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Could you provide a few examples of CEOs bearing responsibility in practice? And just to be clear: I don't think we should be considering paying yourself an ob

Could you provide a few examples of CEOs bearing responsibility in practice? And just to be clear: I don't think we should be considering paying yourself an obscenely high exit bonus after you fucked up as "bearing responsibility".

slt2021 2y ago
CEOs lose jobs all the time, yes they get to receive golden parachute - but it is a cost of hiring a CEO. Like severance. Same way no good FAANG engineer would sign up without good pay package like base+RSU+bonus - same way no good CEO would sign up for a high risk CEO job without golden parachute. Because it could well be their last job if they fail. or last good CEO job. Imagine having only one shot at working as Engineer and without ability to jump ship because all your actions are public and you are associated with your company success
- bluefirebrand 2y ago
  > same way no good CEO would sign up for a high risk CEO job without golden parachute This doesn't make sense The golden parachute means that these jobs are not "high risk" at all Oh no you got fired and wound up with a severance package that is big enough that it could set you up for life and you can retire right now? The horror! That's not risk. Someone working a minimum wage job living paycheque to paycheque is taking more risk when they take a sick day than any CEO with a golden parachute contract ever takes in their whole life
- bitcharmer 2y ago
  Thanks for replying but I think you might be confused a little. There's no comparing a FAANG engineer with a CEO. The former won't be able to live comfortably for the rest of their lives with an engineer's severance package. The latter absolutely can.
  - slt2021 2y ago
    you are confused if you dont understand the reason why CEOs have big severance while engineers have smaller severance
    - bitcharmer 2y ago
      Maybe, care to elaborate further?
      - slt2021 2y ago
        CEOs dont have an option to jump ship. All their actions are scrutinized heavily since they are public. By accepting CEO job they accepting a risk this could be their last CEO job ever, if they mess up. Thats why they require golden parachute. If you want to hire CEO, that means your company is in trouble and desperately need good steward. You want to hire strong CEO, but he is taking a risk that he demands to be compensated for in case you change your mind want to change CEO again. with engineers - risk is smaller, plenty of engineers just jump ship to another company (and many even get a pay bump) after failing at current job. Thats why severance is smaller than CEO
        bitcharmer 2y ago
        This makes no sense. CEO job carries zero risk if there's a golden parachute attached to it.
        slt2021 2y ago
        risk is not zero, since golden parachute is usually less than potential lifetime earnings as CEO (for top tier candidate). CEO may get $20 min as severance, but would potentially lose hundreds of mils had he not taken this job, and instead pursued another job that lasted for longer
        fennecfoxy 2y ago
        There are tonnes of CEOs that fuck up and still get jobs as CEOs at other companies. They all go to the same private schools/universities, they've all done MBAs and they all continue to socialise through their careers. Same situations with politicians and police forces, they create a club whereby all members are unduly supported.
Aurornis 2y ago
> Could you provide a few examples of CEOs bearing responsibility in practice? Two of the companies I've worked for have had their CEOs fired/replaced for poor performance. One of them was also mismanaging finances and spending for his own gain. It became common knowledge in the local investor community. He was never able to return to being a CEO again, except for some unknown company in Europe where he was briefly a remote CEO. If you want more public examples: Sam Bankman-Fried, Elizabeth Holmes, etc. are literally in jail. Many public companies also ditch their CEOs publicly, and most don't recover to the same career level. You just don't hear about those stories much because they don't generate rage-clicks the same way another dozen articles about Jeff Bezos or Sam Altman will.
- bitcharmer 2y ago
  I think I should have been more clear with my "fucked up" definition. What I was referring to is not criminal misconduct which you seem to be focusing on but rather failing as a leader/executive in a business sense.
- yobbo 2y ago
  > Two of the companies I've worked for have had their CEOs fired/replaced for poor performance. Ah. Like employees.

slt2021 2y ago

CEOs lose jobs all the time, yes they get to receive golden parachute - but it is a cost of hiring a CEO. Like severance. Same way no good FAANG engineer would sign up without good pay package like base+RSU+bonus - same way no good CEO would sign up for a high risk CEO job without golden parachute. Because it could well be their last job if they fail. or last good CEO job. Imagine having only one shot at working as Engineer and without ability to jump ship because all your actions are public and you are associated with your company success

bluefirebrand 2y ago
> same way no good CEO would sign up for a high risk CEO job without golden parachute This doesn't make sense The golden parachute means that these jobs are not "high risk" at all Oh no you got fired and wound up with a severance package that is big enough that it could set you up for life and you can retire right now? The horror! That's not risk. Someone working a minimum wage job living paycheque to paycheque is taking more risk when they take a sick day than any CEO with a golden parachute contract ever takes in their whole life
bitcharmer 2y ago
Thanks for replying but I think you might be confused a little. There's no comparing a FAANG engineer with a CEO. The former won't be able to live comfortably for the rest of their lives with an engineer's severance package. The latter absolutely can.
- slt2021 2y ago
  you are confused if you dont understand the reason why CEOs have big severance while engineers have smaller severance
  - bitcharmer 2y ago
    Maybe, care to elaborate further?
    - slt2021 2y ago
      CEOs dont have an option to jump ship. All their actions are scrutinized heavily since they are public. By accepting CEO job they accepting a risk this could be their last CEO job ever, if they mess up. Thats why they require golden parachute. If you want to hire CEO, that means your company is in trouble and desperately need good steward. You want to hire strong CEO, but he is taking a risk that he demands to be compensated for in case you change your mind want to change CEO again. with engineers - risk is smaller, plenty of engineers just jump ship to another company (and many even get a pay bump) after failing at current job. Thats why severance is smaller than CEO
      - bitcharmer 2y ago
        This makes no sense. CEO job carries zero risk if there's a golden parachute attached to it.
        slt2021 2y ago
        risk is not zero, since golden parachute is usually less than potential lifetime earnings as CEO (for top tier candidate). CEO may get $20 min as severance, but would potentially lose hundreds of mils had he not taken this job, and instead pursued another job that lasted for longer
      - fennecfoxy 2y ago
        There are tonnes of CEOs that fuck up and still get jobs as CEOs at other companies. They all go to the same private schools/universities, they've all done MBAs and they all continue to socialise through their careers. Same situations with politicians and police forces, they create a club whereby all members are unduly supported.

Aurornis 2y ago

> Could you provide a few examples of CEOs bearing responsibility in practice? Two of the companies I've worked for have had their CEOs fired/replaced for poor performance. One of them was also mismanaging finances and spending for his own gain. It became common knowledge in the local investor community. He was never able to return to being a CEO again, except for some unknown company in Europe where he was briefly a remote CEO. If you want more public examples: Sam Bankman-Fried, Elizabeth Holmes, etc. are literally in jail. Many public companies also ditch their CEOs publicly, and most don't recover to the same career level. You just don't hear about those stories much because they don't generate rage-clicks the same way another dozen articles about Jeff Bezos or Sam Altman will.

bitcharmer 2y ago
I think I should have been more clear with my "fucked up" definition. What I was referring to is not criminal misconduct which you seem to be focusing on but rather failing as a leader/executive in a business sense.
yobbo 2y ago
> Two of the companies I've worked for have had their CEOs fired/replaced for poor performance. Ah. Like employees.