watchful parental eye, there’s always a bit of sleight of hand. It’s the way of so many of us here, and likely something passed on to the kids of many of us here.
  - deleted 2y ago
    [deleted]
miketery 2y ago
I think the issue at hand is yes you can enforce this at the family level. However unless high maturity / self awareness the kid will struggle if his peers all have phones. This needs to be a campaign pushed at the school or even county level.
- playingalong 2y ago
  Yep. Their class at school has a WhatsApp or similar group chat.
  - philomath_mn 2y ago
    We can fire up WhatApp on desktop or tablet -- the constant access is the biggest issue I have with smartphones.
    - TeMPOraL 2y ago
      Can they? Aren't PC apps second-tier citizens of WhatsApp world, requiring regular reauthentication with your phone?
- darkhorse222 2y ago
  Yeah there's discussion about this in scientific articles I've read, where at a certain point the social circle exists on these apps, and by a single individual removing themselves they are forced to effectively choose isolation. I experienced it myself when I deleted instagram. I realized that certain friendships that had been thriving on that channel didn't flow as well outside it, via texting for example. So I redownloaded and set a screen time limit and I'm calling that good enough.
  - skydhash 2y ago
    > I realized that certain friendships that had been thriving on that channel didn't flow as well outside it, via texting for example. I think it's a strain to call that friendship. Communication channels don't matter in case of friendship. I may text, call, email, etc... and it's all good. But it being exclusive to a specific platform is more a social circle or a club as you said.
hagbard_c 2y ago
> a watch is physically attached which is ideal for 7 year old Better hope that watch is water- and shockproof because a healthy 7yo will find many ways to test those features.
- philomath_mn 2y ago
  Haha yuup, they have some tough looking cases but I am going in expecting damage
captaincaveman 2y ago
Good luck with that!
deleted 2y ago
[deleted]

ZiiS 2y ago

Not getting a phone you know about!

philomath_mn 2y ago
A minor is going to get a phone plan w/o a guardian signing for it? And use it in my house without me knowing? There is a lot my kid is going to do under my nose, getting a smartphone doesn't seem too likely (esp. if he has alternatives like a desktop).
- gnicholas 2y ago
  This is absolutely what I worry about for my kids, down the line. A boyfriend could easily pass her an inherited iPhone with a prepaid SIM card so they could keep in touch away from parental prying eyes. Most families around here (SV) have old devices lying around, and $20/mo for a cellular plan is nothing for many teenagers.
  - philomath_mn 2y ago
    Fair enough! Something to watch for I suppose.
    - LordDragonfang 2y ago
      I think you've sort of missed the forest for the trees, here. If you've gotten to the point where the kid is hiding a phone from you, you're already in an adversarial relationship with a young adult who has lost trust in your ability to be a reasonable authority figure.
      - gnicholas 2y ago
        You seem to think that there aren't any kids that, under pretty much any circumstances, would want to have a private device. Speaking from experience (having been a kid myself) I can assure you that these kids exist.
      - SoftTalker 2y ago
        Pretty much all teens have stuff they are hiding from their parents. Some of it is trivial, some might be pretty serious. For example I'd guess it's not very common for your kid to come home and announce he's started having sex (though one of mine did).
        sersi 2y ago
        Ha! my dad celebrated my announcement by inviting me to a good restaurant. I would never have thought about hiding that from my parents and I had their full support to bring my girlfriend back to my room (and later for the night)
      - philomath_mn 2y ago
        Agreed -- best course of action is to develop a healthy relationship with the kid to avoid this situation all-together. Besides, I am pro dumbphone and don't plan on reading my kids' texts so I don't think these scenarios are applicable.
- Someone1234 2y ago
  > A minor is going to get a phone plan w/o a guardian signing for it? In the US at least, it is trivial to get a phone plan without being 18 or having an adult sign for it. There is no credit check nor identity check. Just walk into any Walmart and pick up any one of a dozen prepaid kits. These plans require you to bring your own devices, but you can get a used/unbranded smartphone for under $100 and a plan with data for under $10/month. It has been this way for at least 10-15 years, if anything post-pay/credit line plans are quite an outdated concept, and mostly used by older generations who are overpaying. Plus T-Mobile specifically have had three data breaches leaking all of their customer's personal information (which they wouldn't even have with a prepaid plan).
  - philomath_mn 2y ago
    The more you know, I guess :+1:
  - reaperducer 2y ago
    you can get a used/unbranded smartphone for under $100 I got one at the bodega on the corner for $20. The owner wanted $35, but when I told him I'd pay cash, he took the twenty. It was in packaging from some carrier in Mexico, but wasn't SIM locked. No problems for the last year.
    - yoyogogo69 2y ago
      lol kind of funny something like 35 can be bargained down with cash. if im selling a used phone for 35 im for sure expecting to deal with cash but of course accept other payments as well since its at my store. i guess its even hard to pay for drugs in cash these days huh. i do know in korea cash is not even a thing anymore. either are plastic cards its just all through phones
  - windowsrookie 2y ago
    Exactly, and the MVNO's often have iPhone SE's and Galaxy A series phones brand new for under $100.
- TheNewsIsHere 2y ago
  The trick is whether or not he’s a true believer in the rules you promulgate. If he’s not, he may find ways around them, and you probably don’t want to foster a game of cat and mouse with your child lest they end up resenting you. Not YOU, specifically. I’m speaking in general terms, and somewhat from experience. When I was in high school we barely had smartphones. A friend of mine had a Windows Mobile 6 device, some kids had Blackberry devices. The iPhone had just come out. Devices were somewhat less personal back then so my experiences may not be practically replicable today, but back in the day I would lend my phone to my friends at the end of the school day if they had been grounded and their phone taken away. Again, that was almost 20 years ago (dear god), but there’s something to be said for the unchecked determination of a teenager in search of a gadget. I don’t necessarily disagree with your stance, nor am I criticizing you. For every watchful parental eye, there’s always a bit of sleight of hand. It’s the way of so many of us here, and likely something passed on to the kids of many of us here.
- deleted 2y ago
  [deleted]

miketery 2y ago

I think the issue at hand is yes you can enforce this at the family level. However unless high maturity / self awareness the kid will struggle if his peers all have phones. This needs to be a campaign pushed at the school or even county level.

playingalong 2y ago
Yep. Their class at school has a WhatsApp or similar group chat.
- philomath_mn 2y ago
  We can fire up WhatApp on desktop or tablet -- the constant access is the biggest issue I have with smartphones.
  - TeMPOraL 2y ago
    Can they? Aren't PC apps second-tier citizens of WhatsApp world, requiring regular reauthentication with your phone?
darkhorse222 2y ago
Yeah there's discussion about this in scientific articles I've read, where at a certain point the social circle exists on these apps, and by a single individual removing themselves they are forced to effectively choose isolation. I experienced it myself when I deleted instagram. I realized that certain friendships that had been thriving on that channel didn't flow as well outside it, via texting for example. So I redownloaded and set a screen time limit and I'm calling that good enough.
- skydhash 2y ago
  > I realized that certain friendships that had been thriving on that channel didn't flow as well outside it, via texting for example. I think it's a strain to call that friendship. Communication channels don't matter in case of friendship. I may text, call, email, etc... and it's all good. But it being exclusive to a specific platform is more a social circle or a club as you said.

hagbard_c 2y ago

> a watch is physically attached which is ideal for 7 year old Better hope that watch is water- and shockproof because a healthy 7yo will find many ways to test those features.

philomath_mn 2y ago
Haha yuup, they have some tough looking cases but I am going in expecting damage

captaincaveman 2y ago

Good luck with that!

deleted 2y ago

[deleted]