4 ms·

Yup, young people just need to be handed a framework. It would go something like this: you are poorer than your parents and your grandparents, but look - Jeff

Yup, young people just need to be handed a framework. It would go something like this: you are poorer than your parents and your grandparents, but look - Jeff Bezos made a rocket that can take rich people almost (but not quite) into space! Young people also need to be told there is no recession and the economy is booming. The fact that they are seeing none of this boom is their fault. Oh, and all the foreign wars that we are paying for instead are for a righteous cause.

smokel 2y ago
I think you misunderstand my point that there is no such framework. There used to be religion, tyranny, and some other fulfilling frameworks, but those no longer apply.
- ggddv 2y ago
  [dead]
- riehwvfbk 2y ago
  I don't know, certainly seems like this is one that's currently on offer: that the benevolent octogenarians (and you even get to pick one of two!) are all-knowing, and if you disagree, or think your experience doesn't match the story in the media - then you are wrong (and also an uneducated boob and should feel bad). This is a kind of religion - the aristocracy knows best.
Rinzler89 2y ago
> you are poorer than your parents and your grandparents Maybe only in the major rich developed western countries whose economies peaked in the post-WW2 boom, and then switched to profiting by fleecing their young in order to enrich the existing wealth holders (usually through horrible housing policies), but in most of the former undeveloped and underdeveloped parts of the world, average young people are now richer than their parents or grandparents ever could have dreamed of. Back in my home country a few decades ago, you would have to wait 10 years to be eligible to buy a commie crapbox car and vacationing would mean 1-2 times/year in some local village a few km away from home, and that's if you were lucky. Now some any young people can buy a car after saving a few months of wages and can afford to go on city breaks abroad in Lisbon, Barcelona or even Asia, something unthinkable to their parents. I think a lot of westerner from rich countries have forgotten what true depression inducing poverty and suffering actually feels like since 2-3 generations ago, hence why they can afford this luxury of being depressed over petty things and forget how good they actually have it: that happiness comes from having friends, family unit, health, safety, life experiences, and not from having bigger McMansions than your predecessors.
- musicale 2y ago
  Good things to remember. Forget McMansions though – a primary reason that many in the US feel poorer than their parents or grandparents is that, even with two incomes, they cannot afford to buy any house at all (even a townhouse or modest "starter" home) within 100 miles of their place of employment.
  - astrange 2y ago
    This is social media bias. Homeownership rates in the US are fine except in a few coastal areas, but those areas are where all the influencers and journalists live. Also, the US is extremely not in a recession and currently has the strongest economic performance in decades or ever. (Yes, for young people. And for poorer people most of all.) It was of course in a recession in 2008 and in 2020. But, /other English speaking countries are in recessions/, and their housing crises are worse than ours. Part of what's happening is that you're picking those posts up because they're in English and not realizing they're in London.
    - r2_pilot 2y ago
      I live in a somewhat rural area, and while I haven't gotten the house appraised recently, I talked to someone not too long ago and he said houses(really the land) are going for roughly 10x what I got it for (in 2001). I couldn't afford it if I wanted, now. But sure, home ownership is just fine, that's why I'm the only homeowner* in my peer group. (*technically in a trust, for me)
      - astrange 2y ago
        The reason homeownership is fine is that there was a burst of home purchases in 2021 right before interest rates went up, and the US has fixed rate mortgages. We know it's fine though because of national statistics, eg: https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2023/05/millennial-generation-financial-issues-income-homeowners/673485/ https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2023/05/millenn... > I couldn't afford it if I wanted, now. Sounds like you own it though. So you could afford an equally priced piece of land if you sell that one. Most people's houses are the largest component of their net worth, so it of course looks bad if you leave it out of the calculation. (This is why blocking housing construction is bad for the elderly though - it makes it hard to downsize so you can't use your housing net worth towards retirement as easily.) Other approaches which many people do include having your parents help with the down payment or inheriting. And of course land value tax would solve this. So would upzoning, which would allow 10x more productive use of the land.
xboxnolifes 2y ago
That's not a framework.
- aleph_minus_one 2y ago
  Why not?
  - xboxnolifes 2y ago
    It offers no potential actions to take in response to a person's position.

smokel 2y ago

I think you misunderstand my point that there is no such framework. There used to be religion, tyranny, and some other fulfilling frameworks, but those no longer apply.

ggddv 2y ago
[dead]
riehwvfbk 2y ago
I don't know, certainly seems like this is one that's currently on offer: that the benevolent octogenarians (and you even get to pick one of two!) are all-knowing, and if you disagree, or think your experience doesn't match the story in the media - then you are wrong (and also an uneducated boob and should feel bad). This is a kind of religion - the aristocracy knows best.

Rinzler89 2y ago

> you are poorer than your parents and your grandparents Maybe only in the major rich developed western countries whose economies peaked in the post-WW2 boom, and then switched to profiting by fleecing their young in order to enrich the existing wealth holders (usually through horrible housing policies), but in most of the former undeveloped and underdeveloped parts of the world, average young people are now richer than their parents or grandparents ever could have dreamed of. Back in my home country a few decades ago, you would have to wait 10 years to be eligible to buy a commie crapbox car and vacationing would mean 1-2 times/year in some local village a few km away from home, and that's if you were lucky. Now some any young people can buy a car after saving a few months of wages and can afford to go on city breaks abroad in Lisbon, Barcelona or even Asia, something unthinkable to their parents. I think a lot of westerner from rich countries have forgotten what true depression inducing poverty and suffering actually feels like since 2-3 generations ago, hence why they can afford this luxury of being depressed over petty things and forget how good they actually have it: that happiness comes from having friends, family unit, health, safety, life experiences, and not from having bigger McMansions than your predecessors.

musicale 2y ago
Good things to remember. Forget McMansions though – a primary reason that many in the US feel poorer than their parents or grandparents is that, even with two incomes, they cannot afford to buy any house at all (even a townhouse or modest "starter" home) within 100 miles of their place of employment.
- astrange 2y ago
  This is social media bias. Homeownership rates in the US are fine except in a few coastal areas, but those areas are where all the influencers and journalists live. Also, the US is extremely not in a recession and currently has the strongest economic performance in decades or ever. (Yes, for young people. And for poorer people most of all.) It was of course in a recession in 2008 and in 2020. But, /other English speaking countries are in recessions/, and their housing crises are worse than ours. Part of what's happening is that you're picking those posts up because they're in English and not realizing they're in London.
  - r2_pilot 2y ago
    I live in a somewhat rural area, and while I haven't gotten the house appraised recently, I talked to someone not too long ago and he said houses(really the land) are going for roughly 10x what I got it for (in 2001). I couldn't afford it if I wanted, now. But sure, home ownership is just fine, that's why I'm the only homeowner* in my peer group. (*technically in a trust, for me)
    - astrange 2y ago
      The reason homeownership is fine is that there was a burst of home purchases in 2021 right before interest rates went up, and the US has fixed rate mortgages. We know it's fine though because of national statistics, eg: https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2023/05/millennial-generation-financial-issues-income-homeowners/673485/ https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2023/05/millenn... > I couldn't afford it if I wanted, now. Sounds like you own it though. So you could afford an equally priced piece of land if you sell that one. Most people's houses are the largest component of their net worth, so it of course looks bad if you leave it out of the calculation. (This is why blocking housing construction is bad for the elderly though - it makes it hard to downsize so you can't use your housing net worth towards retirement as easily.) Other approaches which many people do include having your parents help with the down payment or inheriting. And of course land value tax would solve this. So would upzoning, which would allow 10x more productive use of the land.

xboxnolifes 2y ago

That's not a framework.

aleph_minus_one 2y ago
Why not?
- xboxnolifes 2y ago
  It offers no potential actions to take in response to a person's position.