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Technological progress is still about building the future we saw in Sci-Fi, it's just that sci-fi has become increasingly dystopian. Parts of Black Mirror, The

Technological progress is still about building the future we saw in Sci-Fi, it's just that sci-fi has become increasingly dystopian. Parts of Black Mirror, The Diamond Age, Her, Children of Men, Upload, Don't Look Up, The Day After Tomorrow, etc have all made it into reality. Note that sci-fi goes through cycles. The optimistic Star Trek or Jetsons future was a product of the 1950s and 1960s, when people were generally pretty optimistic. 30s/40s sci-fi is Brave New World and 1984, which is a decidedly different vibe (and also came true in many ways).

brigadier132 2y ago
This argument is so tired. You bring up "Her", do you not realize in star trek Data had romantic interests? The tech in those books is not what makes them dystopian and the reason those books have dystopian themes is because stories require conflict to be interesting. The tech is just a cool veneer.
- TeMPOraL 2y ago
  > the reason those books have dystopian themes is because stories require conflict to be interesting. The tech is just a cool veneer. No, that's just an excuse for lazy writing. And if our stories are predominantly this basic, it's hard to create a future that's better.
  - brigadier132 2y ago
    > our stories are predominantly this basic they are unfortunately
godelski 2y ago
I think you're oversimplifying and dismissing the issue. > have all made it into reality. I don't like this. It sounds like you're saying it is we who are intentionally creating this dystopian world. Or that we build this because this is what Hollywood shows us. One sounds like we're all evil (maybe we are), and the other sounds like a conspiracy. > Note that sci-fi goes through cycles. Saying it goes in cycles dismisses the aspect that we are the ones in control. And let's be honest, we're the nerds, it doesn't matter what mainstream sci-fi is in vogue. It matters what we watch and what we're trying to create. All things "go through cycles" and that's not a meaningful thing to note. It is dismissive of the causal factors and as if we are subject to fate. The future and world is in our hands. We are the creators and masters of our future, our society, our culture. It is not father time nor are our thoughts and dreams controlled by others. You can argue that our capacity to make those dreams a reality are, but not the dreams themselves. I want to add more context to my previous statement. Antoine de Saint Exupéry once said If you want to build a ship, don't drum up people to collect wood and don't assign them tasks and work, but rather teach them to long for the endless immensity of the sea. What I'm saying is we've lost this longing. We've lost this dream. And thus, we stopped building ships.
- ryandrake 2y ago
  We've also lost the willingness to push back on stupid/evil ideas. I thought software engineers had options! We're in demand! We can pick and choose and find a company doing good! At least that's what HN tells me. Yet, when Bossman tells us "Go build the Torment Nexus" we say "Well, I guess I have no choice! Bossman told me to do it, and he's the one paying me!" And we go off and build the Torment Nexus (or Social Media) and the world is worse off for it.
  - godelski 2y ago
    Yeah this is odd to me too. Not I think we should be clear that it doesn't matter if we're in demand or not[0]. You always have a choice to not build the Torment Nexus. Sometimes it's harder than not. You might not know what you're building (you can always turn back when/if you find out). Some things aren't worth the money and it's important to always remember there are other ways to make money. You may be a cog in a machine, but all cogs serve a vital role, even when there is redundancy. People forget that without our labor (whoever "we" are and what "labor" we do), the Tournament Nexus can't be built. But the trouble with the Tournament Nexus is that sometimes it's built without anyone actually intending to build it. It's more important that we remember this and stay vigilant. That we don't always dismiss others who say it's being built. No one likes to hear that because they think it means someone is claiming they're doing it purposefully. But did we also forget that the path to Hell is paved with good intentions? And that's what needs to be remembered, that evil is often built by people trying to do good. [0] clearly we are though since it's our labor that created the wealth of the wealthiest people and businesses.

brigadier132 2y ago

This argument is so tired. You bring up "Her", do you not realize in star trek Data had romantic interests? The tech in those books is not what makes them dystopian and the reason those books have dystopian themes is because stories require conflict to be interesting. The tech is just a cool veneer.

TeMPOraL 2y ago
> the reason those books have dystopian themes is because stories require conflict to be interesting. The tech is just a cool veneer. No, that's just an excuse for lazy writing. And if our stories are predominantly this basic, it's hard to create a future that's better.
- brigadier132 2y ago
  > our stories are predominantly this basic they are unfortunately

godelski 2y ago

I think you're oversimplifying and dismissing the issue. > have all made it into reality. I don't like this. It sounds like you're saying it is we who are intentionally creating this dystopian world. Or that we build this because this is what Hollywood shows us. One sounds like we're all evil (maybe we are), and the other sounds like a conspiracy. > Note that sci-fi goes through cycles. Saying it goes in cycles dismisses the aspect that we are the ones in control. And let's be honest, we're the nerds, it doesn't matter what mainstream sci-fi is in vogue. It matters what we watch and what we're trying to create. All things "go through cycles" and that's not a meaningful thing to note. It is dismissive of the causal factors and as if we are subject to fate. The future and world is in our hands. We are the creators and masters of our future, our society, our culture. It is not father time nor are our thoughts and dreams controlled by others. You can argue that our capacity to make those dreams a reality are, but not the dreams themselves. I want to add more context to my previous statement. Antoine de Saint Exupéry once said If you want to build a ship, don't drum up people to collect wood and don't assign them tasks and work, but rather teach them to long for the endless immensity of the sea. What I'm saying is we've lost this longing. We've lost this dream. And thus, we stopped building ships.

ryandrake 2y ago
We've also lost the willingness to push back on stupid/evil ideas. I thought software engineers had options! We're in demand! We can pick and choose and find a company doing good! At least that's what HN tells me. Yet, when Bossman tells us "Go build the Torment Nexus" we say "Well, I guess I have no choice! Bossman told me to do it, and he's the one paying me!" And we go off and build the Torment Nexus (or Social Media) and the world is worse off for it.
- godelski 2y ago
  Yeah this is odd to me too. Not I think we should be clear that it doesn't matter if we're in demand or not[0]. You always have a choice to not build the Torment Nexus. Sometimes it's harder than not. You might not know what you're building (you can always turn back when/if you find out). Some things aren't worth the money and it's important to always remember there are other ways to make money. You may be a cog in a machine, but all cogs serve a vital role, even when there is redundancy. People forget that without our labor (whoever "we" are and what "labor" we do), the Tournament Nexus can't be built. But the trouble with the Tournament Nexus is that sometimes it's built without anyone actually intending to build it. It's more important that we remember this and stay vigilant. That we don't always dismiss others who say it's being built. No one likes to hear that because they think it means someone is claiming they're doing it purposefully. But did we also forget that the path to Hell is paved with good intentions? And that's what needs to be remembered, that evil is often built by people trying to do good. [0] clearly we are though since it's our labor that created the wealth of the wealthiest people and businesses.