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> Just because we became self-aware doesnt make us any more special. Disagree - I'd say we are special in that we have enough self-awareness to develop technol

> Just because we became self-aware doesnt make us any more special. Disagree - I'd say we are special in that we have enough self-awareness to develop technology to destroy the ecosystem our existence depends on, but not enough to stop ourselves from doing it.

cess11 2y ago
Don't need any self-awareness for that. Might want to look into how we got the oxygen atmosphere for an example.
- mistermann 2y ago
  Self-awareness may play a role in determining the truth of the matter.
  - jajko 2y ago
    Sure it does, but it still doesn't make us anyhow magical beings suddenly transcending cycle of life and death, when all out ancestors and other even quite smart beings don't / didn't for whatever illogical reasons. We just desperately wish for it to be so, because the concept of permanent death is fucking terrifying, for everybody. We may still be mentally on a level of bacteria compared to maximum intelligence obtainable in this universe, so self-awareness may not be such a huge milestone some here think it is. A bit of humility about ourselves would serve us well.
    - mistermann 2y ago
      > Sure it does, but it still doesn't make us anyhow magical beings suddenly transcending cycle of life and death... Agreed, hence I made no such claim. But a lack of it may render one unable to wonder what is true, and that may play some role in whether we can do anything about climate change. Like, I don't expect too much of it from the stereotypical Trump supporter, but I now no longer expect it of anyone. > ...when all out ancestors and other even quite smart beings don't / didn't for whatever illogical reasons. It would seem the power of science is required to destroy the Earth's ecosystem (religion is only adequate to kill people within the ecosystem, and then only sometimes), and as it turns out it took a while for it to overcome religion. But boy once it did, it didn't take long to fuck things up...with zero responsibility to boot (credit where credit is due: good artists copy, great artists steal). > We just desperately wish for it to be so, because the concept of permanent death is fucking terrifying, for everybody. If wishes were horses, beggars would ride! And wishing (story telling, etc) seems to be our main skill when it comes to certain topics. > We may still be mentally on a level of bacteria compared to maximum intelligence obtainable in this universe, so self-awareness may not be such a huge milestone some here think it is. A bit of humility about ourselves would serve us well. 100% agree with the second sentence, but do the two sentences not directly contradict each other?? I think we must have our wires crossed somehow.

cess11 2y ago

Don't need any self-awareness for that. Might want to look into how we got the oxygen atmosphere for an example.

mistermann 2y ago
Self-awareness may play a role in determining the truth of the matter.
- jajko 2y ago
  Sure it does, but it still doesn't make us anyhow magical beings suddenly transcending cycle of life and death, when all out ancestors and other even quite smart beings don't / didn't for whatever illogical reasons. We just desperately wish for it to be so, because the concept of permanent death is fucking terrifying, for everybody. We may still be mentally on a level of bacteria compared to maximum intelligence obtainable in this universe, so self-awareness may not be such a huge milestone some here think it is. A bit of humility about ourselves would serve us well.
  - mistermann 2y ago
    > Sure it does, but it still doesn't make us anyhow magical beings suddenly transcending cycle of life and death... Agreed, hence I made no such claim. But a lack of it may render one unable to wonder what is true, and that may play some role in whether we can do anything about climate change. Like, I don't expect too much of it from the stereotypical Trump supporter, but I now no longer expect it of anyone. > ...when all out ancestors and other even quite smart beings don't / didn't for whatever illogical reasons. It would seem the power of science is required to destroy the Earth's ecosystem (religion is only adequate to kill people within the ecosystem, and then only sometimes), and as it turns out it took a while for it to overcome religion. But boy once it did, it didn't take long to fuck things up...with zero responsibility to boot (credit where credit is due: good artists copy, great artists steal). > We just desperately wish for it to be so, because the concept of permanent death is fucking terrifying, for everybody. If wishes were horses, beggars would ride! And wishing (story telling, etc) seems to be our main skill when it comes to certain topics. > We may still be mentally on a level of bacteria compared to maximum intelligence obtainable in this universe, so self-awareness may not be such a huge milestone some here think it is. A bit of humility about ourselves would serve us well. 100% agree with the second sentence, but do the two sentences not directly contradict each other?? I think we must have our wires crossed somehow.