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There was a peace deal before (Minsk agreement). Agreements with Russia are not worth the paper they're signed on. Any peace deal Putin is willing to sign is ju

by IsTom 2y ago

There was a peace deal before (Minsk agreement). Agreements with Russia are not worth the paper they're signed on. Any peace deal Putin is willing to sign is just to consolidate his gains and get more time to prepare for another attack.

GordonS 2y ago
[flagged]
- snowpid 2y ago
  There as no coup. Selensky won a free election against Poroshenko (you know the guy, who was after the maidan revolution). Just ask random Ukrainans.
  - GordonS 2y ago
    No coup? Perhaps you'd be more comfortable with the verbiage "CIA-backed uprising/revolution" then?
    - snowpid 2y ago
      I like to call it people's revolution. You can go to Ukraine and ask the people around what they think about the Euromaidan instead of reading conspiracy theories from Russian propaganda.
    - numpad0 2y ago
      It'll make interesting Hollywood movie, but not going to matter when it's Russia invading Ukraine. US is going to let both collapse then rebuild New Ukraine where it is, and it'll be 100% Western country because of that. Plus few more around. All because of Russian footgun.
- mopsi 2y ago
  There was no "CIA-backed coup" in Ukraine. A president that caved in to Russian pressure to back out of tighter economic relations with the EU saw massive protests in response, ordered to shoot protesters, killed over a hundred of them, and then fled the country when he understood that he would be facing criminal charges. Ukrainian parliament deposed him with votes 328-vs-0. Even members of his own party voted against him. The joint spy bases were established after Russia invaded Ukraine to monitor what's going on in the invaded parts of Ukraine. > I mean, imagine if Brazilian intelligence backed a coup in Mexico, then built several military bases, intelligence bases and black sites across the country, then used them against US interests. Would the US really put up with that? Should they? The hypocrisy is real. Imagine if the United States invaded Sonora and Baja California under the excuse that they're protecting Americans there, looted factories and other businesses, established concentration camps, tortured and executed anyone who resisted, forced millions to flee their homes as refugees and gave their property away to settlers from landlocked states of the US ("I've always wanted to live by the ocean!"), and started forcibly conscripting all Mexican males from Sonora and Baja California into fighting against the rest of Mexico. And imagine that you blamed Mexico and its allies like Brazil for propping up defenses along the remaining border. A bit insane, don't you think?
  - GordonS 2y ago
    There was indeed a CIA-backed uprising[0], and CIA bases were in Ukraine long before the 2022 Russian invasion. [0] https://www.realclearinvestigations.com/articles/2024/04/30/what_10_years_of_us_meddling_in_ukraine_have_wrought_spoiler_alert_it_wasnt_democracy_1027411.html https://www.realclearinvestigations.com/articles/2024/04/30/...
    - mopsi 2y ago
      No there wasn't, and the article you linked is from one of those bottom-feeders who keeps circulating long-debunked anti-American conspiracy theories. And the NYT article you linked earlier says that CIA provided instructors for Ukrainian commandos in 2016, which is two years AFTER Russia invaded Crimea and Donbas in 2014. 2022 was only a renewed assault on Ukraine.
- vladms 2y ago
  The thing is he planned an invasion for a long time, and failed quite badly at it - the first weeks there was barely any aid to Ukraine and still Ukrainians managed to push the Russians back. This is not that much about US or Russia interests, but about Ukrainians and they are currently fighting the Russians for 2 years. Implying they have no choice or they are only manipulated seems more like propaganda (will let the reader decide for whom). Many east Europeans still have memories about what it meant to be under Russian influence and oh boy that was shitty... No need for propaganda there. US and Russia made aggression wars, but while they imagine they are "world powers" they don't seem to have a great track record unless the population in that country does not firmly oppose (just the most obvious examples: Afghanistan - couple of times each, Vietnam, Ukraine)
- JKCalhoun 2y ago
  > I mean, imagine if Brazilian intelligence backed a coup in Mexico, then built several military bases, intelligence bases and black sites across the country, then used them against US interests. So you're saying the US would invade Mexico in that case?
  - GordonS 2y ago
    You honestly don't think they would? Mexican passports carelessly left at the site of a "terror attack" should provide all the cover they need. More likely though, they'd destroy the country in a more surreptitious way, such as funding drug cartels and revolutionaries.

by IsTom 2y ago

GordonS 2y ago

[flagged]

snowpid 2y ago
There as no coup. Selensky won a free election against Poroshenko (you know the guy, who was after the maidan revolution). Just ask random Ukrainans.
- GordonS 2y ago
  No coup? Perhaps you'd be more comfortable with the verbiage "CIA-backed uprising/revolution" then?
  - snowpid 2y ago
    I like to call it people's revolution. You can go to Ukraine and ask the people around what they think about the Euromaidan instead of reading conspiracy theories from Russian propaganda.
  - numpad0 2y ago
    It'll make interesting Hollywood movie, but not going to matter when it's Russia invading Ukraine. US is going to let both collapse then rebuild New Ukraine where it is, and it'll be 100% Western country because of that. Plus few more around. All because of Russian footgun.
mopsi 2y ago
There was no "CIA-backed coup" in Ukraine. A president that caved in to Russian pressure to back out of tighter economic relations with the EU saw massive protests in response, ordered to shoot protesters, killed over a hundred of them, and then fled the country when he understood that he would be facing criminal charges. Ukrainian parliament deposed him with votes 328-vs-0. Even members of his own party voted against him. The joint spy bases were established after Russia invaded Ukraine to monitor what's going on in the invaded parts of Ukraine. > I mean, imagine if Brazilian intelligence backed a coup in Mexico, then built several military bases, intelligence bases and black sites across the country, then used them against US interests. Would the US really put up with that? Should they? The hypocrisy is real. Imagine if the United States invaded Sonora and Baja California under the excuse that they're protecting Americans there, looted factories and other businesses, established concentration camps, tortured and executed anyone who resisted, forced millions to flee their homes as refugees and gave their property away to settlers from landlocked states of the US ("I've always wanted to live by the ocean!"), and started forcibly conscripting all Mexican males from Sonora and Baja California into fighting against the rest of Mexico. And imagine that you blamed Mexico and its allies like Brazil for propping up defenses along the remaining border. A bit insane, don't you think?
- GordonS 2y ago
  There was indeed a CIA-backed uprising[0], and CIA bases were in Ukraine long before the 2022 Russian invasion. [0] https://www.realclearinvestigations.com/articles/2024/04/30/what_10_years_of_us_meddling_in_ukraine_have_wrought_spoiler_alert_it_wasnt_democracy_1027411.html https://www.realclearinvestigations.com/articles/2024/04/30/...
  - mopsi 2y ago
    No there wasn't, and the article you linked is from one of those bottom-feeders who keeps circulating long-debunked anti-American conspiracy theories. And the NYT article you linked earlier says that CIA provided instructors for Ukrainian commandos in 2016, which is two years AFTER Russia invaded Crimea and Donbas in 2014. 2022 was only a renewed assault on Ukraine.
vladms 2y ago
The thing is he planned an invasion for a long time, and failed quite badly at it - the first weeks there was barely any aid to Ukraine and still Ukrainians managed to push the Russians back. This is not that much about US or Russia interests, but about Ukrainians and they are currently fighting the Russians for 2 years. Implying they have no choice or they are only manipulated seems more like propaganda (will let the reader decide for whom). Many east Europeans still have memories about what it meant to be under Russian influence and oh boy that was shitty... No need for propaganda there. US and Russia made aggression wars, but while they imagine they are "world powers" they don't seem to have a great track record unless the population in that country does not firmly oppose (just the most obvious examples: Afghanistan - couple of times each, Vietnam, Ukraine)
JKCalhoun 2y ago
> I mean, imagine if Brazilian intelligence backed a coup in Mexico, then built several military bases, intelligence bases and black sites across the country, then used them against US interests. So you're saying the US would invade Mexico in that case?
- GordonS 2y ago
  You honestly don't think they would? Mexican passports carelessly left at the site of a "terror attack" should provide all the cover they need. More likely though, they'd destroy the country in a more surreptitious way, such as funding drug cartels and revolutionaries.