4 ms·

> Right to roam works in places with no or a very small degenerate population like the Nordics. ...What? How exactly do you go about quantifying a country's "d

> Right to roam works in places with no or a very small degenerate population like the Nordics. ...What? How exactly do you go about quantifying a country's "degenerate" population percentage?

trgn 2y ago
You don't. You know it when you see it. Requires high trust, broad distribution of prosocial behaviors.
throwaway22032 2y ago
You go there and you see it. For example - drug addicts wandering about in San Diego, tents cropping up everywhere, crazies shouting outside of Finsbury Park tube station, "travellers" fly tipping in the UK. The remote parts of Sweden and Finland don't have these issues. Maybe a few kids doing donuts in the car park after hours because they're bored. That's it.
- iamthirsty 2y ago
  I'm born and raised in LA, so I have an extremely good understanding of what you're referring to. But there are so many other factors besides just labeling people as degenerates. For example, Sweden, a very highly developed economy, only has to support less than 11 million people. That's about half of just the state of Florida's 22m. NYC alone almost has as many people as some of the countries being referred to. They also have different laws, social structures, mental health facilities, completely different penal system, socialized healthcare — I could go on. I don't think you can truly qualify people as simply "degenerates" when there are so many other factors. For example, Switzerland had a major crime and drug epidemic in 1999, and opened centers in 2000 to assist with those issues — and homelessness encampments and crime effectively disappeared. Again — it's not always that people are innately shitty, but the system around them allowing that option. I'm sure if you packed people in Sweden, let immigration skyrocket, and take away all the socialized benefits you'd see real fast the "degenerate" population grow.
  - s1artibartfast 2y ago
    I dont think they were commenting on the cause of what they refer to as "degenerates". They just made the statement that a society without them is a prerequisite for these types of laws. I think it is true, but perhaps so obvious that it doesnt need to be said.

> Right to roam works in places with no or a very small degenerate population like the Nordics. ...What? How exactly do you go about quantifying a country's "degenerate" population percentage?

trgn 2y ago

You don't. You know it when you see it. Requires high trust, broad distribution of prosocial behaviors.

throwaway22032 2y ago

You go there and you see it. For example - drug addicts wandering about in San Diego, tents cropping up everywhere, crazies shouting outside of Finsbury Park tube station, "travellers" fly tipping in the UK. The remote parts of Sweden and Finland don't have these issues. Maybe a few kids doing donuts in the car park after hours because they're bored. That's it.

iamthirsty 2y ago
I'm born and raised in LA, so I have an extremely good understanding of what you're referring to. But there are so many other factors besides just labeling people as degenerates. For example, Sweden, a very highly developed economy, only has to support less than 11 million people. That's about half of just the state of Florida's 22m. NYC alone almost has as many people as some of the countries being referred to. They also have different laws, social structures, mental health facilities, completely different penal system, socialized healthcare — I could go on. I don't think you can truly qualify people as simply "degenerates" when there are so many other factors. For example, Switzerland had a major crime and drug epidemic in 1999, and opened centers in 2000 to assist with those issues — and homelessness encampments and crime effectively disappeared. Again — it's not always that people are innately shitty, but the system around them allowing that option. I'm sure if you packed people in Sweden, let immigration skyrocket, and take away all the socialized benefits you'd see real fast the "degenerate" population grow.
- s1artibartfast 2y ago
  I dont think they were commenting on the cause of what they refer to as "degenerates". They just made the statement that a society without them is a prerequisite for these types of laws. I think it is true, but perhaps so obvious that it doesnt need to be said.