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Presumes the purpose of going to school is to be crammed full of facts. But you also learn to write, express yourself, solve problems, use facts that you curre

Presumes the purpose of going to school is to be crammed full of facts. But you also learn to write, express yourself, solve problems, use facts that you currently know to some purpose, encounter ideas and subjects you would not have otherwise, socialise, etc. I do agree that the emphasis people place on facts is misguided. It just happens to be easier to test facts, so a lot of schooling is oriented around them. My son just complained that he did a maths problem, got the correct answer using a simpler method than the one the teacher was looking for, and got zero points, because he didn't use the approved method. In my world, he exhibited great thinking. In school world he didn't do what makes it easy for them to give him a mark.

isaacfrond 2y ago
In my own time as a high school student, I would come up with alternative solutions all the time. I'd always get full marks, though sometimes I'd have to explain it to the teacher afterwards. Recently, I did the same test as my daughter did, who is now in high school. It was a bet kind of thing. So anyway, after doing the exam, I figured I'd have 9 out of 10 marks. I though t I'd lose some marks for some clumsy arithmetic, but it went pretty well (I thought). So my daughter then grades my test and carefully explains that maybe I might just have a passing grade (6 out of 10). Ok. whatever. That can't be right. So she takes my test to the teacher to have her grade it as well. The teacher's verdict: clearly, easily, a failing grade. Maybe 4 out of 10 marks. Turns out getting the right answer in a clever way counts for nothing. What you are being tested on is: can you reproduce the algorithm we are teaching you in school. As I solved most of the problems in a different manner, I consequently got almost none of the marks. I suppose, that if you know and accept this, then you can accept the result as well. It's disappointing I guess, but certainly it makes math more accessible. I suppose there are pros and cons. Your son wasn't tested on cleverly getting the right answer. The test was: can you reproduce this algorithm. He couldn't.
- MattPalmer1086 2y ago
  Well, the test did not specify that a particular method should be used. It just asked for the student to calculate the answer and show the working (which he did). He knows the "correct" way of doing it too, and could have done it if instructed to. He has other ridiculous examples, e.g. a question that asked what reason might explain why people were smoking less. He gave a perfectly good answer (better awareness of the risks), it just wasn't the "approved" fact they were looking for. It was somewhat like this when I was at school, but it's much worse now. No thought, even correct answers with working not accepted. Sometimes you just have to guess what the approved fact you are supposed to regurgitate is.
- sanderjd 2y ago
  I think both things have value, though. Finding the correct answers in creative ways is awesome, of course, and should be encouraged. But it's also good to learn the specific approaches to finding answers that they are specifically teaching. It's just two different things, which are both valuable. For instance, my daughter (kindergarten) has been learning how to do addition and subtraction by "finding tens" and also with fives, and also / relatedly by thinking about hops on a number line, and combining them in different ways. And if she gets the right answer, but without using the technique being taught at that time, then she is redirected back to the intended technique. And I think that makes sense, when teaching a particular technique! I often hear people complain about this style of answering arithmetic questions - "what's wrong with adding up columns and carrying tens?" - and I think they should learn that algorithm too, but I think it's valuable to learn multiple techniques, the techniques themselves that is, in addition to just being able to get the right answers in whatever way you choose.

isaacfrond 2y ago

In my own time as a high school student, I would come up with alternative solutions all the time. I'd always get full marks, though sometimes I'd have to explain it to the teacher afterwards. Recently, I did the same test as my daughter did, who is now in high school. It was a bet kind of thing. So anyway, after doing the exam, I figured I'd have 9 out of 10 marks. I though t I'd lose some marks for some clumsy arithmetic, but it went pretty well (I thought). So my daughter then grades my test and carefully explains that maybe I might just have a passing grade (6 out of 10). Ok. whatever. That can't be right. So she takes my test to the teacher to have her grade it as well. The teacher's verdict: clearly, easily, a failing grade. Maybe 4 out of 10 marks. Turns out getting the right answer in a clever way counts for nothing. What you are being tested on is: can you reproduce the algorithm we are teaching you in school. As I solved most of the problems in a different manner, I consequently got almost none of the marks. I suppose, that if you know and accept this, then you can accept the result as well. It's disappointing I guess, but certainly it makes math more accessible. I suppose there are pros and cons. Your son wasn't tested on cleverly getting the right answer. The test was: can you reproduce this algorithm. He couldn't.

MattPalmer1086 2y ago
Well, the test did not specify that a particular method should be used. It just asked for the student to calculate the answer and show the working (which he did). He knows the "correct" way of doing it too, and could have done it if instructed to. He has other ridiculous examples, e.g. a question that asked what reason might explain why people were smoking less. He gave a perfectly good answer (better awareness of the risks), it just wasn't the "approved" fact they were looking for. It was somewhat like this when I was at school, but it's much worse now. No thought, even correct answers with working not accepted. Sometimes you just have to guess what the approved fact you are supposed to regurgitate is.
sanderjd 2y ago
I think both things have value, though. Finding the correct answers in creative ways is awesome, of course, and should be encouraged. But it's also good to learn the specific approaches to finding answers that they are specifically teaching. It's just two different things, which are both valuable. For instance, my daughter (kindergarten) has been learning how to do addition and subtraction by "finding tens" and also with fives, and also / relatedly by thinking about hops on a number line, and combining them in different ways. And if she gets the right answer, but without using the technique being taught at that time, then she is redirected back to the intended technique. And I think that makes sense, when teaching a particular technique! I often hear people complain about this style of answering arithmetic questions - "what's wrong with adding up columns and carrying tens?" - and I think they should learn that algorithm too, but I think it's valuable to learn multiple techniques, the techniques themselves that is, in addition to just being able to get the right answers in whatever way you choose.