2 ms·

None of that really has anything to do with the discussion and is completely melodramatic, as someone else mentioned. However, we have indeed ended up in a hel

by bmitc 2y ago

None of that really has anything to do with the discussion and is completely melodramatic, as someone else mentioned. However, we have indeed ended up in a hell-hole. Again, as someone else mentioned, the U.S. in the early 20th century rose up against the capitalist thinking and companies coming out of the industrial revolution and implemented socialist policies, progressive tax structures, and aggressive anti-trust laws and lawsuits. But the capitalists have one out again and are stronger than ever and are indeed turning the U.S. into a hell-hole. By many accounts, the U.S. is a hell-hole on the whole. It ranks low in several markings such as education, standard of living, healthcare and healthcare access, wealth equality, infant mortality (i.e., it's quite high in the U.S.), etc. The list goes on. Yes, someone will reply that the U.S. has some of the best education, healthcare, standard of living, etc. in the world. And that is true when looking at specific, local instances. But the gap is wide and as a whole the U.S. is struggling. Are places like Norway, Denmark, Finland, Sweden, etc. really hell-holes? I'm not saying they are perfect, but there's a reason why they rank on top in terms of health, education, happiness, balance, etc.

WalterBright 2y ago
Education is run by the government in the US, as is healthcare. It's ironic that you blame capitalism for that. Infant mortality rate is indeed higher than the US. I dug into it a few years back. It seems that the definition of infant mortality is different among different nations. The US has the most expansive view of it - more specifically, we try to save preemies more aggressively than any other nation, and the failures are counted as infant mortalities. Other nations do not. Wealth equality is a goal of communism. You are not worse off simply because someone else has more money than you.
- bmitc 2y ago
  > Education is run by the government in the US, as is healthcare. It's ironic that you blame capitalism for that. No it's not ironic, and it's also not completely correct. There's no point in having a conversation with lack of good faith statements like this. For starters, education is underfunded, and it's leached on to by corporations. Big surprise it doesn't do well. There's also lack of social support structures surrounding our education, so it's no surprise that the educational system is overwhelmed with trying to be too much while also underfunded. And healthcare is not ran by the government in the U.S. It is almost completely privatized, so your statement is an outright untruth and purely bizarre. I have no idea what you're agenda is, but there clearly is one. > Wealth equality is a goal of communism. Wrong again.
  - WalterBright 2y ago
    > education is underfunded This comes up in the Seattle Times nearly every day, and in the reader responses it's invariably pointed out that the funding per student has doubled in the last 15 years or so, even discounted for inflation. > healthcare So, Medicare and Medicaid do not exist? Obamacare isn't funded by the government for poor people? Heavy government regulation doesn't cover nearly every aspect of health care? "From each according to his ability, to each according to his needs." -- Karl Marx
WalterBright 2y ago
> By many accounts, the U.S. is a hell-hole on the whole. Many people are unhappy when they discover that a middle class lifestyle requires work. In Seattle, the government decided that poor people are entitled to free air conditioners. A hellhole? LOL. It's almost June and I still turn the heat on.
- bmitc 2y ago
  > Many people are unhappy when they discover that a middle class lifestyle requires work. I'm just going to stop responding, but I have to call this out. This statement shows a complete disregard and a total lack of empathy for those in the lower middle class and below in the United States. You need to take a step back and understand just how hard people have it in this country. For example, read this: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4856058/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4856058/ From the article: > In contrast, there is tremendous inequality within the US, with lower socioeconomic status groups experiencing much higher postneonatal mortality rates. They even go on to eventually claim that the U.S. actually has an advantage during the neonatal period, which is the first four weeks of life, but has abysmal mortality pre-birth and postneonatal compared to peer countries. The reason, one could surmise, is that neonatal is when people actually see doctors. For lower socioeconomic status, the first time they might be seeing an OBGYN is when they go to the emergency room for birth due to lack of insurance, income, education, and other socioeconomic factors.
  - WalterBright 2y ago
    I grew up in a lower middle class family. Here's the formula for middle class and higher success in America: 1. stay in school 2. pay attention in school, learn the material 3. don't do drugs 4. don't do crimes 5. go to college (loans are readily available) 6. pick a major that pays well It's not rocket science. Your cite says that the differences in infant mortality shrink considerably when taking into account differential criteria for infant mortality. What the study does not address is drug abuse by the mother. The paper assumes differences are due to differential health care, rather than different lifestyle choices. Lifestyle that affects infant mortality include: 1. drug abuse 2. smoking 3. obesity 4. diet 5. alcohol use 6. absence of fathers (i.e. lack of stable family) 7. age of mother These are all significant factors, and ignoring them and blaming the health care system is not good enough.

by bmitc 2y ago

WalterBright 2y ago

Education is run by the government in the US, as is healthcare. It's ironic that you blame capitalism for that. Infant mortality rate is indeed higher than the US. I dug into it a few years back. It seems that the definition of infant mortality is different among different nations. The US has the most expansive view of it - more specifically, we try to save preemies more aggressively than any other nation, and the failures are counted as infant mortalities. Other nations do not. Wealth equality is a goal of communism. You are not worse off simply because someone else has more money than you.

bmitc 2y ago
> Education is run by the government in the US, as is healthcare. It's ironic that you blame capitalism for that. No it's not ironic, and it's also not completely correct. There's no point in having a conversation with lack of good faith statements like this. For starters, education is underfunded, and it's leached on to by corporations. Big surprise it doesn't do well. There's also lack of social support structures surrounding our education, so it's no surprise that the educational system is overwhelmed with trying to be too much while also underfunded. And healthcare is not ran by the government in the U.S. It is almost completely privatized, so your statement is an outright untruth and purely bizarre. I have no idea what you're agenda is, but there clearly is one. > Wealth equality is a goal of communism. Wrong again.
- WalterBright 2y ago
  > education is underfunded This comes up in the Seattle Times nearly every day, and in the reader responses it's invariably pointed out that the funding per student has doubled in the last 15 years or so, even discounted for inflation. > healthcare So, Medicare and Medicaid do not exist? Obamacare isn't funded by the government for poor people? Heavy government regulation doesn't cover nearly every aspect of health care? "From each according to his ability, to each according to his needs." -- Karl Marx

WalterBright 2y ago

> By many accounts, the U.S. is a hell-hole on the whole. Many people are unhappy when they discover that a middle class lifestyle requires work. In Seattle, the government decided that poor people are entitled to free air conditioners. A hellhole? LOL. It's almost June and I still turn the heat on.

bmitc 2y ago
> Many people are unhappy when they discover that a middle class lifestyle requires work. I'm just going to stop responding, but I have to call this out. This statement shows a complete disregard and a total lack of empathy for those in the lower middle class and below in the United States. You need to take a step back and understand just how hard people have it in this country. For example, read this: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4856058/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4856058/ From the article: > In contrast, there is tremendous inequality within the US, with lower socioeconomic status groups experiencing much higher postneonatal mortality rates. They even go on to eventually claim that the U.S. actually has an advantage during the neonatal period, which is the first four weeks of life, but has abysmal mortality pre-birth and postneonatal compared to peer countries. The reason, one could surmise, is that neonatal is when people actually see doctors. For lower socioeconomic status, the first time they might be seeing an OBGYN is when they go to the emergency room for birth due to lack of insurance, income, education, and other socioeconomic factors.
- WalterBright 2y ago
  I grew up in a lower middle class family. Here's the formula for middle class and higher success in America: 1. stay in school 2. pay attention in school, learn the material 3. don't do drugs 4. don't do crimes 5. go to college (loans are readily available) 6. pick a major that pays well It's not rocket science. Your cite says that the differences in infant mortality shrink considerably when taking into account differential criteria for infant mortality. What the study does not address is drug abuse by the mother. The paper assumes differences are due to differential health care, rather than different lifestyle choices. Lifestyle that affects infant mortality include: 1. drug abuse 2. smoking 3. obesity 4. diet 5. alcohol use 6. absence of fathers (i.e. lack of stable family) 7. age of mother These are all significant factors, and ignoring them and blaming the health care system is not good enough.