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Might as well say "Toyota showcases new buggy carriage adaptable to different horse breeds" for all this will do to stop climate collapse. In the 90's, Toyota

Might as well say "Toyota showcases new buggy carriage adaptable to different horse breeds" for all this will do to stop climate collapse. In the 90's, Toyota was a top car manufacturer in terms of safety and efficiency. Now, they're fiddling while Rome^H^H^H^HEarth burns.

genter 2y ago
Toyota was never a top car manufacturer in terms of safety and efficiency, and especially in the 90s. The Prius came out in the 2000's. The Hilux and Land Cruiser got terrible fuel economy. Their vehicles weren't terribly unsafe, but they didn't invent seat belts, or air bags, or abs, or stability control. They were a top manufacturer in terms of reliability and ease of repair.
- toomuchtodo 2y ago
  The history behind Toyota's hybrid synergy drive is very interesting, and shows how an innovator can turn into a laggard over time through institutional culture and inertia. Toyota felt they faced an existential crisis against US auto, blew past them in this market segment through legit innovation, and then missed the boat on EVs. A cautionary tale to stay curious. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hybrid_Synergy_Drive https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hybrid_Synergy_Drive https://yalebooks.yale.edu/2024/04/08/prius-politics-how-toyota-won-the-hybrid-car-market/ https://yalebooks.yale.edu/2024/04/08/prius-politics-how-toy... https://global.toyota/en/detail/20209700 https://global.toyota/en/detail/20209700
  - fbdab103 2y ago
    Cautionary tale? Some excerpts from Toyota's press page[0] - Toyota is projected to be the number one retail brand for the 12th consecutive year - Electrified vehicle sales – battery, hybrids, plug-ins and fuel cells – surge 30 percent and make up nearly one-third of total sales volume - Projected to be the number one seller of passenger vehicles for the 12th consecutive year, and 20 of the last 21 years - 2023 electrified vehicles sales of 565,800 represent 29.3 percent of total sales volume - Corolla projected to be the number one compact car in America - RAV4 best-selling SUV in the U.S. for 7th consecutive year You can also just look at Toyota stock killing it vs SPY[1] over the past year [0] https://pressroom.toyota.com/toyota-motor-north-america-reports-2023-u-s-sales-results/ https://pressroom.toyota.com/toyota-motor-north-america-repo... [1] https://www.google.com/finance/quote/TM:NYSE?window=1Y&comparison=NYSEARCA%3ASPY https://www.google.com/finance/quote/TM:NYSE?window=1Y&compa...
    - toomuchtodo 2y ago
      https://www.hagerty.com/media/news/the-worlds-best-selling-car-is-the-tesla-model-y/ https://www.hagerty.com/media/news/the-worlds-best-selling-c... (26 January 2024) > For the first time in history the most popular new car across the planet is electric. Tesla sold more than 1.2 million Model Ys in 2023 to put it ahead of Toyota’s RAV4 which had sales of 1.07 million and Corolla which found 1.01 million buyers. > Topping the charts in Europe and China enabled the Model Y to lead the field in total world sales, despite it sitting in only fifth place in the United States, behind the RAV4, Dodge Ram, Chevrolet Silverado and Ford F-Series. > Overall, more than 456,000 Model Ys were sold in China, representing a 45% increase on 2022, more than 255,000 Model Ys found homes in Europe, and almost 386,000 hit the road in the U.S.A. As a result the Model Y counted for two-thirds of all Teslas sold globally. https://cnevpost.com/2024/05/01/byd-sales-apr-2024/ https://cnevpost.com/2024/05/01/byd-sales-apr-2024/ (1 May 2024) > BYD (HKG: 1211, OTCMKTS: BYDDY) saw further sales growth last month, which continued to be the second highest on record. > The company sold 313,245 new energy-vehicles (NEVs) in April, up 48.96 percent from 210,295 in the same month last year and up 3.57 percent from 302,459 in March, according to figures it released today. (BYD has a 3.6M unit sales target for 2024, up 20% from last year) https://electrek.co/2024/01/30/toyota-sold-100k-evs-2023-less-than-1-of-sales/ https://electrek.co/2024/01/30/toyota-sold-100k-evs-2023-les... ("Although Toyota held its title as the top-selling automaker, the industry is shifting beneath it. Toyota sold over 100,000 EVs in 2023, but that’s still less than 1% of the record 11.2 million vehicles handed over last year.") Tesla and BYD combined sold a little under half of total Toyota global sales last year. The second half won’t take as long to get to.
      - toomuchtodo 2y ago
        Additional citation: https://electrek.co/2024/05/29/byds-workforce-nearly-doubles-toyotas-ev-sales-surge/ https://electrek.co/2024/05/29/byds-workforce-nearly-doubles... ("As EV sales surge in China, BYD’s workforce has expanded rapidly, adding nearly 500,000 employees since 2019. BYD’s workforce is now roughly double that of Toyota’s as China’s EV leader expands overseas.")
  - antisthenes 2y ago
    > and then missed the boat on EVs. Toyota shipped more in battery capacity in hybrids than every other car manufacturer in EVs, excluding pure EV manufacturers like Tesla/BYD. Are they lagging now? Sure, but hybrids are still the most sensible choice for people who don't have access to good charging infra.
    - deleted 2y ago
      [deleted]
    - toomuchtodo 2y ago
      > Toyota shipped more in battery capacity in hybrids than every other car manufacturer in EVs, excluding pure EV manufacturers like Tesla/BYD. You can always succeed if you define success. Combustion is combustion. EVs get cleaner as their local grid gets cleaner, hybrids burn fossil fuels their entire lifetime. Ergo, the solution is to focus on charging infra, not hybrids, if lacking infra is what is holding back full speed EV deployment and uptake. But Toyota is not good at building EVs or charging infra, so here we are.
lm28469 2y ago
Replacing the existing 1.4b ICE vehicles with 1.4b EVs won't do jack shit for the climate let's be honest. Personal cars are like 10% of global greenhouse emissions, lifecycle pollution of EVs is 1/3rd of ICE vehicles. If we really cared we'd have to completely change our lifestyle and not make these tiny end of chain adjustments
- antisthenes 2y ago
  Changing the infrastructure to accommodate a non-car centric lifestyle is probably going to be a lot more CO2 intensive than doing the cars. We're simply picking the easier option as a civilization (which might not help us achieve the end goals)
- natch 2y ago
  Self driving robotaxis will at least help keep car ownership from growing out of control. We can tackle a lot of the other 90% piece by piece. Cars are one piece. Still, petroleum and friends will not go away; they are needed in some cases.
infecto 2y ago
Toyota until most recent history has always been a laggard in terms of bleeding tech.

genter 2y ago

Toyota was never a top car manufacturer in terms of safety and efficiency, and especially in the 90s. The Prius came out in the 2000's. The Hilux and Land Cruiser got terrible fuel economy. Their vehicles weren't terribly unsafe, but they didn't invent seat belts, or air bags, or abs, or stability control. They were a top manufacturer in terms of reliability and ease of repair.

toomuchtodo 2y ago
The history behind Toyota's hybrid synergy drive is very interesting, and shows how an innovator can turn into a laggard over time through institutional culture and inertia. Toyota felt they faced an existential crisis against US auto, blew past them in this market segment through legit innovation, and then missed the boat on EVs. A cautionary tale to stay curious. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hybrid_Synergy_Drive https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hybrid_Synergy_Drive https://yalebooks.yale.edu/2024/04/08/prius-politics-how-toyota-won-the-hybrid-car-market/ https://yalebooks.yale.edu/2024/04/08/prius-politics-how-toy... https://global.toyota/en/detail/20209700 https://global.toyota/en/detail/20209700
- fbdab103 2y ago
  Cautionary tale? Some excerpts from Toyota's press page[0] - Toyota is projected to be the number one retail brand for the 12th consecutive year - Electrified vehicle sales – battery, hybrids, plug-ins and fuel cells – surge 30 percent and make up nearly one-third of total sales volume - Projected to be the number one seller of passenger vehicles for the 12th consecutive year, and 20 of the last 21 years - 2023 electrified vehicles sales of 565,800 represent 29.3 percent of total sales volume - Corolla projected to be the number one compact car in America - RAV4 best-selling SUV in the U.S. for 7th consecutive year You can also just look at Toyota stock killing it vs SPY[1] over the past year [0] https://pressroom.toyota.com/toyota-motor-north-america-reports-2023-u-s-sales-results/ https://pressroom.toyota.com/toyota-motor-north-america-repo... [1] https://www.google.com/finance/quote/TM:NYSE?window=1Y&comparison=NYSEARCA%3ASPY https://www.google.com/finance/quote/TM:NYSE?window=1Y&compa...
  - toomuchtodo 2y ago
    https://www.hagerty.com/media/news/the-worlds-best-selling-car-is-the-tesla-model-y/ https://www.hagerty.com/media/news/the-worlds-best-selling-c... (26 January 2024) > For the first time in history the most popular new car across the planet is electric. Tesla sold more than 1.2 million Model Ys in 2023 to put it ahead of Toyota’s RAV4 which had sales of 1.07 million and Corolla which found 1.01 million buyers. > Topping the charts in Europe and China enabled the Model Y to lead the field in total world sales, despite it sitting in only fifth place in the United States, behind the RAV4, Dodge Ram, Chevrolet Silverado and Ford F-Series. > Overall, more than 456,000 Model Ys were sold in China, representing a 45% increase on 2022, more than 255,000 Model Ys found homes in Europe, and almost 386,000 hit the road in the U.S.A. As a result the Model Y counted for two-thirds of all Teslas sold globally. https://cnevpost.com/2024/05/01/byd-sales-apr-2024/ https://cnevpost.com/2024/05/01/byd-sales-apr-2024/ (1 May 2024) > BYD (HKG: 1211, OTCMKTS: BYDDY) saw further sales growth last month, which continued to be the second highest on record. > The company sold 313,245 new energy-vehicles (NEVs) in April, up 48.96 percent from 210,295 in the same month last year and up 3.57 percent from 302,459 in March, according to figures it released today. (BYD has a 3.6M unit sales target for 2024, up 20% from last year) https://electrek.co/2024/01/30/toyota-sold-100k-evs-2023-less-than-1-of-sales/ https://electrek.co/2024/01/30/toyota-sold-100k-evs-2023-les... ("Although Toyota held its title as the top-selling automaker, the industry is shifting beneath it. Toyota sold over 100,000 EVs in 2023, but that’s still less than 1% of the record 11.2 million vehicles handed over last year.") Tesla and BYD combined sold a little under half of total Toyota global sales last year. The second half won’t take as long to get to.
    - toomuchtodo 2y ago
      Additional citation: https://electrek.co/2024/05/29/byds-workforce-nearly-doubles-toyotas-ev-sales-surge/ https://electrek.co/2024/05/29/byds-workforce-nearly-doubles... ("As EV sales surge in China, BYD’s workforce has expanded rapidly, adding nearly 500,000 employees since 2019. BYD’s workforce is now roughly double that of Toyota’s as China’s EV leader expands overseas.")
- antisthenes 2y ago
  > and then missed the boat on EVs. Toyota shipped more in battery capacity in hybrids than every other car manufacturer in EVs, excluding pure EV manufacturers like Tesla/BYD. Are they lagging now? Sure, but hybrids are still the most sensible choice for people who don't have access to good charging infra.
  - deleted 2y ago
    [deleted]
  - toomuchtodo 2y ago
    > Toyota shipped more in battery capacity in hybrids than every other car manufacturer in EVs, excluding pure EV manufacturers like Tesla/BYD. You can always succeed if you define success. Combustion is combustion. EVs get cleaner as their local grid gets cleaner, hybrids burn fossil fuels their entire lifetime. Ergo, the solution is to focus on charging infra, not hybrids, if lacking infra is what is holding back full speed EV deployment and uptake. But Toyota is not good at building EVs or charging infra, so here we are.

lm28469 2y ago

Replacing the existing 1.4b ICE vehicles with 1.4b EVs won't do jack shit for the climate let's be honest. Personal cars are like 10% of global greenhouse emissions, lifecycle pollution of EVs is 1/3rd of ICE vehicles. If we really cared we'd have to completely change our lifestyle and not make these tiny end of chain adjustments

antisthenes 2y ago
Changing the infrastructure to accommodate a non-car centric lifestyle is probably going to be a lot more CO2 intensive than doing the cars. We're simply picking the easier option as a civilization (which might not help us achieve the end goals)
natch 2y ago
Self driving robotaxis will at least help keep car ownership from growing out of control. We can tackle a lot of the other 90% piece by piece. Cars are one piece. Still, petroleum and friends will not go away; they are needed in some cases.

infecto 2y ago

Toyota until most recent history has always been a laggard in terms of bleeding tech.