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It’s human nature: people see others achieve what they cannot, and try to pull them down. You see this wrt Musk on this site a lot, too.

• sanderjd 2y ago
  It has nothing to do with this. There are many successful people and businesses that I admire, and a number of notable examples of those I do not. The two your comment mentions are simply part of that latter group. I think for good reason. (But of course I would think that...)
  • ein0p 2y ago
    I’m not talking about you specifically here. What you’re saying could be true for you, and not true for the community as a whole. With the benefit of experience, I can tell for certain there’s (on average) a strong undercurrent of jealousy against people perceived as overly ambitious, particularly if they are successful in their ambitions. This is not specific to this site, of course, or even to the tech community in general.
    • sanderjd 2y ago
      You're right that it could be the case. But I disagree that it is likely to be, in this specific case, and the other specific case you cited. I think many people distrust and dislike Altman and Musk in particular because of their own specific behavior. Some people are hated because people are just jealous, but other people use that as an umbrella excuse to deflect blowback from their behavior that they entirely deserve. I believe this is one of those latter cases.
      • ein0p 2y ago
        But you don’t even know what their behavior really is. What you do know is the narrative created by fake news media mostly. At best it’s lies by omission, at worst - outright smears and fabrications. Idk much about Altman, but people who worked with Musk hold him in very high regard and say he’s the real deal. Yet if you go by the narratives you’d think the exact opposite
        • TheAmazingRace 2y ago
          I don't know about you, but judging by what Elon says in his social media posts, I'm going to assume that the people who worked with Musk are poor judges of character. Or these same people happen to have a ton of TSLA stock or some other vested interest in Elon, so kissing his ass is good for their bottom line.
          • ein0p 2y ago
            I don’t care what he says. Last I checked he’s free to say whatever he likes. Attempts to police the speech of others should be no more socially acceptable than farting in a crowded elevator. I care what he actually accomplishes. If his being a little unhinged leads to greater accomplishments, that’s a worthwhile tradeoff in my book.
            • sanderjd 2y ago
              Judging people for their behavior is not "policing the speech of others". The hilarious thing about this line of reasoning is that I am saying "that thing he said is not acceptable to me" and people like you say "that thing you said about that thing he said is not acceptable to me". The pattern here is "saying X is not acceptable to me", just different values of X. If what I'm doing is policing his speech, and that isn't acceptable to you, then what you're doing is policing my speech, which also shouldn't be acceptable to you. A paradox? No, not at all, because the resolution of this paradox is just: Nobody here is policing anybody's speech. Everyone is just expressing their own opinions, in a completely normal way. I'm free to care about how people behave, and not just what they accomplish. And you're free both to not care about that, and also to judge people who do care. All of these streets go two ways!
              • ein0p 2y ago
                Do you think there’s more to “behavior” than just speech?
                • 2y ago
    • Repulsion9513 2y ago
      That may be true, but you specifically said "on this site" and now you're saying "this is not specific to this site". And no, the vast majority of people "try[ing] to pull them down" to Musk are doing it because he's an egotistical hypocritical whiny jackass.
• goatlover 2y ago
  That was what Elizabeth Holmes claimed as well, however, we know that some people who try to achieve greatness are grifters. A pithy saying doesn’t change that reality.
  • ein0p 2y ago
    You can’t seriously claim there’s any equivalence between Altman/Musk and Holmes. The former two have something to show for their ambition, Holmes was basically a fraud with no substance behind her whatsoever
    • goatlover 2y ago
      I'm not comparing the products, I'm criticizing the statement that people are just jealously trying to bring down those who attempt to achieve greatness. Also, you can have a great product and still do ethically and legally questionable things that people will criticize.
    • johnnyanmac 2y ago
      So it's okay to commit fradulous acts if "you have something to show for it"? Even if Altman was a good person, they are the face of a company that is doing some very suspicious actions. Actions that got the company cooked in litigation. So those consequences will assossiate with that face, consequences for not following robots.txt, for trying to ask forgiveness over permission against other large companies, and now this whole kerfuffle.