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I'm genuinely not sure what you're trying to say here. Are you claiming that this was somehow engineered by Altman on purpose to draw attention, because all pu

I'm genuinely not sure what you're trying to say here. Are you claiming that this was somehow engineered by Altman on purpose to draw attention, because all publicity is good publicity? Or engineered by his enemies to throw mud at Altman, because if you throw enough some of it will stick? Occam's Razor argues that Sam simply wanted ScarJo's voice, but couldn't get it, so they came up with a legally probably technically OK but ethically murky clone.

bayindirh 2y ago
> they came up with a legally probably technically OK but ethically murky clone. Isn't what OpenAI does all the time? Do ethically murky things, and when people react, move the goal posts by saying "Well, it's not illegal now, is it?".
flexie 2y ago
It's not a clone. What is ethically murky about it? You want Brad Pitt for your movie. He says no. You hire Benicio Del Toro because of the physical resemblence. Big deal. Having seen "Her" and many other Scarlet Johansson movies, I didn't think for a second that GPT-4o sounded like her. On the contrary, I wondered why they had chosen the voice of a middle aged woman, and whether that was about being woke. It wasn't until social media went hysterical, I realized that the voices were sort of similar.
- column 2y ago
  If it's a sequel and Brad Pitt was in the first movie and you use trickery to make people think he's in the second movie, there's a case. See Crispin Glover, the dad from Back to the future, which was NOT the upside-down dad in BTTF2. They settled for 760k USD.
  - rowanG077 2y ago
    Openai never claimed it was Scarlett Johansson though. They didn't trick anyone.
    - kombookcha 2y ago
      Sam tweeting "Her" is a clear as daylight indication that they are deliberately trying to associate the voice with ScarJo's performance. They're squarely in the zone with knockoff products deliberately aping the branding of the real thing. "Dr Peppy isn't a trick to piggyback on Dr Pepper, it's a legally distinct brand!" might give you enough of a fig leaf in court with a good lawyer, but it's very obvious what kind of company you're running to anybody paying attention.
      - z7 2y ago
        Or he tweeted 'her' to compare his product with the movie AI's conversational abilities. It just depends on how one subjectively interprets a single syllable.
        throwaway115 2y ago
        There are many many many movies with conversational AIs. Why that one?
        sebzim4500 2y ago
        'Her' is clearly the most similar to that demo, even ignoring the fact that they have slightly similar voices. Of the films I've seen anyway.
        kombookcha 2y ago
        That would be a rather weird and boneheaded thing to do, when you've already twice approached said AI's voice actor and been rejected. There are any number of human-sounding movie AI's, but apparently only one whose actor has specifically and repeatedly rejected this association. Does he keep getting into ethical hot water because he's a reckless fool, or because he doesn't really care about ethics at all, despite all the theatre?
        MengerSponge 2y ago
- blitzar 2y ago
  You then tweet out, "look its Brad Pitt in my movie".
  - z7 2y ago
    They never claimed it was Scarlett Johansson's voice though.
    - magic123_ 2y ago
      If the objective is to absolutely always avoid reading between the lines, then yes you're correct.
    - johnbellone 2y ago
      In public, other than Sam’s tweet. Do you think nobody said anything like this in an email or Slack?
- pjc50 2y ago
  > I wondered why they had chosen the voice of a middle aged woman AIs and automated systems, real and fictional, traditionally use women more than men to voice them. Apparently there was some research among all-male bomber crews that this "stood out", the B-58 was issued with some recordings of Joan Elms (https://archive.org/details/b58alertaudio https://archive.org/details/b58alertaudio ) and this was widely copied. (obvious media exception: HAL)
- zemo 2y ago
  > I wondered why they had chosen the voice of a middle aged woman, and whether that was about being woke really weird line of reasoning. Siri, Alexa, Google Home… etc.
throwaway115 2y ago
I would like to think that a normal person, having not been able to hire voice work from a specific well-known actor, and wanting to avoid any image of impropriety, would use a completely different voice instead. Sam isn't dumb, he knew the optics of this choice, but he chose it anyways, and here we all are, talking about OpenAI again.
- taytus 2y ago
  IDK, we were talking about OpenAi regardless. I think this will be a hit on him as a leader. How big? I don't know. It seems to me this is not a brilliant move.
  - prmoustache 2y ago
    Yeah but we were also talking about the competitors.
    - bayindirh 2y ago
      OpenAI is playing the short game by trying to strongarm everyone as fast as they can, which might mean that there might not be a moat their generative AIs choose to emit. Similarly, other companies might be inadvertently playing the long game by forming a better (legal/technical) foundation w.r.t. OpenAI and will silently replace them when they slow down or burn themselves out, because I think that OpenAI is at overdrive, and showing signs of overheating now.
- GolfPopper 2y ago
  "Talking about OpenAI again" yes. But also reinforcing the "too questionable for me to ever willingly use" image I have of Sam, OpenAI, and their projects. Maybe that's just me, and it is a win for them on the whole. Hopefully not.

bayindirh 2y ago

> they came up with a legally probably technically OK but ethically murky clone. Isn't what OpenAI does all the time? Do ethically murky things, and when people react, move the goal posts by saying "Well, it's not illegal now, is it?".

flexie 2y ago

It's not a clone. What is ethically murky about it? You want Brad Pitt for your movie. He says no. You hire Benicio Del Toro because of the physical resemblence. Big deal. Having seen "Her" and many other Scarlet Johansson movies, I didn't think for a second that GPT-4o sounded like her. On the contrary, I wondered why they had chosen the voice of a middle aged woman, and whether that was about being woke. It wasn't until social media went hysterical, I realized that the voices were sort of similar.

column 2y ago
If it's a sequel and Brad Pitt was in the first movie and you use trickery to make people think he's in the second movie, there's a case. See Crispin Glover, the dad from Back to the future, which was NOT the upside-down dad in BTTF2. They settled for 760k USD.
- rowanG077 2y ago
  Openai never claimed it was Scarlett Johansson though. They didn't trick anyone.
  - kombookcha 2y ago
    Sam tweeting "Her" is a clear as daylight indication that they are deliberately trying to associate the voice with ScarJo's performance. They're squarely in the zone with knockoff products deliberately aping the branding of the real thing. "Dr Peppy isn't a trick to piggyback on Dr Pepper, it's a legally distinct brand!" might give you enough of a fig leaf in court with a good lawyer, but it's very obvious what kind of company you're running to anybody paying attention.
    - z7 2y ago
      Or he tweeted 'her' to compare his product with the movie AI's conversational abilities. It just depends on how one subjectively interprets a single syllable.
      - throwaway115 2y ago
        There are many many many movies with conversational AIs. Why that one?
        sebzim4500 2y ago
        'Her' is clearly the most similar to that demo, even ignoring the fact that they have slightly similar voices. Of the films I've seen anyway.
      - kombookcha 2y ago
        That would be a rather weird and boneheaded thing to do, when you've already twice approached said AI's voice actor and been rejected. There are any number of human-sounding movie AI's, but apparently only one whose actor has specifically and repeatedly rejected this association. Does he keep getting into ethical hot water because he's a reckless fool, or because he doesn't really care about ethics at all, despite all the theatre?
        MengerSponge 2y ago
blitzar 2y ago
You then tweet out, "look its Brad Pitt in my movie".
- z7 2y ago
  They never claimed it was Scarlett Johansson's voice though.
  - magic123_ 2y ago
    If the objective is to absolutely always avoid reading between the lines, then yes you're correct.
  - johnbellone 2y ago
    In public, other than Sam’s tweet. Do you think nobody said anything like this in an email or Slack?
pjc50 2y ago
> I wondered why they had chosen the voice of a middle aged woman AIs and automated systems, real and fictional, traditionally use women more than men to voice them. Apparently there was some research among all-male bomber crews that this "stood out", the B-58 was issued with some recordings of Joan Elms (https://archive.org/details/b58alertaudio https://archive.org/details/b58alertaudio ) and this was widely copied. (obvious media exception: HAL)
zemo 2y ago
> I wondered why they had chosen the voice of a middle aged woman, and whether that was about being woke really weird line of reasoning. Siri, Alexa, Google Home… etc.

throwaway115 2y ago

I would like to think that a normal person, having not been able to hire voice work from a specific well-known actor, and wanting to avoid any image of impropriety, would use a completely different voice instead. Sam isn't dumb, he knew the optics of this choice, but he chose it anyways, and here we all are, talking about OpenAI again.

taytus 2y ago
IDK, we were talking about OpenAi regardless. I think this will be a hit on him as a leader. How big? I don't know. It seems to me this is not a brilliant move.
- prmoustache 2y ago
  Yeah but we were also talking about the competitors.
  - bayindirh 2y ago
    OpenAI is playing the short game by trying to strongarm everyone as fast as they can, which might mean that there might not be a moat their generative AIs choose to emit. Similarly, other companies might be inadvertently playing the long game by forming a better (legal/technical) foundation w.r.t. OpenAI and will silently replace them when they slow down or burn themselves out, because I think that OpenAI is at overdrive, and showing signs of overheating now.
GolfPopper 2y ago
"Talking about OpenAI again" yes. But also reinforcing the "too questionable for me to ever willingly use" image I have of Sam, OpenAI, and their projects. Maybe that's just me, and it is a win for them on the whole. Hopefully not.