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You mean the ex who was in a bitter custody battle at the time of the death, whose own sister testified against her? The same one whose parents called him to pi

You mean the ex who was in a bitter custody battle at the time of the death, whose own sister testified against her? The same one whose parents called him to pick up the child the night before she died? Doesn’t sound like a family that thought he was a child-beating monster. She had no neck trauma when she died. CT scans showed a single blunt impact to the back right of her head, consistent with a fall and strange for a beating. More than all of that, the medical evidence doesn’t even look like she died from the blunt force trauma. She showed up to the ER blue lips, a telltale sign of hypoxia. She had severe undiagnosed viral pneumonia, despite having been to the doctor because we didn’t look at the strain until COVID. Pneumonia impacts breathing function. On top of that, she was prescribed phenergan, an opioid that now carries a warning not to prescribe it to children _because it can make them stop breathing_. On top of that, the day before she died she was prescribed codeine, which now also carries a warning label not to prescribe it to respiratory-depressed children _because it can make them stop breathing_. Lab results show what we now know to be a fatal dose of Phenergan. She died, sadly, as a result of multiple respiratory depressing factors due to a societal failure to ensure medications were safe for children in her situation. The blunt trauma isn’t even relevant; the phenergan and pneumonia would have killed her anyways. This is just the usual villification of an easy target: he’s poor and autistic, he was never going to look good to a jury. They probably could have gotten a conviction for murdering Amelia Earhart if they’d tried.

lupusreal 2y ago
> You mean the ex who was in a bitter custody battle at the time of the death If her allegations are true, then being in a bitter custody dispute would be the moral and responsible position to take. Anyway, was her sister there?
- everforward 2y ago
  Neither of them was there, the ex testified that she had seen him yell and shake the child at _other times_. Her sister testified that she had seen never seen that kind of behavior. Also, if the ex's allegations are true, why the hell would her grandparents call him to demand that he pick her up that night? She was supposed to be at her maternal grandparents that night, they called him. Why not call the baby's mom? Why not just keep the baby anyways? Why not take it to the hospital themselves if they were concerned? I'm not disparaging them for deciding to break up, nor for being in a custody dispute. These things happen. I just don't trust either party in a custody dispute; people get very emotional and the ends start to justify the means. If she is lying, it would be far from the first time false abuse allegations were made in a custody dispute. I defer to facts here. There were no medical indications of abuse, nor any direct evidence of abuse of any kind. The child had pneumonia, a lethal dose of opioids, and hypoxia at the hospital. The likely biased testimony of an ex doesn't negate any of that.
  - lupusreal 2y ago
    > she had seen him yell and shake the child at _other times_ Which she was there for... Her sister never seeing that means nothing. Being in a custody dispute also means nothing; it's a wash between "she would lie because she was fighting for custody" and "she was fighting for custody because she wasn't lying". I think it can neither lend nor detract from her credibility, so we're left with default credibility of an eye witness. And although eye witness testimony often fumbles details like the order of events, I think seeing somebody shake a baby is probably pretty credible testimony; not something that could be innocently mistaken. If it really didn't happen then she's essentially attempting to murder him using the courts. Assuming it did happen several other times, it was probably going to happen again and each time it happens is another round of Russian Roulette. You can get lucky once, or even a few times, but somebody who shakes a baby on several different occasions is very likely to eventually kill that baby.
    - everforward 2y ago
      You're welcome to believe whatever you want, but no, eyewitness testimony is not very credible. Go look up Aaron Scheerhorn; 6 eyewitnesses testified that he stabbed someone to death in public and he was convicted... right up until they did DNA tests. Or look at the Satanic Panic [1]. ~12,000 people made allegations that they were involved in some kind of satanic abuse or ritual, and police haven't found any evidence for any of them. Several claimed that they watched someone die, and then it turns out that person is still alive. Eyewitnesses are wrong in far more significant ways than misordering events. Psychology studies have repeatedly shown that it is trivial to implant memories in eyewitnesses, and that eyewitness recall accuracy floats around 85% even for events they did actually see. Seriously, Google it. There are hundreds of cases made on eyewitness testimony that were later overturned by direct evidence like DNA, it's not hard to find one. She may not even be lying, just wrong. Even presuming "default credibility of an eyewitness", that's a very, very low standard of evidence. ChatGPT will answer you correctly more often than eyewitnesses recall things correctly. 1: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Satanic_panic https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Satanic_panic
    - giantg2 2y ago
- giantg2 2y ago
  That's one of many possible reasons. Many custody issues are financial in nature due to the way the government mandates support, divides assets, etc. Then there's stuff like wrongful death suits. So there could be other motives. That's why the evidence is so important.
devilbunny 2y ago
Promethazine (Phenergan) is not an opioid. It is sedating, and a respiratory depressant by the same anticholinergic mechanism as diphenhydramine (Benadryl). This doesn’t mean it’s benign in all cases, but do try for accuracy.
- everforward 2y ago
  You are absolutely right, I misread the subject of an aside in the article. I’ll see if I can edit my comment, but I appreciate the correction either way. Edit: I can’t, hopefully this will float up so people see it.
  - devilbunny 2y ago
    To err is human. No sin there. Plenty of opioid users like it to potentiate the effects, so you’re not too far off base.
thaumasiotes 2y ago
> Pneumonia impacts breathing function. Side note, but I recently had pneumonia, and while I got a large number of terrible symptoms, my breathing wasn't impacted.

lupusreal 2y ago

> You mean the ex who was in a bitter custody battle at the time of the death If her allegations are true, then being in a bitter custody dispute would be the moral and responsible position to take. Anyway, was her sister there?

everforward 2y ago
Neither of them was there, the ex testified that she had seen him yell and shake the child at _other times_. Her sister testified that she had seen never seen that kind of behavior. Also, if the ex's allegations are true, why the hell would her grandparents call him to demand that he pick her up that night? She was supposed to be at her maternal grandparents that night, they called him. Why not call the baby's mom? Why not just keep the baby anyways? Why not take it to the hospital themselves if they were concerned? I'm not disparaging them for deciding to break up, nor for being in a custody dispute. These things happen. I just don't trust either party in a custody dispute; people get very emotional and the ends start to justify the means. If she is lying, it would be far from the first time false abuse allegations were made in a custody dispute. I defer to facts here. There were no medical indications of abuse, nor any direct evidence of abuse of any kind. The child had pneumonia, a lethal dose of opioids, and hypoxia at the hospital. The likely biased testimony of an ex doesn't negate any of that.
- lupusreal 2y ago
  > she had seen him yell and shake the child at _other times_ Which she was there for... Her sister never seeing that means nothing. Being in a custody dispute also means nothing; it's a wash between "she would lie because she was fighting for custody" and "she was fighting for custody because she wasn't lying". I think it can neither lend nor detract from her credibility, so we're left with default credibility of an eye witness. And although eye witness testimony often fumbles details like the order of events, I think seeing somebody shake a baby is probably pretty credible testimony; not something that could be innocently mistaken. If it really didn't happen then she's essentially attempting to murder him using the courts. Assuming it did happen several other times, it was probably going to happen again and each time it happens is another round of Russian Roulette. You can get lucky once, or even a few times, but somebody who shakes a baby on several different occasions is very likely to eventually kill that baby.
  - everforward 2y ago
    You're welcome to believe whatever you want, but no, eyewitness testimony is not very credible. Go look up Aaron Scheerhorn; 6 eyewitnesses testified that he stabbed someone to death in public and he was convicted... right up until they did DNA tests. Or look at the Satanic Panic [1]. ~12,000 people made allegations that they were involved in some kind of satanic abuse or ritual, and police haven't found any evidence for any of them. Several claimed that they watched someone die, and then it turns out that person is still alive. Eyewitnesses are wrong in far more significant ways than misordering events. Psychology studies have repeatedly shown that it is trivial to implant memories in eyewitnesses, and that eyewitness recall accuracy floats around 85% even for events they did actually see. Seriously, Google it. There are hundreds of cases made on eyewitness testimony that were later overturned by direct evidence like DNA, it's not hard to find one. She may not even be lying, just wrong. Even presuming "default credibility of an eyewitness", that's a very, very low standard of evidence. ChatGPT will answer you correctly more often than eyewitnesses recall things correctly. 1: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Satanic_panic https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Satanic_panic
  - giantg2 2y ago
giantg2 2y ago
That's one of many possible reasons. Many custody issues are financial in nature due to the way the government mandates support, divides assets, etc. Then there's stuff like wrongful death suits. So there could be other motives. That's why the evidence is so important.

devilbunny 2y ago

Promethazine (Phenergan) is not an opioid. It is sedating, and a respiratory depressant by the same anticholinergic mechanism as diphenhydramine (Benadryl). This doesn’t mean it’s benign in all cases, but do try for accuracy.

everforward 2y ago
You are absolutely right, I misread the subject of an aside in the article. I’ll see if I can edit my comment, but I appreciate the correction either way. Edit: I can’t, hopefully this will float up so people see it.
- devilbunny 2y ago
  To err is human. No sin there. Plenty of opioid users like it to potentiate the effects, so you’re not too far off base.

thaumasiotes 2y ago

> Pneumonia impacts breathing function. Side note, but I recently had pneumonia, and while I got a large number of terrible symptoms, my breathing wasn't impacted.