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A similar thing has happened in France, where the government has restricted the rental of less energy efficient dwellings[0]. This is generally a good thing for

A similar thing has happened in France, where the government has restricted the rental of less energy efficient dwellings[0]. This is generally a good thing for the environment, but it has already had an effect on rental prices as those apartments are now taken off the market. The exact impact is a little hard to work out, because, at least in Paris, it's also coincided with apartment owners wanting to hold on to empty apartments to rent them for the Olympics rather than to locals. 0: https://www.connexionfrance.com/practical/timetable-for-new-energy-linked-restrictions-for-homes-in-france/199184#:~:text=From%20January%201%2C%202025%20rental,to%20250%20kWh%20per%20m%C2%B2 https://www.connexionfrance.com/practical/timetable-for-new-....

Rinzler89 2y ago
>apartment owners wanting to hold on to empty apartments to rent them for the Olympics rather than to locals. Sounds like something that can be fixed with laws. Edit: would you mind explaining your downvotes with arguments please? thanks.
- throwaway1105q 2y ago
  We're talking about France, fix the law too much and heads will roll, or at least cars burn.
  - Rinzler89 2y ago
    Why would people violently protest against taxing empty real-estate that's not occupied by locals? I'm not French but IMHO, Airbnb style short term renting for tourst purposes should come with hefty taxes because housing should always prioritize the locals who live, work, have families and pay taxes there, not wealthy foreigners on vacation.
    - throwaway1105q 2y ago
      Because it's the locals who own it, even if they live elsewhere in the city. It's probably their pension income. Flats are usually owned personally by small scale owners in Europe, it's not like the huge funds and corporations in US. They are not poor but also not rich, it's work even if it's rented long term, and a lot of work if short term.
      - Rinzler89 2y ago
        >It's probably their pension income Sucks for them I guess. Maybe they should have diversified and invested in stocks or bonds instead of going all-in in housing-for-rent "investment" and complaining it doesn't turn up to be a huge profit making scheme like they expected, and expect the government to cover their losses. Someone's housing shouldn't be someone else's for-profit side-hustle gamble. It's why housing is such a mess in the first place. You can't have housing be affordable AND provide hefty profit returns in private pockets at the same time. Those will always be in contradiction at odds with each other in capitalism. Honestly, I expected better from the socialist French, that they would have solved affordable housing for the masses.
        throwaway1105q 2y ago
        Your mistake is assuming France is socialist just because of its relatively generous welfare. It's actually neoliberal capitalism with strong preference for large corporations. And that's why this would lead to a protest or at least voting preference shift - it'd be taking one of the last remaining assets in the hands of the middle class.
        throwaway1105q 2y ago
        BTW one more point... Publicly traded companies in Europe are not as usual as in the US. It's mostly private equity here. You can't just buy stocks or bonds, it's either very high risk or very low yield.
      - jacknews 2y ago
        It's quite likely not ex-locals who own it, and in any case if they no longer live locally, they're not paying local taxes, or supporting local business. I agree, income from property should be heavily taxed, it's essentially private profit from the land value, and that value derives directly from it's location and the strength of the local economy, rather than any effort or contribution from the owner.
        throwaway1105q 2y ago
- dustincoates 2y ago
  I'm not sure it's something the government wants to or can fix. Many apartments that are being rented are those that house people otherwise, Paris being very well known for emptying out in July/August. For those that are being held back to rent, it can probably be hard to know what's the truth, "we didn't find a tenant" versus "we didn't want to find a tenant." Also, I think there's also a benefit to the government, as they want to have this empty short-term housing stock available for tourists coming in. A lot of money is being invested in the games, it's important to get the tourism money to make it profitable.
physicsguy 2y ago
That's also happened in the UK at the same time, but it's actually very difficult to bring many of the UK's pre-1930s households up to the minimum level without gutting the property and having it vacant for a period.

Rinzler89 2y ago

>apartment owners wanting to hold on to empty apartments to rent them for the Olympics rather than to locals. Sounds like something that can be fixed with laws. Edit: would you mind explaining your downvotes with arguments please? thanks.

throwaway1105q 2y ago
We're talking about France, fix the law too much and heads will roll, or at least cars burn.
- Rinzler89 2y ago
  Why would people violently protest against taxing empty real-estate that's not occupied by locals? I'm not French but IMHO, Airbnb style short term renting for tourst purposes should come with hefty taxes because housing should always prioritize the locals who live, work, have families and pay taxes there, not wealthy foreigners on vacation.
  - throwaway1105q 2y ago
    Because it's the locals who own it, even if they live elsewhere in the city. It's probably their pension income. Flats are usually owned personally by small scale owners in Europe, it's not like the huge funds and corporations in US. They are not poor but also not rich, it's work even if it's rented long term, and a lot of work if short term.
    - Rinzler89 2y ago
      >It's probably their pension income Sucks for them I guess. Maybe they should have diversified and invested in stocks or bonds instead of going all-in in housing-for-rent "investment" and complaining it doesn't turn up to be a huge profit making scheme like they expected, and expect the government to cover their losses. Someone's housing shouldn't be someone else's for-profit side-hustle gamble. It's why housing is such a mess in the first place. You can't have housing be affordable AND provide hefty profit returns in private pockets at the same time. Those will always be in contradiction at odds with each other in capitalism. Honestly, I expected better from the socialist French, that they would have solved affordable housing for the masses.
      - throwaway1105q 2y ago
        Your mistake is assuming France is socialist just because of its relatively generous welfare. It's actually neoliberal capitalism with strong preference for large corporations. And that's why this would lead to a protest or at least voting preference shift - it'd be taking one of the last remaining assets in the hands of the middle class.
      - throwaway1105q 2y ago
        BTW one more point... Publicly traded companies in Europe are not as usual as in the US. It's mostly private equity here. You can't just buy stocks or bonds, it's either very high risk or very low yield.
    - jacknews 2y ago
      It's quite likely not ex-locals who own it, and in any case if they no longer live locally, they're not paying local taxes, or supporting local business. I agree, income from property should be heavily taxed, it's essentially private profit from the land value, and that value derives directly from it's location and the strength of the local economy, rather than any effort or contribution from the owner.
      - throwaway1105q 2y ago
dustincoates 2y ago
I'm not sure it's something the government wants to or can fix. Many apartments that are being rented are those that house people otherwise, Paris being very well known for emptying out in July/August. For those that are being held back to rent, it can probably be hard to know what's the truth, "we didn't find a tenant" versus "we didn't want to find a tenant." Also, I think there's also a benefit to the government, as they want to have this empty short-term housing stock available for tourists coming in. A lot of money is being invested in the games, it's important to get the tourism money to make it profitable.

physicsguy 2y ago

That's also happened in the UK at the same time, but it's actually very difficult to bring many of the UK's pre-1930s households up to the minimum level without gutting the property and having it vacant for a period.